Author Topic: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?  (Read 5901 times)

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Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« on: October 21, 2010, 06:48:31 PM »
Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2010, 07:00:55 PM »
Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?

No.... hmmm..... but I'm sure along life's journey there's a lot of it.

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2010, 08:52:16 PM »
i don't think so.  otherwise, the better the poet, the more pained he is.  poet or not, we all have our share of pains.  the poets simply know how to express their pains and joys in words.  besides, if poets and pain go together, what does that make of hemorrhoid sufferers?  sa lain nga pagkasulti, mas daghan kahang gi-almoranas nga mga balaknon kay sa dili?  ;D

na, mamiligro gyod ang reputasyon sa mga balaknon dinhi sa tb.  paging boylawas/loloy, mike ligalig, hubag, bugsay, lorenzo, mistyeyed, scarb... pray, tell, are you bonafide members of the elite hemorrhoids society?

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2010, 09:03:11 PM »
i don't think so.  otherwise, the better the poet, the more pained he is.  poet or not, we all have our share of pains.  the poets simply know how to express their pains and joys in words.  besides, if poets and pain go together, what does that make of hemorrhoid sufferers?  sa lain nga pagkasulti, mas daghan kahang gi-almoranas nga mga balaknon kay sa dili?  ;D

na, mamiligro gyod ang reputasyon sa mga balaknon dinhi sa tb.  paging boylawas/loloy, mike ligalig, hubag, bugsay, lorenzo, mistyeyed, scarb... pray, tell, are you bonafide members of the elite hemorrhoids society?

Others did not, like powiters they contributes pain to others, not just like almoranas bearers.

 ;D

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2010, 09:21:05 PM »
if poets and pain go together, what does that make of hemorrhoid sufferers?  sa lain nga pagkasulti, mas daghan kahang gi-almoranas nga mga balaknon kay sa dili? 

Others did not, like powiters they contributes pain to others, not just like almoranas bearers.

 ;D

He he, kon maohon daghang powiters sa mga bag-ong salta sa prisohan...

 :'( - nawong sa powiter nga gi-welcome sa mayores...

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2010, 09:33:24 PM »
i don't think so.  otherwise, the better the poet, the more pained he is.  poet or not, we all have our share of pains.  the poets simply know how to express their pains and joys in words.  besides, if poets and pain go together, what does that make of hemorrhoid sufferers?  sa lain nga pagkasulti, mas daghan kahang gi-almoranas nga mga balaknon kay sa dili?  ;D

na, mamiligro gyod ang reputasyon sa mga balaknon dinhi sa tb.  paging boylawas/loloy, mike ligalig, hubag, bugsay, lorenzo, mistyeyed, scarb... pray, tell, are you bonafide members of the elite hemorrhoids society?

Whahaha the powiter§ ..! Marching their way on the groundfloor..dagan mga kompaneyroz..ayaw pasakop sa "butt pirate" -hee³

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2010, 09:37:54 PM »
Panagza maau pod magsakit ang dughan sa mga poweterz ky makamugna silag poem nga masulob-on ngale..,maka touch sa mga mambabasa. Its nice to shed a tears sometimes pod kuno ky makapaugnat sa muscles aron pod tin-aw ang pagbudlat inig panglili-whop§

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2010, 09:44:10 PM »
Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?

No, not always.

Sometimes, he requires joy.



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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2010, 10:54:57 PM »
He he, kon maohon daghang powiters sa mga bag-ong salta sa prisohan...

 :'( - nawong sa powiter nga gi-welcome sa mayores...

na, tua na.  niliko na sa prisohan ang poet, nahimo nang powiter.  (my fault for mentioning almoranas.  i thought i'd sound medically scientific.  mea culpa.)  voice of experience, hubag?  powiter or mayor? ???

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Re: Does a Poet Need a Pain to Write?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2010, 10:58:36 PM »
No, not always.

