Author Topic: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation  (Read 17658 times)

Way Nada

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #40 on: December 09, 2011, 03:47:00 PM »
Ahong pasabot nga kung bato ning lugara nga i-reclaim di dili gyud ni mo-unlod. Kaning pung nga "sinking islands" sa pasipiko o asa pang dapita sa kalibutan gigamit ni sa mga "environmental alarmist" para hadlokon ang katawhan. Usa lang ka pananglitan naho nga kana si Ric Obedencio nga usa ka manunulat sa usa sa mga mantalaan sa Bohol; ijang gibalita nga ang duha ka isla sa Talibon... kalituban ug Guindakpan maunlod kuno tungod sa global warming. Kinsa man ang iyang gihadlok kundi kitang mga Bol-anon. Mao ni sila dad-on ka ug hadlok para motoo ka sa ilang issue sa environment.

WN

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renegade

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #41 on: June 03, 2012, 12:45:37 AM »
ARE U SURE ABOUT THIS??? The developers are planning to bring the mountains of Maribojoc to Panglao.  Meaning, they are going to quarry Maribojoc and supply the panambaks for the proposed project... That was and IS the real story...


Dia pa'y dugang nga info. Kining Dubai Island expected na nga mag-move mao bitaw na nga naay bukid sa Dubai nga gi-quarry nila ang bato. Ang mag-move kadtong mga gi-abuno nila sa ibabaw pero kadtong bas nga tua sa ilawom dili na to mag move kay compact na to.

Sa Panglao dili mahitabo nga mag-move kay bato ug mabaw ra ang tubig nga abunohan ug yuta. Swerte ang Bohol pero ug mo-entra na ang leftist idea nga anti capitalism mao nay ikamatay sa reclamation project.


WN

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chicogon

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #42 on: June 03, 2012, 01:18:32 AM »
Malunod jud (maski unsa pa nga klase sa Engineering) kay dili man natural (man-made, in other words). Unlike human creations, ang mga hinimo sa "nature" came into being by some "genius, mysterious but powerful design" nga tawgon na lang nato ug "God's creations."  8)

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Way Nada

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #43 on: June 08, 2012, 10:12:18 AM »
ARE U SURE ABOUT THIS??? The developers are planning to bring the mountains of Maribojoc to Panglao.  Meaning, they are going to quarry Maribojoc and supply the panambaks for the proposed project... That was and IS the real story...



I don't know about the issue of the Panglao reclamation is pushing through but if the project will continue my opinion is; "the engineering works are not like Dubai". I saw the area planned to be reclaimed. The water is up only to your knees and the bottom level is rock and connected to the mainland Panglao. If you try to analize that part of the seashore in Panglao... it is like a wasteland. It is unproductive because it too shallow. And you don't need to destroy mountain of Maribojoc to reclaim that part of  the seashore.

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renegade

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #44 on: June 09, 2012, 01:17:59 AM »
for me, I wont... but you can tell that to the developers......

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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #45 on: June 09, 2012, 04:18:39 AM »
1. it does not follow that leftist ideology is involved just because some people are against certain government projects.  a case in point is the church's stand against the rh bill.  does that make the church leftist?

2. the reasons given by opponents of the reclamation are there for the taking.  those environmental concerns don't need a passe political ideology to lean on. 

3. talk of capitalism, and here we have a capitalist who sorely lacks capital for a project like this reclamation.

4.  no shallow sea water is ever unproductive.  it may not have whales and sharks, but it has planktons and other organisms that contribute to the biodiversity, and thus the very existence, of the whole environment. 

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Way Nada

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #46 on: June 09, 2012, 02:53:15 PM »
Islander says:

[1. it does not follow that leftist ideology is involved just because some people are against certain government projects.]

Reply:

Normally leftists all over the world always try to prevent development initiated by capitalists. For example is the EPZA in Bataan. Developed in the 1970's  during the time of Marcos when the chinese people were still raising in their hands Mao's red book. The workers in Bataan were infiltrated by leftists and wanted to bankrupt the processing zone through labor strikes. The workers were told by their leftist patrons to destroy the machinery making the European investors shied away from the Philippines and went to China. And we can see the transformation of China today.

