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Author Topic: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?  (Read 44498 times)

islander

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #240 on: February 21, 2011, 08:45:20 AM »
Please know the difference between prophets and biblical passage sharing.

yes, you should.  after all, do we not know that even the devil can quote the bible?  and who was that who "predicted" that angelo reyes's soul is suffering the fires of eternal damnation?  i thought it was a prophesy, if not a divine judgment. :-\

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Lorenzo

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #241 on: February 21, 2011, 08:46:45 AM »
yes, you should.  after all, do we not know that even the devil can quote the bible?  and who was that who "predicted" that angelo reyes's soul is suffering the fires of eternal damnation?  i thought it was a prophesy, if not a divine judgment. :-\

but it says directly in revelations and 1 corinthians chapter 3 verse 7 and 8! i am not prophesying , but quoting and directly sourcing from the Holy Bible. Word for Word!

Oh, isles.... ::)

Do you question the Word of God? Are you saying that the Word of God is flawed?


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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #242 on: February 21, 2011, 09:00:22 AM »
"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles? So, every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit. A sound tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will know them by their fruits. Not every one who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven. On that day many will say to Me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and do many mighty works in Your Name?' And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you evildoers.'" (Matthew 7:15-23 RSV)

Hmm. Basin di na ron mailhan kay lahi na ang mga mananap nga nalambigit...  ;D

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #243 on: February 21, 2011, 09:03:12 AM »
Naglibog na jud ning irihes nga Botoy. Kabahin sa suicide, sayop diay ang stand sa Simbahan karon?  ???

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #244 on: February 21, 2011, 09:08:31 AM »
yes, you should.  after all, do we not know that even the devil can quote the bible?  and who was that who "predicted" that angelo reyes's soul is suffering the fires of eternal damnation?  i thought it was a prophesy, if not a divine judgment. :-\

Spoken ex latrina lagi...  ;D



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islander

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #245 on: February 21, 2011, 09:20:01 AM »
but it says directly in revelations and 1 corinthians chapter 3 verse 7 and 8! i am not prophesying , but quoting and directly sourcing from the Holy Bible. Word for Word!

Oh, isles.... ::)

Do you question the Word of God? Are you saying that the Word of God is flawed?


oh, lorenzo, do you not see that it is more on how you select and use biblical passages to suit your personal opinion?  this is what i meant by cross-referencing and refraining from being literal in your understanding.  you pick out passages from the old testament without considering how these are fulfilled in the new testament and without sparing even a thought to “The God of the Old Testament is a God of wrath while the God of the New Testament is a God of love,” for one, so long as the passage, literally, supports your claim of perdition to suicides, which is how this thread had gone after your "divine judgment" on angelo reyes (when the thread was only about whether his dying was honorable or not, sans divine judgment on whether he's in hell or not).  

no, no, i dare not question the word of god; never did, never will.  do you not see that i'm questioning you?  is there no difference now between you and god? :o ::)

HENCEFORTH, READ THE JERUSALEM BIBLE.  MOST IMPORTANT, READ THE DETAILED FOOTNOTES THERE, INCLUDING THE HISTORICAL AND CULTURAL UNDERPINNINGS OF PASSAGES AND ACCOUNTS.  this particular version of the bible is a catholic biblical scholar's best friend.  (i hope fr chic agrees with the priest who had told me this and who gave me this bible eons ago. :D)  your understanding and discernment, if you may, will change enough for you to have second thoughts about what passages to post here because, heavens, there is more to the words in the bible than meets the eye.

 




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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #246 on: February 21, 2011, 09:21:20 AM »
ANNOUNCEMENT:

Dunay gipaabot deris taas si Santino ug Inday Luci nga ipasara daw karyo - temporarily ra god - ang impyerno kay maghimo pa daw silag dugang cubicles didto para sa mga naghikog. Nakabati daw sila sa panaglantugi sa Tubag Bohol nga madugangan sila didto... no vacancy pa daw karon. Kinsa tong naghikog from 1988 - present, dili pa pwede dawaton didto kay medyo taas2x pa daw backlog. Lupig pay backlog sa U.S. immigration bwahahahaha  8) 8) 8)

Matud pa ni Inday Luci, sa nakasabot lang.....  ;D ;D

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islander

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #247 on: February 21, 2011, 09:30:35 AM »
kabaw ba ani, hahahahaha!  nagtuo tingali si inday luci nga di ko ka-afford sa rent ug wa koy visa. ;D



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Lorenzo

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #248 on: February 21, 2011, 09:32:54 AM »
ANNOUNCEMENT:

Dunay gipaabot deris taas si Santino ug Inday Luci nga ipasara daw karyo - temporarily ra god - ang impyerno kay maghimo pa daw silag dugang cubicles didto para sa mga naghikog. Nakabati daw sila sa panaglantugi sa Tubag Bohol nga madugangan sila didto... no vacancy pa daw karon. Kinsa tong naghikog from 1988 - present, dili pa pwede dawaton didto kay medyo taas2x pa daw backlog. Lupig pay backlog sa U.S. immigration bwahahahaha  8) 8) 8)

Matud pa ni Inday Luci, sa nakasabot lang.....  ;D ;D

i love how Fr. Roel is able to make all of us laugh even in this quite very beautiful discussion. always, jud ko mo smile nimo , Fr.

sige, i will now rest my case.

