Author Topic: Catholic Answers: What books did the Church Fathers exclude from the Bible? Why?  (Read 3295 times)

Lorenzo

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Way Nada

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The Didache because this book is considered to be a book on cathecism of the early christians.

WN

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Lorenzo

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The Didache because this book is considered to be a book on cathecism of the early christians.

WN

Good answer, Sir Way Nada !

In other words, Martin Luther, could not refute Catholic teachings via scriptural, so he made it policy to remove it from scripture. He removed the 7 books that supports Catholic doctrine and Tradition.

By doing this, however, Luther was committing heresy ! And knowingly too. Within his own lifetime, his own congregation split from him and formed their own groups.



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Way Nada

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No... no... no... Martin Luther did not remove the Didache from the bible. The Didache  was pusposely not included in the canon of the bible. But in the case of Martin Luther when he departed from Catholicism he compiled his own canon of the bible by taking out 7 books of the original compilation namely; Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel. The book of James in the NT where it is written that "faith without works is useless" was almost deleted by Martin Luther because of his hersey of bible alone doctrine.   

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simplylee

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aron walay lalis adto ta mobase sa original nga libro sa bible dili ang translations kun naa na sa original hebrew old testament ug original greek new testament ato na dawaton :)

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Lorenzo

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No... no... no... Martin Luther did not remove the Didache from the bible. The Didache  was pusposely not included in the canon of the bible. But in the case of Martin Luther when he departed from Catholicism he compiled his own canon of the bible by taking out 7 books of the original compilation namely; Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel. The book of James in the NT where it is written that "faith without works is useless" was almost deleted by Martin Luther because of his hersey of bible alone doctrine.   

Sir Way Nada,

I didn't say that Martin Luther removed the didache, but rather removed the 7 books: Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel. His removal of these books established the 'protestant' bible.

The form that the protestant denominations read are incomplete and adulterated versions of the Holy Bible.

If one wants to read the bible, read the Bible that was promulgated by the Council of Nicea, the Roman Catholic Bible.

Best,
Lorenzo

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Lorenzo

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No... no... no... Martin Luther did not remove the Didache from the bible. The Didache  was pusposely not included in the canon of the bible. But in the case of Martin Luther when he departed from Catholicism he compiled his own canon of the bible by taking out 7 books of the original compilation namely; Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel. The book of James in the NT where it is written that "faith without works is useless" was almost deleted by Martin Luther because of his hersey of bible alone doctrine.   

One cannot help but ask, "what authority did Martin Luther have to remove 7 books of the Holy Bible?"



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Lorenzo

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aron walay lalis adto ta mobase sa original nga libro sa bible dili ang translations kun naa na sa original hebrew old testament ug original greek new testament ato na dawaton :)

Yes, one can easily do this by reading the SEPTUAGINT.

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Lorenzo

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aron walay lalis adto ta mobase sa original nga libro sa bible dili ang translations kun naa na sa original hebrew old testament ug original greek new testament ato na dawaton :)

Ate Lee,

If one wants to study the Holy Bible and to get to the root of the meaning, don't stop at the Hebrew translation, one should read the Armaic version, the language that the Lord Jesus Christ spoke in.

However, if one is only interested to read the Greek and Hebrew version, one can do this by reading the SEPTUAGINT. Again, one should take foundational classes  in Greek and Hebrew so as not to make translational mistakes in the interpretation.

I recommend reading the SEPTUAGINT.

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Lorenzo

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I would recommend reading the Greek-English Lexicon of the Septuagint:




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Lorenzo

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The History of the Septuagint; Terminology


THE SEPTUAGINT, derived from the Latin word for "seventy," can be a confusing term, since ideally it refers to the third-century BCE Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, executed in Alexandria, Egypt. But the full story behind the translation and the various stages, amplifications, and modifications to the collection we now call the Septuagint is complicated.