Sometimes, he requires joy.


the whole range of human experience, right?  thanks for answering the page.  we still have to hear from boylawas/loloy, bugsay, mike ligalig, mistyeyed, etc...

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2010, 07:08:18 AM »
A poet needs one thing: a source of inspiration.

Either it be in the form of a woman, a man, a joyous feeling, a morose mood, sexuality, there is a plethora of possible candidates. One thing is for sure, a poet will write when his heart is full. It takes time to produce thoughts into expressible written words, that tries to come close to the passions burning within.

Give a poet a pen, a paper, and his inspiration. A sweet kiss on the cheeks, and perhaps, just perhaps, he might write a poem for you.
;)

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2010, 10:46:58 PM »
na, tua na.  niliko na sa prisohan ang poet, nahimo nang powiter.  (my fault for mentioning almoranas.  i thought i'd sound medically scientific.  mea culpa.)  voice of experience, hubag?  powiter or mayor? ???

Bwahaha!  "Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate."  :P

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2010, 11:05:25 PM »
Bwahaha!  "Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate."  :P

won't let this go, so i googled it.  hahaha!  "abandon all hope, all ye who enter here."  mao man kuno ni ang tattoo sa lobot sa usa ka powiter. ;D

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2010, 11:06:49 PM »
Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?

Hmm. A few random thoughts...

1. Poets don't need pain. No one needs pain.
2. Everyone feels pain every now and then, some more than others.
3. Some people are poets, some are not.
4. Poets are people who write poems whether they feel pain or not.
5. Many people write poems, whether they are poets or not.
6. Non-poets write poems only when they feel pain.
7. Poems written by non-poets are always funny.
 

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2010, 09:12:13 AM »
Absolutely not! Horace said that the poet should achieve a moment of tranquility before he writes. With that said, in order to visualize and understand the emotion, one should be removed from it.

I think you are talking about "Mad Poets" that Aristotle discusses in his literary theory, the Poetics

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2010, 10:34:30 AM »
the beauty of poetry is that anyone, i mean anyone, can write a poem.

The uniqueness of individual poetry is -- that very individual flair is the basis of poetic license; varied, eclectic styles of poets allows poetry to be...so universal yet at the same time individualistic.

The verbalization of inner passions, thoughts made into words,..

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2010, 03:02:13 PM »
To write prose, one must have something to say; but he who has nothing to say can still make verses and rhymes, where one word suggests the other, and at last something comes out, which in fact is nothing, but looks as if it were something. --Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2010, 03:09:38 PM »
People who are not artists often feel that artists are inspired. But if you work at your art you don't have time to be inspired. --John Cage

Amateurs look for inspiration; the rest of us just get up and go to work. --Chuck Close

I don't know anything about inspiration because I don't know what inspiration is; I've heard about it, but I never saw it. --William Faulkner

If I feel the need for inspiration I read the O[xford] E[nglish] D[ictionary]. --Anthony Burgess



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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2010, 05:51:33 PM »
Absolutely not! Horace said that the poet should achieve a moment of tranquility before he writes. With that said, in order to visualize and understand the emotion, one should be removed from it.

I think you are talking about "Mad Poets" that Aristotle discusses in his literary theory, the Poetics

is this a case of mistaken identity, loloy?  

what i understand is that horace in his ars poetica explores the literary possibilities offered by hellenistic ethical goals to determine the summum bonum (the highest good), including as a matter of course the tranquility that comes through balance.
 
meanwhile, william wordsworth in his preface to lyrical ballads defines poetry as “...the spontaneous overflow of powerful feelings: it takes its origin from emotion recollected in tranquility”.  this runs closest to your statement that "a poet should achieve a moment of tranquility before he writes".

one of the principles put forth by aristotle in his poetics is more considerate compared to plato who attempts to prove that poets are out of their minds when they write poetry (in ion).  aristotle believes that great poets must be either specially gifted for being able to imitate any kind of human character, or mad because they are unable to maintain their own characters.  please note that gifted or mad, they are great poets in his eyes.  