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Lorenzo

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #249 on: February 21, 2011, 09:36:10 AM »
kabaw ba ani, hahahahaha!  nagtuo tingali si inday luci nga di ko ka-afford sa rent ug wa koy visa. ;D



hala, na unsaon man ug wa kay visa?

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Lorenzo

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #250 on: February 21, 2011, 09:38:55 AM »
oh, lorenzo, do you not see that it is more on how you select and use biblical passages to suit your personal opinion?  this is what i meant by cross-referencing and refraining from being literal in your understanding.  you pick out passages from the old testament without considering how these are fulfilled in the new testament and without sparing even a thought to “The God of the Old Testament is a God of wrath while the God of the New Testament is a God of love,” for one, so long as the passage, literally, supports your claim of perdition to suicides, which is how this thread had gone after your "divine judgment" on angelo reyes (when the thread was only about whether his dying was honorable or not, sans divine judgment on whether he's in hell or not).  

no, no, i dare not question the word of god; never did, never will.  do you not see that i'm questioning you?  is there no difference now between you and god? :o ::)

HENCEFORTH, READ THE JERUSALEM BIBLE.  MOST IMPORTANT, READ THE DETAILED FOOTNOTES THERE, INCLUDING THE HISTORICAL AND CULTURAL UNDERPINNINGS OF PASSAGES AND ACCOUNTS.  this particular version of the bible is a catholic biblical scholar's best friend.  (i hope fr chic agrees with the priest who had told me this and who gave me this bible eons ago. :D)  your understanding and discernment, if you may, will change enough for you to have second thoughts about what passages to post here because, heavens, there is more to the words in the bible than meets the eye.

 




i think you , youself, need to discern, my dear isles. As far as i know, and as any good bible-reading Catholic , Christian knows, is that Corinthians is not old testament, but new testament. The book of Revelations is not old testament, but New Testament. Neither is 1st John Old Testament but New Testament.

It appears to me that you need to do some more reading yourself. A bit more, sister.  :)

God Bless you!

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #251 on: February 21, 2011, 09:45:02 AM »
ANNOUNCEMENT:

Dunay gipaabot deris taas si Santino ug Inday Luci nga ipasara daw karyo - temporarily ra god - ang impyerno kay maghimo pa daw silag dugang cubicles didto para sa mga naghikog. Nakabati daw sila sa panaglantugi sa Tubag Bohol nga madugangan sila didto... no vacancy pa daw karon. Kinsa tong naghikog from 1988 - present, dili pa pwede dawaton didto kay medyo taas2x pa daw backlog. Lupig pay backlog sa U.S. immigration bwahahahaha  8) 8) 8)

Matud pa ni Inday Luci, sa nakasabot lang.....  ;D ;D

Hmm. Kinsa kaha nis Inday Luci. Gi-short-cut man gud. First name ba kaha ni, or what...  ::)



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #252 on: February 21, 2011, 10:23:19 AM »
Hmm. Kinsa kaha nis Inday Luci. Gi-short-cut man gud. First name ba kaha ni, or what...  ::)



 bai H.B. naa diay babaye nga LUCIfer? kai Inday man? hehehe, JAWK ra baya ni mga Inday :D

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #253 on: February 21, 2011, 10:23:37 AM »
Written by: Intellectualclash of wordpress.com
http://justinspeaks.wordpress.com/2011/02/16/reminiscing-suicide-judas-iscariot-adolf-hitler-and-angelo-reyes/


Reminiscing suicide: Judas Iscariot, Adolf Hitler and Angelo Reyes


On February 8, 2011, Former Sec. Angelo Reyes committed suicide infront of her mother’s tomb. A shot in the chest that went straight to his heart took his life. At the same time, the foul-smelling dead fish of corruption in the AFP has been spreading like wild fire in the forest. Reyes was in question for allegedly receiving government money during his stay in his Defense Chief post or maybe before that as a military officer. He was a general and alumnus of PMA.

When he died, sympathy flooded the country. Various officials say that he was a loss and that he gave a lot of contributions to the nation. Some also said that he was a victim of trial by publicity and he was framed up. Some critics have become sympathizers after lambasting Reyes as corrupt. Many said that what he did was a supreme sacrifice and honorable thing. And so he was laid to the Libingan ng mga Bayani (Heroes’ Cemetery).

After the incident I asked: What makes somebody who committed suicide a hero? The heroes in the country were killed in war or executed because of martyrdom although I know that the definition of heroism doesn’t only require those kinds of deaths. The government currently says that OFW’s are the new breed of heroes. There are also heroes who saved lives of other people but still are able to save themselves from getting killed.

There’s one character I know who is considered a hero after committing a suicide. It’s the fictional character Harry Stamper (Bruce Willis) from the movie Armageddon. He detonated the bomb, sacrificing his life, so that the asteriod will be cut into two and won’t hit the earth. But it was just a movie with all the exactness of events that came up with all the people cheering after.

I know that heroism comes with a price and I know that it takes a brave and courageous man to do become a hero. But heroes who dedicated their lives have an ultimate goal: to help and to serve others or for the greater good/glory. As I watched several close people, colleagues of Angelo Reyes who were giving speech about what he has done to the country, it can really be concluded that he has given his life for public service. He has dedicated himself in the military to the different offices opened by Presidential Decrees and different cabinet posts as well. There’s really no doubt to such service to the public. But committing suicide, what a sad end to a good life. I really believe it is NEVER an honorable thing to do such act in the midst of a controversy involving your own name.