The earliest, and best known, source for the story of the Septuagint is the Letter of Aristeas, a lengthy document that recalls how Ptolemy (Philadelphus II [285–247 BCE]), desiring to augment his library in Alexandria, Egypt, commissioned a translation of the Hebrew Scriptures into Greek. Ptolemy wrote to the chief priest, Eleazar, in Jerusalem, and arranged for six translators from each of the twelve tribes of Israel. The seventy-two (altered in a few later versions to seventy or seventy-five) translators arrived in Egypt to Ptolemy's gracious hospitality, and translated the Torah (also called the Pentateuch: the first five books of the Hebrew Scriptures) in seventy-two days. Opinions as to when this occurred differ, ranging from 282 to about 250 BCE.

Philo of Alexandria (fl. 1st c CE) confirms that only the Torah was commissioned to be translated, and some modern scholars have concurred, noting a kind of consistency in the translation style of the Greek Penteteuch. Over the course of the three centuries following Ptolemy's project, however, other books of the Hebrew Scriptures were translated into Greek. It is not altogether clear which book was translated when, and in what locale. It seems that sometimes a Hebrew book was translated more than once, or that a particular Greek translation was revised. In other cases, a work was composed afresh in Greek, yet was included in subsequent collections of the Scriptures. By observing technical terms and translation styles, by comparing the Greek versions to the Dead Sea Scrolls, and by comparing them to Hellenistic literature, scholars are in the process of stitching together an elusive history of the translations that eventually found their way into collections.

By Philo's time the memory of the seventy-two translators was vibrant, an important part of Jewish life in Alexandria (Philo, Life of Moses 2.25–44). Pilgrims, both Jews and Gentiles, celebrated a yearly festival on the island where they conducted their work. The celebrity of the Septuagint and its translators remained strong in Christianity. The earliest Christian references to the translation, from the mid-second century (SS Justin Martyr and Irenaeus), credit the entire Old Testament in Greek, whether originally written in Hebrew or not, to the seventy-two. Thus Christians conflated the Septuagint with their Old Testament canon (a canon that included the so-called apocrypha). For their part, Jewish rabbis, particularly Pharisees, reacted to the Christian appropriation of the Septuagint by producing fresh translations of their Scriptures (e.g., Aquila, in 128 CE, or Symmachus in the late 2d c. CE), and discouraging the use of the Septuagint. By the second century Christian and Jewish leaders had cemented their position on the form and character of the Scriptures. By and large, Christians held to the peculiar, prophetic character of their Septuagint, and Jews rejected it.

In the third century, the great Christian scholar, Origen (184/85–254/55), keenly interested in the textual differences between the Hebrew and the Greek, set out to arrange the Church's Old Testament in six columns: (1) the Hebrew, (2) a Greek transliteration of the Hebrew, (3) Aquila's translation, (4) Symmachus's translation, (5) the Septuagint (LXX), and (6) Theodotion. The volumes were compiled in Caesarea, probably between 230 and 240 CE, a project funded by Origen's patron. The resultant work, called the Hexapla ("six-fold"), was massive, and has perished except for fragments. Origen was a very careful scholar, but he did not observe modern editorial conventions. His version of the LXX draws from several different manuscript families and embraces readings that bring the text closer to the Hebrew text of his day. Thus, this fifth LXX column, while establishing the first "standardized text" of the Christian Church, created problems for modern scholars who would seek to recover a pre-Christian version of the LXX.

Further recensions of the Greek text in the fourth century are attested. Hesychius (fl. 3/4th c.) is said to have created a recension for the Church in Egypt; Lucian (d. 312 CE), in Antioch. Some scholars posit other recensions from this period. Thus, we find some Greek Church Fathers quoting the same Old Testament texts, but in very different forms. There is no indication, however, that this troubled Church leadership. The insistence on letter-for-letter, word-for-word accuracy in the Scriptures was a feature that was not to emerge in Christian thought for many centuries, and only then after a similar insistence appeared in Judaism and Islam. As far as most early Christians were concerned, any Greek version of the Old Testament read in the Church merited the term Septuagint.