This is also the reason why California, New York, Ohio and other American states are bankrupt because of the leftist union in America. Wisconsin is trying to recover through the reform programs of Gov. Scott Walker. 

Who are against the reclamation development of Panglao... the capitalists?

And asks:

[a case in point is the church's stand against the rh bill.  does that make the church leftist?]

Reply:

In this case the church is conservative.

Islander says:

[2. the reasons given by opponents of the reclamation are there for the taking.  those environmental concerns don't need a passe political ideology to lean on.]

Reply:

Passe political ideology? Obama's program of government is the greening of America advocated by leftist ideology. He (Obama) is a leftist. He was elected president for being a community organizer. Are you not aware of that? IPCC is a powerful committee in the UN and all leftist governments all over the world agree to this IPCC. At present leftist governments want to take over the economy of the world. Global warming is their rallying cry.

Islander says:     

[3. talk of capitalism, and here we have a capitalist who sorely lacks capital for a project like this reclamation.]

Reply:

There you are! you got the point! So it is not about the environment but capitalists lacking capital. As far as I know developers of this project are from the Arab world. So they will be bringing petro dollars to Bohol. This is a bonanza but I believe there is truth to the rumor that Filipinos adopt in their way of life... the culture of envy.

Islander says:

[4.  no shallow sea water is ever unproductive.]

Reply:

How do you know? Of course that shallow water still has sea shells as production. Gusto ba lang nimo nga ang mga taga Panglao magasige na lang ug panginhas?

Islander says:

[it may not have whales and sharks, but it has planktons and other organisms that contribute to the biodiversity, and thus the very existence, of the whole environment.]

Reply:

I thought the ideology from the left is passe but here you are displaying your leftist ideology. Planktons? Are you talking about planktons? This organism are all over the oceans of the world. Try to look at the map of the world and point with your finger where Panglao is?

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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #47 on: June 10, 2012, 02:57:31 AM »
Normally leftists all over the world always try to prevent development initiated by capitalists.

my apologies if i wonder what your basis is for such a sweeping claim (i.e., “normally leftists all over the world always try to prevent development initiated by capitalists”).  it may not stand scrutiny because it may also mean that leftists won't prevent development initiated by other sectors other than those by capitalists.   

For example is the EPZA in Bataan. Developed in the 1970's  during the time of Marcos when the chinese people were still raising in their hands Mao's red book. The workers in Bataan were infiltrated by leftists and wanted to bankrupt the processing zone through labor strikes. The workers were told by their leftist patrons to destroy the machinery making the European investors shied away from the Philippines and went to China.

i shudder at the jumps to a series of conclusions here; from leftists all over the world preventing development projects to china's transformation because those leftists drove the europeans to it.

oh, one more thing, why equate capitalism with government projects and dub those against these as leftists?  is the world that black and white?

And we can see the transformation of China today.

china was transformed because the europeans went to it from the philippines, where they shied away from leftists?  incredible.

despite china's transformation today (thanks to its “leftist” aka communist and thus anti-capitalist government, if we have to go by your definition), the Bataan Export Processing Zone (BEPZ) exists today. 

[It] is located in a cove at the southern tip of the Bataan Peninsula. It is about 172.3 kilometers from Manila via the Bataan Provincial Expressway and North Luzon Expressway, Gapan-Olongapo Road and Roman Highway. It has a total land area of 153.9km² representing 12% of the total land area of Bataan. (wikipedia)

lastly, china, a communist country (leftist to you) fired its economy with capitalistic ventures.  by making the country an example of enviable economic development, you've just revealed that being leftist and capitalist can go hand in hand after all. 

thus, "normally all leftists all over the world try to prevent development initiated by capitalists" it isn't.