It’s not a supreme sacrifice. How can it be a sacrifice when there’s an anomaly and you refuse to face it? How can it be honorable when you know the truth and you can’t say it? If Reyes were innocent, the hell what other people will think. It doesn’t matter. You SAY you are innocent. The world posits to be prejudicial. When Hubert Webb was sentenced to life imprisonment, he didn’t care what others say. He was firm in saying he’s innocent until he was freed.

Maybe Reyes has done good in the public. Maybe he has also done something bad as well. Well that’s part of the definition of a human being – vulnerable, imperfect and prone to sins. But shutting up and not telling the truth, it’s also the same as lying. Instead of making the issues clearer, the suicide raised more questions regarding AFP’s corruption. I’ve heard Teresita Ang-See who vouched for Reyes’ undoubted public service in Anti-Kidnapping and such. She said that it is impossible for Reyes to steal the money because of his ‘good’ background. But you have to think that we are humans. We also commit mistakes. That’s inevitable.

When I heard that Reyes committed suicide, the only thing that came out of my head was- GUILTY. In one of TV Patrol’s episodes, Reyes cannot answer straight to Korina’s questions regarding his involvement in the AFP corruption. His answers were short and vague like, “Wala akong kinalaman dyan.” (I have nothing to do with it.) He cannot further elaborate his findings and whereabouts during that time. In the same episode, Sen. Miriam Defensor Santiago called him “gago” (stupid) for saying that he has nothing to do with the corruption issue. And I think, the blunt senator has a point. You are the Defense Chief (like a president) and the Comptroller (treasurer) has been stealing the money and keeping it for the higher officials and their wives. It’s very impossible for the Chief to miss out findings of loss budget (say, hundred of millions of allocated budget) and just say “Hindi ko alam ang mga ‘yan.” (I don’t know about it.)   The senator was right in calling him stupid in that sense because Filipinos are not stupid when he said that.

Now there are a lot of mourners. And there are also a lot who pity Reyes. It’s part of the Filipino culture to sympathize and FORGET about the bigger picture. But again I say, Reyes’ death is not a supreme sacrifice.

Last January, in my pay slip, P8,000 of my salary went to tax for the government. And I’m going to pay my tax for the next years of my life. I’m only one of the millions of Filipinos who work hard to earn money for a living and to support a family. Instead of having the whole money to have a little more for budgeting my daily life, it goes to the government which we expect to do its role in the society. That’s why I think the Filipinos have the right to question the credibility of the government and to question where the hell do our taxes go.

It’s not only an issue about money and life of a General. It’s an issue of principle and transparency. The issue started from some sort of “Mock Battle of Manila” in the Ombudsman after a shitty plea bargaining agreement with a corrupt comptroller. We are getting to the bottom of the issue and it shouldn’t stop. Penalize all those involved and remove the medals that they don’t deserve. While the soldiers don’t have the right gear and uniform for their war and old weapons and few bullets at hand, these Generals are enjoying the people’s money by buying expensive houses and luxurious cars. Where in the world are the consciences and souls of these people? My friend Eddie said, these people are so greedy they stole money too much for their lifetime. How greedy. Now, is that something honorable? And now the truth is being covered up? Wake up!

As I was reflecting, I realized that Reyes’ suicide was very similar to what Adolf Hitler did when he was about to lose. Both of them were honorable in their respected positions although Reyes didn’t intend to kill millions of Jews. But instead of facing the truth, they chickened out and killed themselves after committing mistakes they didn’t want to correct.

When I had my GREATWK, we studied a boring “Great Work” of Emile Durkheim, the book “SUICIDE.” We discussed the different kinds of suicide for 1/3 of the trimester (how boring!). Anyway, a lot of Reyes’ supporters think that what he did was ALTRUISTIC SUICIDE. This suicide happens when an individual is expected to kill himself on behalf of the society like soldier in a military service. But I beg to differ. I’d rather consider it FATALISTIC SUICIDE. This suicide happens when a person prefers to die than to live within his society like preferring to die rather to be in prison with constant abuse which prohibits him from pursuing his desires.

I would want Sec. Angelo Reyes to rest in peace. Death of person makes people especially loved ones sad. But I think there are lot of barriers to be in peace. Here are some of my realizations:

1. Angelo Reyes’ death will not make any change in the corrupt government. It’s another one wasted life. He’s a victim of corruption that ate him.

2. What he did was a selfish move. He only thought of himself and forgot about God’s love, his family, his friends and the whole Philippine nation waiting for the truth.

3. His suicide might have been triggered by guilt, like what Judas did after betraying Jesus (like him betraying the country) although both of them have served their masters.

4. Good educational background doesn’t make you a morally upright person. Harvard diploma doesn’t give it. Grades are just numbers. Values come from the person. It comes from within.

5. Heroes don’t kill themselves in the middle of a fight or hide from the truth.

6. And lastly, as what I’ve learned in TREDONE with Dr. Arnold Monera, suicide is a one way ticket to hell.


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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #254 on: February 21, 2011, 10:55:48 AM »
bai H.B. naa diay babaye nga LUCIfer? kai Inday man? hehehe, JAWK ra baya ni mga Inday :D

Lalaki ni siya pero medyo bayen-on lang...  :-X

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #255 on: February 21, 2011, 02:40:16 PM »
Written by: Intellectualclash of wordpress.com
http://justinspeaks.wordpress.com/2011/02/16/reminiscing-suicide-judas-iscariot-adolf-hitler-and-angelo-reyes/

Reminiscing suicide: Judas Iscariot, Adolf Hitler and Angelo Reyes


just one more opinion of a writer who isn't much to begin with (considering his use of hackneyed expressions like 'foul-smelling dead fish' and 'spreading like wild fire in the forest') and one who seems better at not feeling uncomfortable in his condemnation.