Wherever Christianity spread, translations of the Hebrew Scriptures were made based on the LXX. Thus, it became the basis for translations made into Arabic, Armenian, Coptic, Ethiopic, Georgian, Old Latin, and Old Church Slavonic. (It was not the basis either for the Syriac version [known as the Peshitta], which is a pre-Christian translation based directly upon the Hebrew; the LXX is also not the basis for St. Jerome's Latin translation, which, like the Peshitta, is based on the Hebrew.)

Modern scholars, sifting through this very interesting and elusive history, have attempted to create editions of the Septuagint that reflect as early a text as possible. Rahlfs's edition of the LXX (1935) is semi-critical, utilizing what he believed to be the chief manuscripts. Brooke, McLean, and Thackeray's partial edition (1906–40) sought a more critical approach. The Göttingen edition of the LXX (1931–), now mostly complete, is the most critical edition of the LXX, taking into account over 120 manuscripts, many languages, and a multitude of patristic quotations. Modern Biblical scholars accept the Göttingen as the standard edition, but the ease and accessibility of Rahlfs's edition has made it a popular alternative. Bear in mind, all these editions are eclectic, thoughtful attempts to reconstruct the earliest version of the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible.

The term Septuagint could refer to any historical stage of the Greek translation of the Old Testament. A strict, purist use of Septuagint would allow the term to be used only of the earliest, (probably) unrecoverable translation of the Pentateuch made by the Jewish scholars around 282 BCE. Some refer to this earliest stage as the "Old Greek," but with some confusion, since this suggests that the term Septuagint should be applied only to texts with no connection to the legend of the seventy-two. For the purposes of this website, I use Septuagint to refer to the entire tradition of Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, and not to any single text or phase.

http://www.kalvesmaki.com/lxx/

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Lorenzo

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Historical importance of the Septuagint


The importance of the Septuagint Version is shown by the following considerations:

(1) The Septuagint is the most ancient translation of the Old Testament and consequently is invaluable to critics for understanding and correcting the Hebrew text (Massorah), the latter, such as it has come down to us, being the text established by the Massoretes in the sixth century A.D. Many textual corruptions, additions, omissions, or transpositions must have crept into the Hebrew text between the third and second centuries B.C. and the sixth and seventh centuries of our era; the manuscripts therefore which the Seventy had at their disposal, may in places have been better than the Massoretic manuscripts.

(2) The Septuagint Version accepted first by the Alexandrian Jews, and afterwards by all the Greek-speaking countries, helped to spread among the Gentiles the idea and the expectation of the Messias, and to introduce into Greek the theological terminology that made it a most suitable instrument for the propagation of the Gospel of Christ.

(3) The Jews made use of it long before the Christian Era, and in the time of Christ it was recognised as a legitimate text, and was employed in Palestine even by the rabbis. The Apostles and Evangelists utilised it also and borrowed Old Testament citations from it, especially in regard to the prophecies. The Fathers and the other ecclesiastical writers of the early Church drew upon it, either directly, as in the case of the Greek Fathers, or indirectly, like the Latin Fathers and writers and others who employed Latin, Syriac, Ethiopian, Arabic and Gothic versions. It was held in high esteem by all, some even believed it inspired. Consequently, a knowledge of the Septuagint helps to a perfect understanding of these literatures.

(4) At the present time, the Septuagint is the official text in the Greek Church, and the ancient Latin Versions used in the western church were made from it; the earliest translation adopted in the Latin Church, the Vetus Itala, was directly from the Septuagint: the meanings adopted in it, the Greek names and words employed (such as: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers [Arithmoi], Deuteronomy), and finally, the pronunciation given to the Hebrew text, passed very frequently into the Itala, and from it, at times, into the Vulgate, which not rarely gives signs of the influence of the Vetus Itala; this is especially so in the Psalms, the Vulgate translation being merely the Vetus Itala corrected by St. Jerome according to the hexaplar text of the Septuagint.




http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13722a.htm

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Way Nada

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One cannot help but ask, "what authority did Martin Luther have to remove 7 books of the Holy Bible?"