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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2010, 06:58:26 PM »
the beauty of poetry is that anyone, i mean anyone, can write a poem.

The uniqueness of individual poetry is -- that very individual flair is the basis of poetic license; varied, eclectic styles of poets allows poetry to be...so universal yet at the same time individualistic.

The verbalization of inner passions, thoughts made into words,..

sorry, lorenz, but i beg to disagree.  the beauty of poetry is that not anyone, not everyone, can write poetry.  anyone can attempt to write poetry, though, but not everyone ends up with a poem worthy of the term, much less end up as poets. 

we all can paint a blank wall, but we cannot be all artists.  we can dance, why not, but not everyone has the grace or the stamina to become a dancer. 

we all can pick up a microphone and sing in a videoke, and the irritation caused by such kind of singing by some of us had become legendary, it had led to murder. 

which reminds me, anyone can dream of becoming a doctor, but not everyone has the aptitude and diligence to rise to the rigors of medical studies.
     

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2010, 07:35:21 PM »
to continue...

so what is poetry? 

poetry is that most ancient form of writing that uses rhythm and imagery in lines of a specific length.  it is a self-contained piece, and difficult to achieve.  that is why some attempts at writing poetry result to nothing but a chopped up prose. 

prose is a straightforward and unembellished ordinary style of writing and expression.

verse is a component part of either poetry or music; a section of a poem or song that consists of a number of lines arranged rhythmically to form a single unit is a verse.

lyrics are the words of a song, be they poetic or prosaic or nonsensical.

writing with poetic effect is writing with the same imaginative and intense qualities of poems, but it is not the same as writing a poem.   


 
 


   



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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2010, 07:52:28 PM »
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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2010, 09:52:03 PM »
A poet is born,not made.
[poeta nascitur,non fit] -ANON [ old latin phrase ]

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2010, 05:06:02 AM »
A poet is born,not made.
[poeta nascitur,non fit] -ANON [ old latin phrase ]

for sure, for sure.
there are some cynical poets, passionate poets, even angry poets.
i take kindly to the passionate ones. Shelley for example, is a personal favorite.

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #24 on: October 27, 2010, 05:15:36 AM »
sorry, lorenz, but i beg to disagree.  the beauty of poetry is that not anyone, not everyone, can write poetry.  anyone can attempt to write poetry, though, but not everyone ends up with a poem worthy of the term, much less end up as poets. 

we all can paint a blank wall, but we cannot be all artists.  we can dance, why not, but not everyone has the grace or the stamina to become a dancer. 

we all can pick up a microphone and sing in a videoke, and the irritation caused by such kind of singing by some of us had become legendary, it had led to murder. 

which reminds me, anyone can dream of becoming a doctor, but not everyone has the aptitude and diligence to rise to the rigors of medical studies.
     

Point taken, Isles.

Poetry is a mix of figurative language combined, its  an intricate pattern of words placed together in such a way to convey a deep and powerful message to the world; the level of excellence depends on the writer's mastery.

My old English Literature professor, Dr. Kirkpatrick used to say, "anyone can be a poet, but not everyone can be a god-damn good poet." (this of course was said to reinforce the importance of English figurative language, symbolism etc.

i love to read poetry from the masters, the students, the beginner poets etc. Poetry, in my view, is like a feast on the table, we all should be encouraged to write poems (if the person is willing) and appreciate the poem despite the skill and status of the writer. Its okay if it isn't similar to Shelley's, Byron's, Bronte, and the like. The appreciation of poetry, and the poem, is the appreciation of the passion and the message within the poem.

:)

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #25 on: October 27, 2010, 05:59:04 AM »
My old English Literature professor, Dr. Kirkpatrick used to say, "anyone can be a poet, but not everyone can be a god-damn good poet." (this of course was said to reinforce the importance of English figurative language, symbolism etc.