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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #48 on: June 10, 2012, 03:08:58 AM »
This is also the reason why California, New York, Ohio and other American states are bankrupt because of the leftist union in America. Wisconsin is trying to recover through the reform programs of Gov. Scott Walker.

in 2010, yes, along with 29 other states, according to one data.  we all know the role of wall street in the world of finance.  well, wall st. isn't exactly leftist, huh? 

wall street greed, american overconsumption and extreme indebtedness of the u.s. economy are just three of the myriad of causes of american recession that eventually became global.  besides, no leftist union in the u.s., if ever such a kind exists as you claim, can bankrupt the whole country; no analysis mentions such leftist union as the cause of the recession.  if ever you come across one, and maybe you have because of your stated claim, please share your reference.  i can hardly wait to read it.

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chicogon

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #49 on: June 10, 2012, 03:23:48 AM »
 8) Minaw lang kos mga brayt kay leftist baja kos una nahimong karong capitalist bwahaha  8)



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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #50 on: June 10, 2012, 03:30:43 AM »
Who are against the reclamation development of Panglao... the capitalists?

because it comes naturally to you to brand people opposed to certain projects as “leftists”, let me first share with you what my understanding is of the word (thanks to merriam-webster), which i believe is far from those so-called “leftists” of your youth in the '60s and '70s that you seem to carry over until now like a turtle carries its shell.
 
In politics, the Left, left-wing and leftists are people or views which generally support social change to create a more egalitarian society.  They usually involve a concern for those in society who are disadvantaged relative to others and an assumption that there are unjustified inequalities (which right-wing politics views as natural or traditional) that should be reduced or abolished.

the way i see it, leftists are not necessarily anti-capitalist, as you claim.  they're simply the opposite of rightists.  and rightists need not be capitalists.

so what is a capitalist?  he is but “A wealthy person who uses money to invest in trade and industry for profit in accordance with the principles of capitalism”.

Capitalism, meanwhile, is “an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market”

i cannot imagine that opponents of the reclamation project like the PARE are leftists.  some are local government officials, others are fisherfolk out to defend their source of livelihood, still others are environmentalists.  it's not fair to lump all of them together as leftists and the likes of you and those who favor the project as rightists.  besides, it's silly to inject ideologies to a proposed tourism infrastructure project.  we're not talking of a new form of government here, right?     

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Lorenzo

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #51 on: June 10, 2012, 03:47:30 AM »
8) Minaw lang kos mga brayt kay leftist baja kos una nahimong karong capitalist bwahaha  8)



such is the flow of things, Father. Normally, people tend to be left-leaning in their youth, then change views later on in life.

bwahahaha ;)

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Lorenzo

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #52 on: June 10, 2012, 03:48:12 AM »
i must say that both Ms. Isles and Sir Way Nada have credible points. Good job on the retorts, guys. keep it coming.... ;)

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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #53 on: June 10, 2012, 03:51:42 AM »
8) Minaw lang kos mga brayt kay leftist baja kos una nahimong karong capitalist bwahaha  8)

maayo na lang... makalingaw mi sa gahilomhilom nga brayt labaw.

variations of the same theme:

   Any man who is not a socialist at age 20 has no heart.
   Any man who is still a socialist at age 40 has no head.
                              -attributed to Georges Clemenceau

Bennet Cerf once reported Clemenceau's response to a visitor's alarm about his son being a communist:

   If he had not become a Communist at 22, I would have disowned him.
   If he is still a Communist at 30, I will do it then.

philippine version:

   at 20, a man is a communist.
   at 30, he is a socialist.
   at 40, he is a capitalist.

pakapin:

   at 50, he is a pensioner.
   at 60, he is a senior citizen on discount privileges.
   at 70, nearer my god to thee.
    ;D

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Lorenzo

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chicogon

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #55 on: June 10, 2012, 04:01:53 AM »
i must say that both Ms. Isles and Sir Way Nada have credible points. Good job on the retorts, guys. keep it coming.... ;)

Both have good arguments but I tend to side with Ms. Isle. I think injecting ideologies to infrastructure developments in Bohol this early (or without evidence) makes no sense; on the other hand, it's easier to point fingers to politics as cause of this commotion.