Reply:

Martin Luther has no authority except taking out other books in the bible that contradict to his heretical teaching. Example is the book of 2 Maccabees 12:43-46 which is one of the bases in our teaching of purgatory. It says;

"43And making a gathering, he twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection,

 44(For if he had not hoped that the that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,)

  45And because he considered that the who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them.

  46It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins.

To evade those verses above Martin Luther took out Maccabees in his new canon of the bible without authority.

WN


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Way Nada

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Yes, one can easily do this by reading the SEPTUAGINT.

Reply:

The word "septuagint" means seventy. The Septuagint Version was authorized by Ptolemy II to be translated by hiring 70 rabbis. "There should have been no new testament if the Septuagint Version was not written." That's the catch if anybody here will try to understand.

WN

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here's an interesting reply to the question of whether or not the catholic bible uses the septuagint:

Although the Septuagint was the normative Old Testament for most of the infant Christian world, Jerome made his translation of the Vulgate from the Hebrew text while still including all of the books of the Septuagint (meaning he did not drop the 7 that are not in the Masoretic text of the rabbis).  I think modern translations try to use both the Hebrew and the Greek to try to get the best rendering possible.  So does the Catholic Bible use the Septuagint?  Yes and No.  We follow its canon but are not slavishly devoted to its text. (Andreas Hofer, http://forums.catholic.com/)

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Is the Septuagint the same as the Deuterocanon Books? Unsa man pud nang Apocrypha?

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Lorenzo

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Is the Septuagint the same as the Deuterocanon Books? Unsa man pud nang Apocrypha?

The SEPTUAGINT is all the Old Testament Books written in Hebrew. The Apocryphal Books are the 7 books that are included in the ROMAN CATHOLIC BIBLE , which are erased in the PROTESTANT BIBLE (St. James Version etc).

These 7 books include: Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel.

This is why, Vince, do not ever try to debate with a Protestant about biblical scripture because they do not read the entire Bible. The bible that they read (St. James Version etc) are devoid of the 7 books. These books were stricken from their bible by the heretic Martin Luther.



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Lorenzo

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Reply:

Martin Luther has no authority except taking out other books in the bible that contradict to his heretical teaching. Example is the book of 2 Maccabees 12:43-46 which is one of the bases in our teaching of purgatory. It says;

"43And making a gathering, he twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection,

 44(For if he had not hoped that the that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,)

  45And because he considered that the who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them.

  46It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins.

To evade those verses above Martin Luther took out Maccabees in his new canon of the bible without authority.

WN


Yes, Luther was a heretic. He had no authority to remove the 7 books. What took hundreds of years for the COUNCIL OF NICEA to promulgate and to form , Luther's heresy tried to subvert with the tearing of a few pages.

His nailing of the 95 thesis on the church door was also an example of desecration and vandalism.

It is important to note that tho Luther helped caused the Protestant Wars with the Catholic Church, within his own lifetime, his own congregational followers split from him and formed their own churches. That is why there is only One, Holy, Roman Catholic Church and thousands and thousands of protestant churches.



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Lorenzo

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Reply:

The word "septuagint" means seventy. The Septuagint Version was authorized by Ptolemy II to be translated by hiring 70 rabbis. "There should have been no new testament if the Septuagint Version was not written." That's the catch if anybody here will try to understand.

WN

That is a good point. :)

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Lorenzo

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The book of James in the NT where it is written that "faith without works is useless" was almost deleted by Martin Luther because of his hersey of bible alone doctrine.   