:)

it is a statement of encouragement and not of fact, coming from a real good english literature professor, to say the least.  to enter a classroom filled with young people is to carry the dream that given the right encouragement and environment, there just might be one in the multitude of learners who could make it to the world's literary greats.  i would have said the same words if i were in the professor's place. :D     


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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #26 on: October 27, 2010, 06:42:38 AM »
Poetry, in my view, is like a feast on the table, we all should be encouraged to write poems (if the person is willing) and appreciate the poem despite the skill and status of the writer. :)


we partake of the feast at the table as we must, to honor the invitation, though we cannot take much more than we could chew.  we spit out the victuals that are tasteless, indigestible or, heaven forbid, even poisonous. ;)

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #27 on: October 27, 2010, 07:36:12 AM »
won't let this go, so i googled it.  hahaha!  "abandon all hope, all ye who enter here."  mao man kuno ni ang tattoo sa lobot sa usa ka powiter. ;D

Bwahaha! Which book man kuno makit-an ning hinanggawa, Ms. Isle? (Mahilig man gud ka ni Mistel Googel...)  ;D

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #28 on: October 27, 2010, 08:10:59 AM »
Bwahaha! Which book man kuno makit-an ning hinanggawa, Ms. Isle? (Mahilig man gud ka ni Mistel Googel...)  ;D

you know as much as i do, mistel motoy. ;D  googel gyod ni mistel googel, countercheck pa gyod ug libro kun makalugar aron di magpataka, sabe?

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hubag bohol

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #29 on: October 27, 2010, 08:13:30 AM »
you know as much as i do, mistel motoy. ;D  googel gyod ni mistel googel, countercheck pa gyod ug libro kun makalugar aron di magpataka, sabe?

Kay ngano, naa diay tigpataka, Ms. Aylandel?  ::)

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islander

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #30 on: October 27, 2010, 09:17:26 AM »
Kay ngano, naa diay tigpataka, Ms. Aylandel?  ::)

it doesn't follow, does it?  ang ako lang gipasabot nga maglikay kong magpataka kutob sa mahimo, sa akong kaugalingon, wa sa akong hunahuna kun naa bay laing tigpataka o wala.  pakon ta ka ron. ;D

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Lorenzo

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #31 on: October 27, 2010, 09:40:09 AM »
we partake of the feast at the table as we must, to honor the invitation, though we cannot take much more than we could chew.  we spit out the victuals that are tasteless, indigestible or, heaven forbid, even poisonous. ;)

Of course we are allowed to partake of the dinner table, whoever does not allow another brother to partake, should be ashamed. Practice makes perfect, the beginner poets can one day be great poets, and besides, in my personal point of view, there is so much 'juice' and 'internal dialogue' that is expressed in the poems of many a lover-poets, hating-poets, sad-poets, happy-poets (the whole echelon, hehe).

I used to talk to a good friend of mine, who was an English Lit. major, i was the non-traditional student (in the sense) to the class due to my background & strength in the Biological Sciences & History. In fact, another classmate I had , John, was a physics major. The both of us were the only two men to take that class and incidentally the two of us were the only non-english lit majors taking the class (we were taking it as an elective requirement). There was an assignment where our professor wanted us to analyze a classic poem; and then to write a poem and read to the class. The secondary assignment was for us, after reading and reciting the poem in class, to explain and identify the figurative languages used, the meaning and our own personal story that was used to write the poem (or an experience involved).

Sitting in the classroom listening to the students, many of whom were great orators, great linguists, some of them were beginners (there were underclassmen also taking this course), i developed a love, an interest for poetry. Doesn't have to be a master poet, can be a beginner poet, can even be a 'bad poet', but a poet none-theless. The appreciation on my part is not so much on the writing style; as there are multiple styles in poetry, but more so on the message being expressed. The raw emotional feelings , sensations that are expressed reminds us of old burns, recent burns, old passions, recent passions, and even for some---a sense of longing that one has never experienced.

So that said, let the poets (masters, intermediate, beginners, and even the 'not so good') share their thoughts. Let them.