If I was 20, I would have been against anything - just anything. Now, I'm for all kinds of developments... from self to infrastrcutures. Whatevah!  ;D I'm a Pinoy and envious of what I've seen elsewhere.  8)



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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #56 on: June 10, 2012, 04:07:33 AM »
In this case the church is conservative.

as obama is a liberal.

is the church not leftist in this case for you because it is not opposing a project by capitalists?  what if we find out that it's a project by colonialists instead?  will the opponents this time be called natives?  just asking.

well, some of those who oppose the reclamation project may not give a whit about ideology at all when the very survival of their source of livelihood is at stake.     

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islander

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #57 on: June 10, 2012, 04:30:19 AM »
If I was 20, I would have been against anything - just anything.

no wonder your dad did not disown you. ;D

Now, I'm for all kinds of developments... from self to infrastrcutures. Whatevah!  ;D I'm a Pinoy and envious of what I've seen elsewhere.  8)

admittedly, so am i, most especially of europe and its heritage. 

but to each his country's own time.  it's great to develop (materially, in this sense), but without losing sight of our priorities.  we have become what we are with what we have, and i believe we like what we are.  why be like, say, singapore, which developed so fast while its population, socially pressured to reach for the skies materially, have become generally cold and inconsiderate (with apologies to the exceptions). 

meanwhile, despite of or because of our pace of material development, we can still say that we have remained true to our faith and values and traditions and have remained a smiling people.

one of my proudest moments in dubai (a very rich and very developed city) was when a filipino friend was told this by a caucasian she met on the street: you filipinos have brought laughter to this country.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #58 on: June 10, 2012, 04:37:54 AM »
Passe political ideology? Obama's program of government is the greening of America advocated by leftist ideology. He (Obama) is a leftist. He was elected president for being a community organizer. Are you not aware of that? IPCC is a powerful committee in the UN and all leftist governments all over the world agree to this IPCC. At present leftist governments want to take over the economy of the world. Global warming is their rallying cry.

heavens.  now you're in the position to call another country's president as leftist.  no, i'm not aware that he was elected for being a community organizer.  i doubt too that americans who voted him into office had that as their reason.  to be concerned with the environment is to be leftist?

the  Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) of the UN is a leftist concern?  worse, leftist governments want to take over the world's economy?  please share more research-based claims with references and not imaginary figments of paranoia.  and please tell me this is not science fiction nor manga comics.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #59 on: June 10, 2012, 04:45:27 AM »
There you are! you got the point! So it is not about the environment but capitalists lacking capital. As far as I know developers of this project are from the Arab world. So they will be bringing petro dollars to Bohol. This is a bonanza but I believe there is truth to the rumor that Filipinos adopt in their way of life... the culture of envy.

yes, i'm here, and unfortunately you didn't get my point.  i mentioned this detail on capital because you call those who oppose the project as “leftists” who are against “capitalism”.  the mere mention of "capitalists" is not about doing away with the environment.  the game is football and you want to score with slam dunks?  by the way, sacrificing one's environmental diversity for petro dollars is no cause for envy.

meanwhile, please read up on the requirements of putting up a project such as this, which the proponents are said to have failed to meet.  the links:
   
http://tubagbohol.mikeligalig.com/index.php?topic=38469.0
http://www.theboholstandard.com/fpage.php?issue=240&s1

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #60 on: June 10, 2012, 04:52:53 AM »
How do you know? Of course that shallow water still has sea shells as production. Gusto ba lang nimo nga ang mga taga Panglao magasige na lang ug panginhas?

how do i know?  i passed high school biology, that's how i know.  i've also read up the pros and cons of this project sans ideological stereotypes.  unsa man diay ang mahitabo kun pananglit matuman ang reclamation project, ang manginhasay sa una mahimong hoteliers?

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #61 on: June 10, 2012, 05:04:24 AM »
I thought the ideology from the left is passe but here you are displaying your leftist ideology. Planktons? Are you talking about planktons? This organism are all over the oceans of the world. Try to look at the map of the world and point with your finger where Panglao is?

ugh.  what have planktons got to do with ideology?  i am leftist just because I mentioned planktons?  am i discussing my views here with an octopus? 

what is more passe than a leftist ideology is for one to carry one's black-and-white politics of one's youth like a turtle carries its shell and start wondering why other creatures have no shells on their backs. 
 
no, thanks.  i've dipped my feet in panglao.  i don't need to point at it with my finger or my toe on a world map.  besides, i can pass off as a little mermaid at home with the planktons.

the little mermaid had enjoyed this discussion.  with thanks. 