Ah, yes, you are referring to the protestant notion of Sola Scriptura. :)

The primacy in Protestant theological study rests on the notion of Literal Interpretation of the Holy Bible and that The Holy Bible is alone sufficient. Tho I do credit our protestant brothers and sisters for their spirit and in the Love of Jesus Christ, which is the underlying similarity between Catholic Doctrine and Protestant Doctrine.

However, the fallability in their argument of SOLA SCRIPTURA lies in the fact that their version of the bible is devoid of the 7 original Books that are found in the Roman Catholic Holy Bible.

We are taught by the Holy Magesterium et Catholica Ecclesia that Revealed Truth is given to us through:

1. Sacred Scripture

and

2. Sacred Tradition

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The SEPTUAGINT is all the Old Testament Books written in Hebrew. The Apocryphal Books are the 7 books that are included in the ROMAN CATHOLIC BIBLE , which are erased by the PROTESTANT BIBLE (St. James Version etc).

These 7 books include: Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel.

This is why, Vince, do not ever try to debate with a Protestant about biblical scripture because they do not read the entire Bible. The bible that they read (St. James Version etc) are devoid of the 7 books. These books were stricken from their bible by the heretic Martin Luther.



I read in the Shameless Poppery blog that the Apocrypha is also called LXX.

Yes! And also, as a Catholic, I believe in the Holy Traditions of the Church. So the bible should not be the sole authority when it comes to doctrines.

"But there are also many other things which Jesus did; which, if they were written every one, the world itself, I think, would not be able to contain the books that should be written."

- John 21:25 (Douay-Rheims Catholic Bible)

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Addendum:


Many protestants will argue with Catholics, "where is it said in the holy bible that one should pray for the dead ?"

They will never see the answer they ask for if they refer only to their adulterated version of the Holy Bible, because the biblical verse that supports the prayers for the dead (in essence, the support for the state of purgatory) is found in the Book of Maccabees.

The Biblical Verse that supports the Prayers for the dead is found in 2 Maccabbees Chapter 12 Verses 38-46:

[GREEK]

 38 Ιουδας δὲ ἀναλαβὼν τὸ στράτευμα ἧκεν εἰς Οδολλαμ πόλιν τῆς δὲ ἑβδομάδος ἐπιβαλλούσης κατὰ τὸν ἐθισμὸν ἁγνισθέντες αὐτόθι τὸ σάββατον διήγαγον 39 τῇ δὲ ἐχομένῃ ἦλθον οἱ περὶ τὸν Ιουδαν καθ' ὃν χρόνον τὸ τῆς χρείας ἐγεγόνει Ï„á½° σώματα τῶν προπεπτωκότων ἀνακομίσασθαι καὶ μετὰ τῶν συγγενῶν ἀποκαταστῆσαι εἰς τοὺς πατρῴους τάφους 40 εὗρον δὲ ἑκάστου τῶν τεθνηκότων ὑπὸ τοὺς χιτῶνας ἱερώματα τῶν ἀπὸ Ιαμνείας εἰδώλων ἀφ' ὧν ὁ νόμος ἀπείργει τοὺς Ιουδαίους τοῖς δὲ πᾶσι σαφὲς ἐγένετο διὰ τήνδε τὴν αἰτίαν τούσδε πεπτωκέναι 41 πάντες οὖν εὐλογήσαντες Ï„á½° τοῦ δικαιοκρίτου κυρίου Ï„á½° κεκρυμμένα φανερὰ ποιοῦντος 42 εἰς ἱκετείαν ἐτράπησαν ἀξιώσαντες τὸ γεγονὸς ἁμάρτημα τελείως ἐξαλειφθῆναι ὁ δὲ γενναῖος Ιουδας παρεκάλεσε τὸ πλῆθος συντηρεῖν αὑτοὺς ἀναμαρτήτους εἶναι ὑπ' ὄψιν ἑωρακότας Ï„á½° γεγονότα διὰ τὴν τῶν προπεπτωκότων ἁμαρτίαν 43 ποιησάμενός τε κατ' ἀνδρολογίαν εἰς ἀργυρίου δραχμὰς δισχιλίας ἀπέστειλεν εἰς Ιεροσόλυμα προσαγαγεῖν περὶ ἁμαρτίας θυσίαν πάνυ καλῶς καὶ ἀστείως πράττων ὑπὲρ ἀναστάσεως διαλογιζόμενος 44 εἰ μὴ γὰρ τοὺς προπεπτωκότας ἀναστῆναι προσεδόκα περισσὸν καὶ ληρῶδες ὑπὲρ νεκρῶν εὔχεσθαι 45 εἶτε' ἐμβλέπων τοῖς μετ' εὐσεβείας κοιμωμένοις κάλλιστον ἀποκείμενον χαριστήριον 46 ὁσία καὶ εὐσεβὴς ἡ ἐπίνοια ὅθεν περὶ τῶν τεθνηκότων τὸν ἐξιλασμὸν ἐποιήσατο τῆς ἁμαρτίας ἀπολυθῆναι