There is beauty and humanism in poetry. Besides, many of the now-famous, now-accepted poets were once unaccepted and shunned during their own times.

Arthur Rimbaud , a French poet, best expounds on this:

A poet makes himself a visionary through a long, boundless, and systematized disorganization of all the senses. All forms of love, of suffering, of madness; he searches himself, he exhausts within himself all poisons, and preserves their quintessences. Unspeakable torment, where he will need the greatest faith, a superhuman strength, where he becomes all men: the great invalid, the great criminal, the great accursed—and the Supreme Scientist! For he attains the unknown! Because he has cultivated his soul, already rich, more than anyone! He attains the unknown, and, if demented, he finally loses the understanding of his visions, he will at least have seen them! So what if he is destroyed in his ecstatic flight through things unheard of, unnameable: other horrible workers will come; they will begin at the horizons where the first one has fallen!

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hubag bohol

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #32 on: October 27, 2010, 10:02:28 AM »
it doesn't follow, does it?  ang ako lang gipasabot nga maglikay kong magpataka kutob sa mahimo, sa akong kaugalingon, wa sa akong hunahuna kun naa bay laing tigpataka o wala.  pakon ta ka ron. ;D

He he, nganong defensive man ka? Tungod ba kaha kay sigi kang pangluwa sa imong natilawan nga way lami?  :-X

Bitaw, bahin sa panulat, ang akong nahinumdoman nga pasumbingay sa among maestro mao nga kun dili kuno ka ka-afford og mahalon nga perfume, ayaw na lang pagpahumot, kay ang baratohon makabwisit lang sa makahanggab niini...

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Lorenzo

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #33 on: October 27, 2010, 10:09:47 AM »
If I may say, that kind of a stark comment from a teacher, Hubag, is an example of an elitist , pretentious attitude. And in many cases, the one making condescending crass remarks on others, are usually the ones that best display the very remarks given. You should have told the teacher that just because a 'perfume, cologne' is "mahal", that does not usually mean it smells good. Gucci colognes are quite pricey, but are not as favorable-y pleasing as compared to Calvin Klein's "Euphoria" or Armani's "Aqua di Gio".

Ingon pood ahong maestro (of course this was in english): ang humut lami sa usa ka tawo, baho sa usa ka tawo. [Another man's trash, is another man's treasure.]

Everything is relative.

 ;)



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hubag bohol

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #34 on: October 27, 2010, 10:20:19 AM »
You should have told the teacher that just because a 'perfume, cologne' is "mahal", that does not usually mean it smells good. Gucci colognes are quite pricey, but are not as favorable-y pleasing as compared to Calvin Klein's "Euphoria" or Armani's "Aquia di Gio".

If I did, I'm sure he would have told me that I didn't get his point at all.

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Lorenzo

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #35 on: October 27, 2010, 10:22:06 AM »
If I did, I'm sure he would have told me that I didn't get his point at all.

Its fine, you have the right (any student) to stand up and disagree to the professor. A professor is not a god.
:)

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islander

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #36 on: October 27, 2010, 10:44:27 AM »
lorenzo/islander:

Of course we are allowed to partake of the dinner table, whoever does not allow another brother to partake, should be ashamed.

i will forbid a good friend to partake of a feast, or beg him at least to be discriminating in choosing which food to eat, when i know beforehand that some of the food, spoiled as they are, may cause botulism.
 
Practice makes perfect, the beginner poets can one day be great poets, and besides, in my personal point of view, there is so much 'juice' and 'internal dialogue' that is expressed in the poems of many a lover-poets, hating-poets, sad-poets, happy-poets (the whole echelon, hehe).

a lifetime of practice could not make a poet out of a non-poet.  it may improve one's grammar and add to one's vocabulary, but it won't change his sensibilities or his quality of work.