When he died, sympathy flooded the country.

of course, filipinos are a forgiving people.

After the incident I asked: What makes somebody who committed suicide a hero? The heroes in the country were killed in war or executed because of martyrdom although I know that the definition of heroism doesn’t only require those kinds of deaths. The government currently says that OFW’s are the new breed of heroes. There are also heroes who saved lives of other people but still are able to save themselves from getting killed.

who can say?  heroes come in different forms.  why, even some super heroes have their own reasons for wearing their briefs outside for all to see, like superman and batman.  and yes, when the idea of ofws as heroes was first brought forth, many had initially scoffed.  these days, it's a given.  today's heel could be tomorrow's hero and vice versa.

it could be that there are heroes who choose to die and bring their own secrets to the grave rather than start singing like a parrot, naming names and bringing an institution and the whole country down with them.  there could be heroes who might have visions of bloodshed and unexplained assassinations because a military institution has been pushed to the wall for some corruption that is not really limited to such institution alone but is rather all-pervading, the investigating legislators allegedly included.  the possibilities for heroism are endless, being eaten by a lion in the old days that raised heroism a notch and being called martyrdom notwithstanding.

when legislators truly come up with laws as a result of the investigation (too many televised investigations in the past resulted to nothing, as one study shows), laws that cover themselves as well, then reyes shall not have killed himself in vain.

(at their perch, these legislative investigators--always in aid of legislation, they say--have not even touched what is enshrined in the constitution about political dynasties in which they are players.  they haven't come up with a single enabling law on this, which begs the question of who investigates the legislative investigators?)      

6. And lastly, as what I’ve learned in TREDONE with Dr. Arnold Monera, suicide is a one way ticket to hell.

"Christian attitudes to suicide : In the past, the Church taught that suicide was a serious sin; suicides were not allowed a Christian funeral, or buried in holy ground. Survivors were severely punished. They believed it showed a deliberate rejection of God’s gift of life.

Today, the Church has changed. Much more is known about depression, stress, grief and other causes of suicide. Instead of condemning victims, the Church tries to understand, and support the relatives. Most Christians believe it is wrong to commit suicide, but understand why people try it. The right response to suicide is to be loving and forgiving. People should be helped, not condemned."

http://www.rsrevision.com/GCSE/shortcourse/medicalethics/suicide.htm



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #256 on: February 21, 2011, 02:46:27 PM »
"Christian attitudes to suicide : In the past, the Church taught that suicide was a serious sin; suicides were not allowed a Christian funeral, or buried in holy ground. Survivors were severely punished. They believed it showed a deliberate rejection of God’s gift of life.

Today, the Church has changed. Much more is known about depression, stress, grief and other causes of suicide. Instead of condemning victims, the Church tries to understand, and support the relatives. Most Christians believe it is wrong to commit suicide, but understand why people try it. The right response to suicide is to be loving and forgiving. People should be helped, not condemned."

http://www.rsrevision.com/GCSE/shortcourse/medicalethics/suicide.htm

Ang nakaparat kay buhi pa si Torpemada, este, Torquemada...  :P

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islander

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #257 on: February 21, 2011, 03:02:52 PM »
i think you , youself, need to discern, my dear isles. As far as i know, and as any good bible-reading Catholic , Christian knows, is that Corinthians is not old testament, but new testament. The book of Revelations is not old testament, but New Testament. Neither is 1st John Old Testament but New Testament.

It appears to me that you need to do some more reading yourself. A bit more, sister.  :)

God Bless you!

incidentally, i am not referring to your biblical posts in this thread alone but in all your posts in this whole planet of tb. ;D  
(please, brother, i may not be as knowledgeable as you are about the bible, but if memory serves me right i may not be that ignorant either as i took a special class on this in college for one whole semester, having graduated from an exclusive catholic school for girls.  i was picked out with one other student [yes, the special class had only two students].  knowing how our discussions went, please don't blame me if i regard you as a plebe when it comes to the bible.  i can, of course, tolerate your grandiloquence, which is usually a product of little knowledge.)
 
god bless you too.





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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #258 on: February 21, 2011, 03:18:05 PM »
hala, na unsaon man ug wa kay visa?

no problem.  as long as i don't look like you (bearded and all), i'm sure i won't be mistaken for a terrorist. ;D(jawk!)  at least, you're a handsome one who will go straight to paradise.  ;D(jawk!)

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #259 on: February 21, 2011, 03:21:15 PM »
ANNOUNCEMENT:

Dunay gipaabot deris taas si Santino ug Inday Luci nga ipasara daw karyo - temporarily ra god - ang impyerno kay maghimo pa daw silag dugang cubicles didto para sa mga naghikog. Nakabati daw sila sa panaglantugi sa Tubag Bohol nga madugangan sila didto... no vacancy pa daw karon. Kinsa tong naghikog from 1988 - present, dili pa pwede dawaton didto kay medyo taas2x pa daw backlog. Lupig pay backlog sa U.S. immigration bwahahahaha  8) 8) 8)

Matud pa ni Inday Luci, sa nakasabot lang.....  ;D ;D

ganahan lagi ko fr chic nga si lorenz si santino ug ako si inday luci. ;D :-X



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #260 on: February 21, 2011, 03:29:10 PM »
i can, of course, tolerate your grandiloquence, which is usually a product of little knowledge.