[ENGLISH]

38 So Judas having gathered together his army, came into the city Odollam: and when the seventh day came, they purified themselves according to the custom, and kept the sabbath in the same place. 39 And the day following Judas came with his company, to take away the bodies of them that were slain, and to bury them with their kinsmen, in the sepulchres of their fathers. 40 And they found under the coats of the slain, some of the donaries of the idols of Jamnia, which the law forbids to the Jews: so that all plainly saw, that for this cause they were slain. 41 Then they all blessed the just judgment of the Lord, who had discovered the things that were hidden. 42 And so betaking themselves to prayers, they besought him, that the sin which had been committed might be forgotten. But the most valiant Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forasmuch as they saw before their eyes what had happened, because of the sins of those that were slain. 43 And making a gathering, he sent twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection. 44 (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead), 45 and because he considered that they who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them. 46 It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins.



Note: Martin Luther removed 2nd Maccabees because he did not agree with the need to prayer for the dead, nor did he on the Catholic Teaching of Purgatory. He could not support his belief through biblical text, so what did he do? He removed the BIBLICAL TEXTS that supported the Catholic Doctrine.

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islander

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What took hundreds of years for the COUNCIL OF NICEA to promulgate and to form , Luther's heresy tried to subvert with the tearing of a few pages.

ugh, lorenz, please.  i hope you don't really mean what i understand your statement to be.  no member of the council of nicea, first or second, could have lived that long.  ;D

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islander

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to partly satisfy my personal curiosity...  am i glad the wiki is just a click away.

A number of erroneous views have been stated regarding the council's role in establishing the biblical canon. In fact, there is no record of any discussion of the biblical canon at the council at all.  The development of the biblical canon took centuries, and was nearly complete (with exceptions known as the Antilegomena, written texts whose authenticity or value is disputed) by the time the Muratorian fragment was written.

In 331 Constantine commissioned fifty Bibles for the Church of Constantinople, but little else is known, though it has been speculated that this may have provided motivation for canon lists. In Jerome's Prologue to Judith he claims that the Book of Judith was "found by the Nicene Council to have been counted among the number of the Sacred Scriptures".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea

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Lorenzo

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ugh, lorenz, please.  i hope you don't really mean what i understand your statement to be.  no member of the council of nicea, first or second, could have lived that long.  ;D

haha! og buhi pa ang myembro sa council of hippo, carthage sure gajod ko ma kulbaan sila og nadungog sila sa comments ni Bro. Martin Luther.

Segoro mo ingon sila nija, "Hoy, Marteng, kahibalo ba ka pila ka horas kami ning basa sa mga libro ge-include namo sa bibliya, maayo ra ka kay imoharagajod gi hiwa ang pitong libro!"

:P

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Lorenzo

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to partly satisfy my personal curiosity...  am i glad the wiki is just a click away.