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #62 on: June 10, 2012, 06:42:37 AM »
Hmm, will this thread continue to discombobulate the rest of us, or will it henceforth sink into oblivion? ::)

;D

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #63 on: June 10, 2012, 09:39:43 AM »
Islander says:

[my apologies if i wonder what your basis is for such a sweeping claim (i.e., “normally leftists all over the world always try to prevent development initiated by capitalists”).  it may not stand scrutiny because it may also mean that leftists won't prevent development initiated by other sectors other than those by capitalists.]

Reply:

That is not only a claim but it is based on leftist belief that the government is the sole mover in the management of the economy. If the private sector will participate they should be taxed to the hilt. Mura'g sharia law ning klaseha sa gobierno.

Other sectors like the academe, the church, the media and others are also influenced by the left demonizing capitalists as a vain to society. They always initiate class warfare. Try to scrutinize the Obama administration. 

Islander says:

[i shudder at the jumps to a series of conclusions here; from leftists all over the world preventing development projects to china's transformation because those leftists drove the europeans to it.]

Reply:

The style of the left disrupting economic development is true! Example in the Philippines is Carnation Milk Cannery located in Marikina before... crippled in a strike by KMU workers was bought by Alaska Milk Corporation. Through arbitration the workers at Carnation Milk were integrated by Alaska at their warehouse at San Pedro, Laguna. Since the workers were affiliated with KMU they influenced the workers of Alaska Milk and the same occurrence in Marikina where they destroyed canning machinery they also employed at Alaska Milk. These leftist workers are destructive. They are not after the protection of their jobs but the destruction of the Philippine economy. This is only an example happened in the Philippines and it is also happening in other parts of the world in other shape or form.

Islander says:

[oh, one more thing, why equate capitalism with government projects and dub those against these as leftists?  is the world that black and white?]

Reply:

Why should I equate Capitalism with government projects? When I asked; "Who are against the reclamation development of Panglao... the capitalists?" These capitalists are also part of the people and of course they are not against the development of Panglao therefore what I mean is; it's the leftist who are against the development project.

Islander says:

[china was transformed because the europeans went to it from the philippines, where they shied away from leftists?  incredible.]

Reply:

Why incredible? Are you not aware of Mattel a British company packed up their things in Bataan EPZA and tranferred them to China because the KMU were destroying their machinery? Dunlop the makers of tennis balls are gone also. Try to put this in your mind! Chinese in the 70's are all wearing Mao shirts and do not understand what is Capitalism. Now China is a capitalist country.

Islander says:

[despite china's transformation today (thanks to its “leftist” aka communist and thus anti-capitalist government, if we have to go by your definition), the Bataan Export Processing Zone (BEPZ) exists today.]

Reply:

Do not put your political mind in a rigmarole. Simply put it this way. China with a communist government is adopting a capitalist economic system. That is the transformation of China. If they have workers like the KMU China cannot transform what she is today.

Islander says: 

[[It] is located in a cove at the southern tip of the Bataan Peninsula. It is about 172.3 kilometers from Manila via the Bataan Provincial Expressway and North Luzon Expressway, Gapan-Olongapo Road and Roman Highway. It has a total land area of 153.9km² representing 12% of the total land area of Bataan. (wikipedia)]

Reply:

No comment!

Islander says:

[lastly, china, a communist country (leftist to you) fired its economy with capitalistic ventures.  by making the country an example of enviable economic development, you've just revealed that being leftist and capitalist can go hand in hand after all.]

Reply:

Yes... they are adopting the capitalist economic system but is there presence of labor unions with the ferocity of a wild animal like the KMU? Does the communist system of government allowed the organization of labor unions in the public and private sectors and have granted workers the right to strike?