Hmm... Reminds me of a couple of couplets (he he) from Alexander Pope:

A little learning is a dang'rous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring.

Words are like leaves and where they most abound,
Much fruit of sense beneath is rarely found.

 :-X



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #261 on: February 21, 2011, 10:19:00 PM »
incidentally, i am not referring to your biblical posts in this thread alone but in all your posts in this whole planet of tb. ;D 
(please, brother, i may not be as knowledgeable as you are about the bible, but if memory serves me right i may not be that ignorant either as i took a special class on this in college for one whole semester, having graduated from an exclusive catholic school for girls.  i was picked out with one other student [yes, the special class had only two students].  knowing how our discussions went, please don't blame me if i regard you as a plebe when it comes to the bible.  i can, of course, tolerate your grandiloquence, which is usually a product of little knowledge.)
 
god bless you too.





Thank you for sharing your most illustrious career in biblical study. Unbeknownst to you, my little dear, is that I attended a prestigious private college in the United States. In my stay as a Molecular Biology & European History double major (while under the competitive pre-medical track), i managed to minor in religious studies. I studied the Q'uran for 2 whole semesters, 1 semester on Intensive Middle Eastern History, as well as 1 Semester on Christian Historiography, 1 semester on comparative religious text (bible, tanakh, and the q'uran), let alone was an active member on our Collegiate Catholic Newman's Society (a collegiate body that focused on catholic study, as well as intensive biblical study).

I may be a 'plebe', but I dare say, you should watch your mouth in your comparatives, little lady.

I was also humbly selected as a Collegiate Trustees Scholar (through my humble knowledge in things, was awarded a scholarship of over $35,000 + an additional $ 75,000;  then selected as one of 15 students out of a list of 500 to attend a study abroad program in the Ukraine..which was based on one's GPA and academic standing). But of course, a person of little knowledge like me cannot compare, dare i even blink, to the likes of you....

 ::)



PS. You still managed to mix up old testament from new testament. As per you last post. So , I suggest you re-read your bible.
Afterall, just because one 'read' a book some eons back,does not necessarily mean he/she retains it all after a period of lack of study.


A humble below-average student.,



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Lorenzo

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #262 on: February 21, 2011, 10:35:30 PM »
just one more opinion of a writer who isn't much to begin with (considering his use of hackneyed expressions like 'foul-smelling dead fish' and 'spreading like wild fire in the forest') and one who seems better at not feeling uncomfortable in his condemnation.

of course, filipinos are a forgiving people.

who can say?  heroes come in different forms.  why, even some super heroes have their own reasons for wearing their briefs outside for all to see, like superman and batman.  and yes, when the idea of ofws as heroes was first brought forth, many had initially scoffed.  these days, it's a given.  today's heel could be tomorrow's hero and vice versa.

it could be that there are heroes who choose to die and bring their own secrets to the grave rather than start singing like a parrot, naming names and bringing an institution and the whole country down with them.  there could be heroes who might have visions of bloodshed and unexplained assassinations because a military institution has been pushed to the wall for some corruption that is not really limited to such institution alone but is rather all-pervading, the investigating legislators allegedly included.  the possibilities for heroism are endless, being eaten by a lion in the old days that raised heroism a notch and being called martyrdom notwithstanding.

when legislators truly come up with laws as a result of the investigation (too many televised investigations in the past resulted to nothing, as one study shows), laws that cover themselves as well, then reyes shall not have killed himself in vain.

(at their perch, these legislative investigators--always in aid of legislation, they say--have not even touched what is enshrined in the constitution about political dynasties in which they are players.  they haven't come up with a single enabling law on this, which begs the question of who investigates the legislative investigators?)      





How arrogant of you. To criticize the writer's writing ability, instead of understanding his point of view and body of material that was laid to bare. You are interesting, isles, you claim to want a new philippines, devoid of corruption, but at the moment of one corrupt former military man's death (suicide), you have lost the spark of credibility, and have become a defender. His death does not pardon his crimes, no , no. His death and the reaction of some people to his death indicates how quick people are to forget the crimes. legislative investigators still need to pry open the story and truth from his situation.

in the progression towards a more responsible government , and a better functioning democracy, investigators must refrain from detractive tendencies of the emotional outburst of the times. it must remain unhindered in the pursuit of justice.

reyes' death was his own choosing. his estate and his perpetrators must and should answer to the law. no one is above the law. not even the dead.

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #263 on: February 22, 2011, 12:07:05 AM »
A beautiful article by James Cordova

http://asiancorrespondent.com/48008/angelo-reyes-filipinos-should-stop-burying-the-sins-of-the-corrupt/


Angelo Reyes: Filipinos should stop burying the sins of the corrupt


he picture below, taken by NPPA Images, tragically represents the tragedy that is Angelo Reyes. It shows the tombstone on the grave of Purificacion Reyes, Angelo’s mother, smeared with her son’s blood after he shot himself in the hear



How can a family recover from something like this?