I used to talk to a good friend of mine, who was an English Lit. major, i was the non-traditional student (in the sense) to the class due to my background & strength in the Biological Sciences & History. In fact, another classmate I had , John, was a physics major. The both of us were the only two men to take that class and incidentally the two of us were the only non-english lit majors taking the class (we were taking it as an elective requirement). There was an assignment where our professor wanted us to analyze a classic poem; and then to write a poem and read to the class. The secondary assignment was for us, after reading and reciting the poem in class, to explain and identify the figurative languages used, the meaning and our own personal story that was used to write the poem (or an experience involved).

your class went through the usual process of poetry appreciation by letting you experience the process of creating poetry, which any self-respecting creative writing teacher ought to do.  if one of you became a poet in the real sense of the word (not just an interested one who loves to compose lines that sound poetic), then your teacher deserved all the accolades for opening those previously hidden springs and letting the creative waters pour forth.  as he was able to encourage the likes of you to pay attention to poetry, then he had not taught in vain.
 
Sitting in the classroom listening to the students, many of whom were great orators, great linguists, some of them were beginners (there were underclassmen also taking this course), i developed a love, an interest for poetry. Doesn't have to be a master poet, can be a beginner poet, can even be a 'bad poet', but a poet none-theless. The appreciation on my part is not so much on the writing style; as there are multiple styles in poetry, but more so on the message being expressed. The raw emotional feelings , sensations that are expressed reminds us of old burns, recent burns, old passions, recent passions, and even for some---a sense of longing that one has never experienced.

So that said, let the poets (masters, intermediate, beginners, and even the 'not so good') share their thoughts. Let them.

they should.  their works may even end up in hallmark cards.  but confound it, let the passage of years put them in the pantheon of poets.  it is not for them to call themselves poets.
 
There is beauty and humanism in poetry. Besides, many of the now-famous, now-accepted poets were once unaccepted and shunned during their own times.

as most poets were, and are.  sometimes, the opposite even happens.  compared to his wife elizabeth barrett browning, robert browning was considered a minor poet during the victorian period of his lifetime.  it was only in the 1960s that his works were taken more seriously, which turned out to be consistently sinewy.  it's his wife now who is deemed as the "lesser god".  as i've said earlier, people can write poetry or what passes off as poetry all they can, but rarely would a real poet rise from among them.

Arthur Rimbaud , a French poet, best expounds on this:

A poet makes himself a visionary through a long, boundless, and systematized disorganization of all the senses. All forms of love, of suffering, of madness; he searches himself, he exhausts within himself all poisons, and preserves their quintessences. Unspeakable torment, where he will need the greatest faith, a superhuman strength, where he becomes all men: the great invalid, the great criminal, the great accursed—and the Supreme Scientist! For he attains the unknown! Because he has cultivated his soul, already rich, more than anyone! He attains the unknown, and, if demented, he finally loses the understanding of his visions, he will at least have seen them! So what if he is destroyed in his ecstatic flight through things unheard of, unnameable: other horrible workers will come; they will begin at the horizons where the first one has fallen!

as in everything else, some do fall by the wayside, poets or not.  but there will always be others who will pick up from where someone had left off.  rimbaud himself, a prodigy, wrote all of his best poetry in less than five years while others took a lifetime.  he had what it took to be a poet that some should not pretend to have.


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hubag bohol

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #37 on: October 27, 2010, 10:45:00 AM »
Its fine, you have the right (any student) to stand up and disagree to the professor. A professor is not a god.
:)

He he, obviously you didn't get my point at all.

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #38 on: October 27, 2010, 10:57:21 AM »
Of course I did, my response was in the answer. ;)

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Re: Does a Poet Need Pain to Write?
« Reply #39 on: October 27, 2010, 10:59:31 AM »
lorenzo/islander:

Of course we are allowed to partake of the dinner table, whoever does not allow another brother to partake, should be ashamed.

i will forbid a good friend to partake of a feast, or beg him at least to be discriminating in choosing which food to eat, when i know beforehand that some of the food, spoiled as they are, may cause botulism.
 