Of course leftist and capitalist can go hand in hand if the left does not put politics above the country's progress. Just like America before the rise of Obama. The Social Security which was initiated by Roosevelt was a leftist agenda but it did not advocate for a change in the system. This is what Americans called Liberalism!

Islander says:   

[thus, "normally all leftists all over the world try to prevent development initiated by capitalists" it isn't.]

Reply:

Don't say it is not... because right now in front of your eyes it is happening. For example in Europe big companies are taxed for polluting the environment. Airlines entering European air space are to be taxed for polluting the air. The government of Obama is trying to pass a "Cap and Trade" laws to tax plants accross the US believed to be polluting the environment. In Australia the government passed the Carbon Tax Law. All of these is war against Capitalism.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #64 on: June 10, 2012, 09:48:08 AM »
Islander says:

[how do i know?  i passed high school biology, that's how i know.  i've also read up the pros and cons of this project sans ideological stereotypes.  unsa man diay ang mahitabo kun pananglit matuman ang reclamation project, ang manginhasay sa una mahimong hoteliers?]

Reply:

You passed HS biology? There are many in Tagbilaran who gradutated course in Commerce but right at this very moment they are driving trycicle. In the countryside they cannot be employed as accountants so they are taking over the work of their father as farmers. But most they go to the Middle East to work or as domestic helps in some other countries. The chance to progress in your own land is nil because so-so folks always tried to block development projects initiated by the the capitalists.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #65 on: June 10, 2012, 10:26:34 AM »
Islander says:

[in 2010, yes, along with 29 other states, according to one data.  we all know the role of wall street in the world of finance.  well, wall st. isn't exactly leftist, huh?

Deleted..............]

Reply:

Walay "role" ang wall street sa akong boot pasabot. Imo mang gikutlo "out of context" ang akong gisulti. Ug di gani wa lang jud masabti ang ahong gisuwat. Mao ni ahong gisuwat;

"This is also the reason why California, New York, Ohio and other American states are bankrupt because of the leftist union in America. Wisconsin is trying to recover through the reform programs of Gov. Scott Walker."

Kana ako nang gisuwat dugtong mahitungod sa mga leftist nga ang gusto i-bangkarote ang mga negosyo.

Ang akong boot pasabot sa akong gisuwat ug pananglitan ang California ug nganong na-bangkarote? Tungod sa sobra ng abuso sa "government union" sa ilang "entitlement" nga dili na sayon ihatag ang ilang entitlement tungod sa kataas. Niadtong nagpakanaog ang gobierno ug mga balaod aron buhisan ang mga kapitalista wa sila [kapitalista] mosugot nga taasan ang ilang buhis mao kining mga kapitalista sa California nanglayas ngadto sa Texas, Florida, South Carolina ug sa uban pang mga estado diin sila maka negosyo nga gamay ra ang bayronon sa buhis. Mao na nga na-bangkarote karon ang California.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #66 on: June 10, 2012, 01:47:28 PM »
one of my proudest moments in dubai (a very rich and very developed city) was when a filipino friend was told this by a caucasian she met on the street: you filipinos have brought laughter to this country.

... and that's the other part of me that keeps wishing Philippine stays the same - progressive but not progressive enough like the U.S.A. or other first world countries - because I want us to keep our sanity to a safe level. Progress has its price!!! 80-90 % of our people (no academic evidence though) don't even have a clue what I'm insinuating about. Too na alng god aron madali, bwahahaha!!!  ;D



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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #67 on: June 11, 2012, 12:43:04 PM »
... and that's the other part of me that keeps wishing Philippine stays the same - progressive but not progressive enough like the U.S.A. or other first world countries - because I want us to keep our sanity to a safe level. Progress has its price!!! 80-90 % of our people (no academic evidence though) don't even have a clue what I'm insinuating about. Too na alng god aron madali, bwahahaha!!!  ;D

yes, tuo na lang ko.  some posts are getting denser at every turn, mao nga maayo tuod nga madali na lang.  let it be said though that since i am a leftist after all, then i am writing this with my left foot. ;D

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #68 on: June 11, 2012, 09:03:11 PM »
That is not only a claim but it is based on leftist belief that the government is the sole mover in the management of the economy. If the private sector will participate they should be taxed to the hilt. Mura'g sharia law ning klaseha sa gobierno.