Days before he committed suicide, Reyes pleaded to the public not to drag his family into the corruption scandal that is rocking the Philippine military. But his suicide, as far as I’m concerned, settled the question on whether he was guilty of receiving millions of pesos from a payola taken from kickbacks and other corrupt practices in the military.

Spare his family? Didn’t Reyes  think of them before he pocketed those millions? Didn’t his family, particularly his wife, think of their good name and Purificacion before they spent those monies and lived allegedly luxurious lives?

We Filipinos are a forgiving people —  forgiving to a fault. We sweep problems like this under the rug when somebody as important as Reyes dies. Do not speak ill of the dead. The dead, no matter what they did in life, deserve respect.

I agree. But this culture of forgiveness, of burying our sense of justice along with the corrupt departed, is what makes our country such as sorry place. Remember the death of the dictator Ferdinand Marcos? When he died, not a few Filipinos said we should forget what he did and try to move on. Well, newsflash! We tried to move on but we have never moved on. The reason for that is because we lack the proper sense of outrage and even the moral sense to correct the wrongs done to us as a people.

This is not to disrespect the family of Angelo Reyes, let alone his mother. But before they demand  respect  from the public, they ought to show it to the public first.

Death, no matter how dramatic and tragic, should never be used as an occasion to forget a misdeed. Filipinos have done that quite often and look where we are now.

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #264 on: February 22, 2011, 12:08:38 AM »
Ramon responds:
http://asiancorrespondent.com/48008/angelo-reyes-filipinos-should-stop-burying-the-sins-of-the-corrupt/


Yes people think his death is an admission of guilt for obvious reasons. He sure as hell doesn't have anything to be depressed about. He was a part of EDSA 2 he helped the people overthrow a president, then kills himself when people start calling him corrupt with backing evidence. What's that smell? Corruption cooking.

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #265 on: February 22, 2011, 12:26:26 AM »
This is an interview of Reyes days prior his suicide.

In a clinical observation, the man shows no altered mental status, no brief manic or psychotic symptomology whatsoever.

On the contrary, he seems to be perfectly normal and in right state of mind. He answers questions with no supposed loss of reality.

Nor does he show flat effect (a side effect of anti-depression drugs, anti-psychotic, anti-schizophrenic drugs). hmmmm...

GENERAL ANGELO REYES



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #266 on: February 22, 2011, 12:38:12 AM »
Thank you for sharing your most illustrious career in biblical study. Unbeknownst to you, my little dear, is that I attended a prestigious private college in the United States. In my stay as a Molecular Biology & European History double major (while under the competitive pre-medical track), i managed to minor in religious studies. I studied the Q'uran for 2 whole semesters, 1 semester on Intensive Middle Eastern History, as well as 1 Semester on Christian Historiography, 1 semester on comparative religious text (bible, tanakh, and the q'uran), let alone was an active member on our Collegiate Catholic Newman's Society (a collegiate body that focused on catholic study, as well as intensive biblical study).

I may be a 'plebe', but I dare say, you should watch your mouth in your comparatives, little lady.

you must mean comparisons, big man.

so now you think, and act, as if such studies made your discernment any better?  why, you’re even far from writing down your thoughts well, dahlin’.  but then it’s probably just a simple case of biting off more than you could chew;  no different from a sufferer of mental indigestion, really.  picking you out as a scholar must have been a tragic mistake.  i never believed in the so-called dumbing of america.  now I’m almost tempted to change my mind, thanks to you.   

I was also humbly selected as a Collegiate Trustees Scholar (through my humble knowledge in things, was awarded a scholarship of over $35,000 + an additional $ 75,000;  then selected as one of 15 students out of a list of 500 to attend a study abroad program in the Ukraine..which was based on one's GPA and academic standing). But of course, a person of little knowledge like me cannot compare, dare i even blink, to the likes of you....

 ::)

you mean, the ones who selected you were humble when they should have been proud to pick such an illustrious scholar? ;D

but then you must have meant your own humility, and no matter how false, such claims make me wish to end my own life just so i’d be privileged to be consigned by you to the eternal flames of damnation.  ukraine, whew!  i’m shaking in my boots.

after your curriculum vitae presentation, i daresay you now qualify as a call center agent in cebu. 

PS. You still managed to mix up old testament from new testament. As per you last post. So , I suggest you re-read your bible.
Afterall, just because one 'read' a book some eons back,does not necessarily mean he/she retains it all after a period of lack of study.

A humble below-average student.,


you mean they do make scholars out of below-average students like you?

well, if you insist, and if it makes you feel any better, dear humble below-average servant who has taken it upon himself to condemn people to perdition, so be it, because i don’t even have the ability to open the bible and i’m too imbecile to know what books comprise the old and the new testament nor do i have the energy such as you have to cut and paste bible passages from the internet. 

let it be said that i truly appreciate your humility as you condemn a suicide to hell, the kind of humility that’s quite in keeping with your revelation that your father had saved millions and calling a grandfather’s farm lot a hacienda in some other threads. 

i suggest you cease and desist from sounding like a religious scholar of sanctimonious proportions because you only end up convincing no one.   


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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #267 on: February 22, 2011, 12:52:20 AM »
It shows to tell you, "dahlin" that both of us are able to talk about biblical passages concerning that part of the discussion. My inference of my education (as minimal as it is) shows to tell you that you going to a private catholic school (arent' most schools in the philippines, catholic?) does not make you higher than i, especially in regards to discussing about biblical verses.