Practice makes perfect, the beginner poets can one day be great poets, and besides, in my personal point of view, there is so much 'juice' and 'internal dialogue' that is expressed in the poems of many a lover-poets, hating-poets, sad-poets, happy-poets (the whole echelon, hehe).

a lifetime of practice could not make a poet out of a non-poet.  it may improve one's grammar and add to one's vocabulary, but it won't change his sensibilities or his quality of work.

I used to talk to a good friend of mine, who was an English Lit. major, i was the non-traditional student (in the sense) to the class due to my background & strength in the Biological Sciences & History. In fact, another classmate I had , John, was a physics major. The both of us were the only two men to take that class and incidentally the two of us were the only non-english lit majors taking the class (we were taking it as an elective requirement). There was an assignment where our professor wanted us to analyze a classic poem; and then to write a poem and read to the class. The secondary assignment was for us, after reading and reciting the poem in class, to explain and identify the figurative languages used, the meaning and our own personal story that was used to write the poem (or an experience involved).

your class went through the usual process of poetry appreciation by letting you experience the process of creating poetry, which any self-respecting creative writing teacher ought to do.  if one of you became a poet in the real sense of the word (not just an interested one who loves to compose lines that sound poetic), then your teacher deserved all the accolades for opening those previously hidden springs and letting the creative waters pour forth.  as he was able to encourage the likes of you to pay attention to poetry, then he had not taught in vain.
 
Sitting in the classroom listening to the students, many of whom were great orators, great linguists, some of them were beginners (there were underclassmen also taking this course), i developed a love, an interest for poetry. Doesn't have to be a master poet, can be a beginner poet, can even be a 'bad poet', but a poet none-theless. The appreciation on my part is not so much on the writing style; as there are multiple styles in poetry, but more so on the message being expressed. The raw emotional feelings , sensations that are expressed reminds us of old burns, recent burns, old passions, recent passions, and even for some---a sense of longing that one has never experienced.

So that said, let the poets (masters, intermediate, beginners, and even the 'not so good') share their thoughts. Let them.

they should.  their works may even end up in hallmark cards.  but confound it, let the passage of years put them in the pantheon of poets.  it is not for them to call themselves poets.
 
There is beauty and humanism in poetry. Besides, many of the now-famous, now-accepted poets were once unaccepted and shunned during their own times.

as most poets were, and are.  sometimes, the opposite even happens.  compared to his wife elizabeth barrett browning, robert browning was considered a minor poet during the victorian period of his lifetime.  it was only in the 1960s that his works were taken more seriously, which turned out to be consistently sinewy.  it's his wife now who is deemed as the "lesser god".  as i've said earlier, people can write poetry or what passes off as poetry all they can, but rarely would a real poet rise from among them.

Arthur Rimbaud , a French poet, best expounds on this:

A poet makes himself a visionary through a long, boundless, and systematized disorganization of all the senses. All forms of love, of suffering, of madness; he searches himself, he exhausts within himself all poisons, and preserves their quintessences. Unspeakable torment, where he will need the greatest faith, a superhuman strength, where he becomes all men: the great invalid, the great criminal, the great accursed—and the Supreme Scientist! For he attains the unknown! Because he has cultivated his soul, already rich, more than anyone! He attains the unknown, and, if demented, he finally loses the understanding of his visions, he will at least have seen them! So what if he is destroyed in his ecstatic flight through things unheard of, unnameable: other horrible workers will come; they will begin at the horizons where the first one has fallen!

as in everything else, some do fall by the wayside, poets or not.  but there will always be others who will pick up from where someone had left off.  rimbaud himself, a prodigy, wrote all of his best poetry in less than five years while others took a lifetime.  he had what it took to be a poet that some should not pretend to have.


Isles, but of course. As always, your input and your message is well appreciated. An exchange of thoughts, an exchange in appreciation of poetry, and poets (even the not so good; the beginners).

That said, I still encourage the poets out there (the good, and what some would say, 'the bad') to continue to share their written thoughts.

Great poets care not what the critics say, but what the heart speaks. 

:)



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