Other sectors like the academe, the church, the media and others are also influenced by the left demonizing capitalists as a vain to society. They always initiate class warfare. Try to scrutinize the Obama administration. 

I try not to be dragged into pedestrian thought processes but this kind of pretentious analysis makes me sick. Any tenth-rate intellectual who says "vain" instead of "bane" is a vain TB member who is a bane to this forum.   

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #69 on: June 12, 2012, 06:50:59 AM »
I try not to be dragged into pedestrian thought processes but this kind of pretentious analysis makes me sick. Any tenth-rate intellectual who says "vain" instead of "bane" is a vain TB member who is a bane to this forum.   

Pretentious? Then show to me your unpretentious opinion. If you believe you are correct I'm sorry to tell you I'll stick to my usage of the word "vain". I dare you to argue with me dealing only with issues. If you are really a good english speaker com'n my friend.... don't get mad! My name is Odan Matig-a of Tagbilaran. Tell me what's yours and don't hide with an alias. The issue here is Panglao reclamation!   

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #70 on: June 12, 2012, 09:30:03 AM »
Sir Way Nada as well as Ms. Isles present very valid points and present to the table the two sides of the coin in regards to this issue regarding the Panglao Reclamation Project. We all value the intelligence and the maturity in their postings, as well as the beauty of intellectual discourse that they present for us all to share in. Let's all continue to share in the topic and respect differences in opinion. Thanks, guys.


:)

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #71 on: June 12, 2012, 09:42:50 AM »
Islander says:

[in 2010, yes, along with 29 other states, according to one data.  we all know the role of wall street in the world of finance.  well, wall st. isn't exactly leftist, huh?

Deleted..............]

Reply:

Walay "role" ang wall street sa akong boot pasabot. Imo mang gikutlo "out of context" ang akong gisulti. Ug di gani wa lang jud masabti ang ahong gisuwat. Mao ni ahong gisuwat;

"This is also the reason why California, New York, Ohio and other American states are bankrupt because of the leftist union in America. Wisconsin is trying to recover through the reform programs of Gov. Scott Walker."

Kana ako nang gisuwat dugtong mahitungod sa mga leftist nga ang gusto i-bangkarote ang mga negosyo.

Ang akong boot pasabot sa akong gisuwat ug pananglitan ang California ug nganong na-bangkarote? Tungod sa sobra ng abuso sa "government union" sa ilang "entitlement" nga dili na sayon ihatag ang ilang entitlement tungod sa kataas. Niadtong nagpakanaog ang gobierno ug mga balaod aron buhisan ang mga kapitalista wa sila [kapitalista] mosugot nga taasan ang ilang buhis mao kining mga kapitalista sa California nanglayas ngadto sa Texas, Florida, South Carolina ug sa uban pang mga estado diin sila maka negosyo nga gamay ra ang bayronon sa buhis. Mao na nga na-bangkarote karon ang California.

Sir,

You're very accurate in regards to the situation in the states, especially that of California. One of the problems with states with liberal policies and liberal fiscal policies is that the priority is put in social services sector while not accounting for or the provisions in government to pay for said services. These past 2 years, the State of California had to actually cut down teaching positions in the state, as well as closing some mental health facilities because of the pragmatism as well as the inefficiency of the state to handle the indebtedness of the state.

While I am in no ways against social services sector, per say, especially human services profession, however, I believe that there should be a responsibility within the government to monitor the expenditure in regards to the state's income, accounting for GDP of the state. There should be a balanced view of environmentalism as well as human services agencies, but all within the ability for the state to afford said programs.

Going "all out" and spending frivolously in environmentalism as well as human services sector as what the State of California had done in years past was the catalyst for the situation the state was placed in during the 2008-2011 years. I would also say that the same phenomena is occurring in other states in the mainland.