Still, that does not  efface the fact that you erroneously mistook Revelations, 1 Corinthians, and 1 John as old testament since i strictly made reference to new testament verses.

that said,  i would suggest you realign your own readings and to re-read the bible before you start lecturing on who is qualified or unqualified to read and share words from Holy Scripture. Unless you are biblical theologian (with a Ph.D in divinity) then you are not in the position to tell me if i am able or not able to share my own inference, which directly supports my points that i have continuously supported through this discussion.



Oh, na, not so harsh diba?

;)




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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #268 on: February 22, 2011, 12:56:26 AM »
A beautiful article by James Cordova

http://asiancorrespondent.com/48008/angelo-reyes-filipinos-should-stop-burying-the-sins-of-the-corrupt/


Angelo Reyes: Filipinos should stop burying the sins of the corrupt


he picture below, taken by NPPA Images, tragically represents the tragedy that is Angelo Reyes. It shows the tombstone on the grave of Purificacion Reyes, Angelo’s mother, smeared with her son’s blood after he shot himself in the hear



How can a family recover from something like this?

Days before he committed suicide, Reyes pleaded to the public not to drag his family into the corruption scandal that is rocking the Philippine military. But his suicide, as far as I’m concerned, settled the question on whether he was guilty of receiving millions of pesos from a payola taken from kickbacks and other corrupt practices in the military.

Spare his family? Didn’t Reyes  think of them before he pocketed those millions? Didn’t his family, particularly his wife, think of their good name and Purificacion before they spent those monies and lived allegedly luxurious lives?

We Filipinos are a forgiving people —  forgiving to a fault. We sweep problems like this under the rug when somebody as important as Reyes dies. Do not speak ill of the dead. The dead, no matter what they did in life, deserve respect.

I agree. But this culture of forgiveness, of burying our sense of justice along with the corrupt departed, is what makes our country such as sorry place. Remember the death of the dictator Ferdinand Marcos? When he died, not a few Filipinos said we should forget what he did and try to move on. Well, newsflash! We tried to move on but we have never moved on. The reason for that is because we lack the proper sense of outrage and even the moral sense to correct the wrongs done to us as a people.

This is not to disrespect the family of Angelo Reyes, let alone his mother. But before they demand  respect  from the public, they ought to show it to the public first.

Death, no matter how dramatic and tragic, should never be used as an occasion to forget a misdeed. Filipinos have done that quite often and look where we are now.

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #269 on: February 22, 2011, 01:04:15 AM »


well, if you insist, and if it makes you feel any better, dear humble below-average servant who has taken it upon himself to condemn people to perdition, so be it, because i don’t even have the ability to open the bible and i’m too imbecile to know what books comprise the old and the new testament nor do i have the energy such as you have to cut and paste bible passages from the internet. 

let it be said that i truly appreciate your humility as you condemn a suicide to hell, the kind of humility that’s quite in keeping with your revelation that your father had saved millions and calling a grandfather’s farm lot a hacienda in some other threads. 

i suggest you cease and desist from sounding like a religious scholar of sanctimonious proportions because you only end up convincing no one.   


that should not be an excuse for ignorance of the Word of God. Before you object to biblical verses , which are cosignatory to Divine Truth, in conjunction with Holy Tradition, then you should evade in the negative tone in regards to direct passages from the Holy Bible.

You had the audacity to poke fun of the verse from Book of Revelations, as if to indicate that you do not believe in the horsemen of the apocolapyse, as if to infer that you do not believe that the writings of St. John of the Divine, should be taken seriously. Consideringly, it must have been taken seriously since it was approved by the CATHOLIC CHURCH during the compilation of the bible, as well as later being retained by even the protestants , specifically martin luther.

Just to imply lang, my little 'dahlin', before you start shrugging verses from the bible, please also know that these are Divinely Inspired material and were written under the influence of the Holy Spirt on these writers, namely apostles , or disciples.

God Bless You!

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #270 on: February 22, 2011, 01:14:03 AM »
How arrogant of you. To criticize the writer's writing ability, instead of understanding his point of view and body of material that was laid to bare.

what more earthshaking arrogance is there than to declare that someone’s soul is burning in hell?  what a writer writes speaks of him.  it’s as simple as that.  but then simplicity seems beyond you.

the “body of material” that you are referring to here is not necessarily gospel truth; it is just an opinion of a writer.  whether he has some basis or not for such an opinion is beside the point.  the poor guy (reyes) was not even charged with anything yet.  haven’t you heard that a person is innocent until proven guilty, in a court of law, not in the bar of public opinion?

You are interesting, isles, you claim to want a new philippines,

show me any post of mine that claims i want a new philippines.  (don't put words into my nostrils!)

devoid of corruption, but at the moment of one corrupt former military man's death (suicide), you have lost the spark of credibility, and have become a defender. His death does not pardon his crimes, no , no. His death and the reaction of some people to his death indicates how quick people are to forget the crimes. legislative investigators still need to pry open the story and truth from his situation.

frankly, who really cares whether you find me credible or not?  

you presume that he was already guilty and was already a criminal?  poor angelo reyes.  a guy thousands of miles away can dare say he’s already guilty, has dubbed him a criminal, and has consigned his soul to eternal flames, and all because he chose to believe only what he wanted to believe in what he has selectively read and heard.  if that’s not arrogance, i don’t know what is.  

in the progression towards a more responsible government , and a better functioning democracy, investigators must refrain from detractive tendencies of the emotional outburst of the times. it must remain unhindered in the pursuit of justice.

egad, you write worse than the writer of the article i so arrogantly criticized.  (sorry, but my term would have been ‘commented on’ rather than criticized.)  that writer, at least, doesn’t own a short-circuited brain.  what does the ‘it’ in your last sentence refer to here, by the way?  help me, please, so i can fathom better your genius.

reyes' death was his own choosing. his estate and his perpetrators must and should answer to the law. no one is above the law. not even the dead.

please tell me when you find out that a dead person had been put on trial and condemned to death with lethal injection.  i’d be very interested.  i hope you will be the doctor who will certify him dead on arrival at the courtroom.  

i’m wasting my time on you, obviously.  goodnight.