A number of erroneous views have been stated regarding the council's role in establishing the biblical canon. In fact, there is no record of any discussion of the biblical canon at the council at all.  The development of the biblical canon took centuries, and was nearly complete (with exceptions known as the Antilegomena, written texts whose authenticity or value is disputed) by the time the Muratorian fragment was written.

In 331 Constantine commissioned fifty Bibles for the Church of Constantinople, but little else is known, though it has been speculated that this may have provided motivation for canon lists. In Jerome's Prologue to Judith he claims that the Book of Judith was "found by the Nicene Council to have been counted among the number of the Sacred Scriptures".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea

Yes, you're right, Isles. The 1st Council of Nicea did not necessarily establish biblical canon, because it was the Council of Hippo (Synod of Hippo) that established approved cannon for Sacred Scripture.

Good Job on pointing that out.



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Lorenzo

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ugh, lorenz, please.  i hope you don't really mean what i understand your statement to be.  no member of the council of nicea, first or second, could have lived that long.  ;D

Isles, you are correct. I was wrong in saying Council of Nicea, I meant to say Council of Hippo (Synod of Hippo). Thanks for pointing that one. :)

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Lorenzo

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Canon of Scripture: What criteria did the early Christians use to determine it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9-0lztsHhk#ws

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Way Nada

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If one wants to read the bible, read the Bible that was promulgated by the Council of Nicea, the Roman Catholic Bible.

Lorenzo,

The primary goal in the Council of Nicea was to proclaim the divinity of Jesus because there was a certain bishop by the name of Arius whose taught that Jesus is only a human being. Until now the divinity of Jesus is still being debated because there are cults in the Philippines that do not believe Christ as God; like the INC of Manalo, ADD of Eli Soriano [ADD does not believe Jesus is a supreme God], Witnesses of Jehovah [this sect believe that Jesus is the archangel Michael] and islam.

WN

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Way Nada

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These 7 books include: Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel.


The 7 books above are the deuterocanonical. They are part of the catholic canon of the bible which are also included in the Septuagint. The apochrypal are hidden books of the bible or scriptures not included in the bible. Example are the gnostic bible, docetist and the early christian writings. There are characters in the church that are not found in the bible but it is written in the apochrypal books. Example are; Estas and Dimas, Saint Veronica, St. Longinus etc... The Didache is considered apochrypal.

WN

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Way Nada

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I read in the Shameless Poppery blog that the Apocrypha is also called LXX.




LXX means seventy. This is refering to the Septuagint which also means 70. Seventy because Ptolemy II of Egypt commissioned 70 rabbis to translate the hebrew bible into greek.

WN

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Lorenzo

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Lorenzo,

The primary goal in the Council of Nicea was to proclaim the divinity of Jesus because there was a certain bishop by the name of Arius whose taught that Jesus is only a human being. Until now the divinity of Jesus is still being debated because there are cults in the Philippines that do not believe Christ as God; like the INC of Manalo, ADD of Eli Soriano [ADD does not believe Jesus is a supreme God], Witnesses of Jehovah [this sect believe that Jesus is the archangel Michael] and islam.

WN
The 7 books above are the deuterocanonical. They are part of the catholic canon of the bible which are also included in the Septuagint. The apochrypal are hidden books of the bible or scriptures not included in the bible. Example are the gnostic bible, docetist and the early christian writings. There are characters in the church that are not found in the bible but it is written in the apochrypal books. Example are; Estas and Dimas, Saint Veronica, St. Longinus etc... The Didache is considered apochrypal.

WN

Thank You, Sir Way Nada , for the awesome information.

Regards,
Lorenzo

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Lorenzo

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LXX means seventy. This is refering to the Septuagint which also means 70. Seventy because Ptolemy II of Egypt commissioned 70 rabbis to translate the hebrew bible into greek.

WN

Thanks, Sir Way Nada!

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