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #271 on: February 22, 2011, 01:18:19 AM »
hehehe, pasalamat nalang ko nga sa tibo-ok nahong kinabuhi WAA JUD ko kasuway ug basa ug bible :D

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #272 on: February 22, 2011, 01:21:56 AM »

after your curriculum vitae presentation, i daresay you now qualify as a call center agent in cebu. 


Oh, how arrogant of you. And you think you are higher than a call center agent, because you are a house wife? lol.

Isles, your comments are detractive, clearly, and do not even stick to the point.

PS. Watch your ingrata-like attitude, cebu is known in the philippines as the BPO center of the country, and it is these call center agents, that is responsible for making the Philippines the # IT center in the world (as far as i remember, we recently surpassed India). To say that being a call-center agent is a bad thing.

It's a honest , hard working living. Something that General Angelo Reyes was not known for. Considering he pocketed over 50 Million Pesos.
And where do you think those millions came from? Surely not from the heavens that poured it down on his head. It came from the everyday tax paying Filipino citizen. It came from the call center agents, the doctors, the nurses, the teachers, the lawyers, business owners  etc. People that work for a living.


:)

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #273 on: February 22, 2011, 01:23:09 AM »
hehehe, pasalamat nalang ko nga sa tibo-ok nahong kinabuhi WAA JUD ko kasuway ug basa ug bible :D

maayo pa ka.  hapit na ko magmahay bisag igo ra kong naka-half shot ug basa. ;)

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bol-anon quo nyur!

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #274 on: February 22, 2011, 01:24:53 AM »
 Calling father ChiCOGON!!! We need your holy Water!!!

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #275 on: February 22, 2011, 01:26:38 AM »

show me any post of mine that claims i want a new philippines.  (don't put words into my nostrils!)





so, you are a supporter of the status quo? tsk tsk. corruption is okay with you, considering the fact that you are defending Reyes.
not once did you even show disgust towards his actions, his corruption.

ay, ka luod!

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #276 on: February 22, 2011, 01:33:05 AM »
Oh, how arrogant of you. And you think you are higher than a call center agent, because you are a house wife? lol.

Isles, your comments are detractive, clearly, and do not even stick to the point.

PS. Watch your ingrata-like attitude, cebu is known in the philippines as the BPO center of the country, and it is these call center agents, that is responsible for making the Philippines the # IT center in the world (as far as i remember, we recently surpassed India). To say that being a call-center agent is a bad thing.

It's a honest , hard working living. Something that General Angelo Reyes was not known for. Considering he pocketed over 50 Million Pesos.
And where do you think those millions came from? Surely not from the heavens that poured it down on his head. It came from the everyday tax paying Filipino citizen. It came from the call center agents, the doctors, the nurses, the teachers, the lawyers, business owners  etc. People that work for a living.

:)

f--k off, lorenz.  so you stick to the point, so now you lecture me about cebu and why i shouldn't have this "ingrata-like" attitude because it's the bpo center?  it looks like you were the one insulted for qualifying as a call center agent.  why, you don't want to be at the center of the bpo center even as you are so sure that angelo reyes pocketed 50 million?  f--k off, lorenz.


 

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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #277 on: February 22, 2011, 01:41:34 AM »
so, you are a supporter of the status quo? tsk tsk. corruption is okay with you, considering the fact that you are defending Reyes.
not once did you even show disgust towards his actions, his corruption.

ay, ka luod!

luod gyod tawon ka.  i said show me any post of mine that claims i want a new philippines (because you have declared that i did) and you jump to the conclusion that i favor the status quo?  whew!  when logic was distributed, it looks like you were absent.   

sorry, unlike you, i'm not capable of showing disgust for people who have not been proven guilty, especially dead ones.

mao nga paskang kaluod gyod tawon nimo. 



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #278 on: February 22, 2011, 01:45:21 AM »
Calling father ChiCOGON!!! We need your holy Water!!!

thanks for the breaker, bqn.  (i wish it were not the wee hours of the morning here.)  tabangi unya ko kun sa pagbendisyon ni fr chic ug holy water, moaso unya ko... ajaw ko bijai... ;D



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Re: Do you think late Angelo Reyes died honorably?
« Reply #279 on: February 22, 2011, 02:02:27 AM »
thanks for the breaker, bqn.  (i wish it were not the wee hours of the morning here.)  tabangi unya ko kun sa pagbendisyon ni fr chic ug holy water, moaso unya ko... ajaw ko bijai... ;D



 hehehe, bitaw Isle oi. Asa naman to si father chiCOGON, siya raman joi naai holy water nato ani, kai ako tig silhig raman intawon ko sa kilid sa kalsada atbang sa cathedral ;)

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