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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #72 on: June 12, 2012, 10:13:17 AM »
... and that's the other part of me that keeps wishing Philippine stays the same - progressive but not progressive enough like the U.S.A. or other first world countries - because I want us to keep our sanity to a safe level. Progress has its price!!! 80-90 % of our people (no academic evidence though) don't even have a clue what I'm insinuating about. Too na alng god aron madali, bwahahaha!!!  ;D



he he he he! truly, there is beauty in simplicity. in simplicity, there is perfection. the moment one becomes complex, dali ra kaayo ma apektahan ang tawo og ang processes. mao na daghan kaayo ang level of depression sa industrialized nations. sa america, itawn, daghan kaayo mga patyente nga gi suffer of clinical depression! i would like to compare the depression levels of first world countries to that of developing countries; a quantitative and qualitative analysis would be good , actually.

depression-associated with over work is usually common theme sa mga patients nako. i wonder if depression is even as common in the philippines as it is here in the u.s.a.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #73 on: June 12, 2012, 11:18:13 AM »
Going "all out" and spending frivolously in environmentalism as well as human services sector as what the State of California had done in years past was the catalyst for the situation the state was placed in during the 2008-2011 years. I would also say that the same phenomena is occurring in other states in the mainland.

so, lorenz, was this frivolous spending a leftist ideology imposed by a leftist president?  or is this one more showcase of american spending spree? 

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #74 on: June 12, 2012, 11:32:58 AM »
i wonder if depression is even as common in the philippines as it is here in the u.s.a.

not depression in the u.s. sense.  remember that devastating typhoon that flooded manila?  u.s. soldiers who were around to help were struck over how people went about retrieving what was left of their lives, smiling.  had this been in the u.s., the stress would have been unbearable with people complaining just about anything (i can't quote directly, but the sense is there... it would take me ages to retrieve the exact quote).  in adversity, the heroes in us come out.  those words are not mine either.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #75 on: June 12, 2012, 12:14:10 PM »
so, lorenz, was this frivolous spending a leftist ideology imposed by a leftist president?  or is this one more showcase of american spending spree? 

actually, the environmentalism seen in california was not because of obama, but because of the policies enacted by past presidents such as bush sr, clinton, and even bush jr. the total and complete blame should not be placed on obama, who actually inherited a devastated american economy.

you're right tho, isles, american overconsumerism is a pivotoral reason for the financial catastrophe of '08; one contributing factor were the sub prime mortgages on homes, the uncontrolled loaning to home-owners, as well as student loans. the problem was that there was a lack of regulation. when the economy tanked, considering how the US economy is linked with the global economy, the waves was felt worldwide.

i believe that we are learning from our mistakes ; a better fiscal policy should be enacted if the united states wishes to evade similar incidents later on. but only time will tell.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #76 on: June 12, 2012, 12:19:08 PM »
not depression in the u.s. sense.  remember that devastating typhoon that flooded manila?  u.s. soldiers who were around to help were struck over how people went about retrieving what was left of their lives, smiling.  had this been in the u.s., the stress would have been unbearable with people complaining just about anything (i can't quote directly, but the sense is there... it would take me ages to retrieve the exact quote).  in adversity, the heroes in us come out.  those words are not mine either.

yes, isles, an example of the latter was hurricane katrina. as for the filipino's ability to bear hardships with a smile, it is because the pinoys are probably used to an environment where need is common theme. poverty is quite common in the philippines, and the people have developed almost a tolerance , an increased threshold to such instances. in the united states, however, if walay kwarta, if walay trabaho, dali ra mo depend ni uncle sammy kai tagaan ra'g unemployment / welfare checks og food stamps. sa pilipinas itawn, the concept of a federally mandated welfare system does not exist in the sense that it exists in the united states.



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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #77 on: June 12, 2012, 12:34:09 PM »
i also believe there is nothing wrong with environmentalism, one must take care to maintain the health of the ecology of one's nation. the absence of government's policy in protecting environment will lead to unregulated eutrophication of rivers, streams and kettle lakes.

one example of eutrophication as a result of a lack of governmental interest in environmental health is in china. the rivers and lakes of china have experienced devastating eutrophication because of the unregulation of industrial companies who merely dump waste onto rivers, streams, and lakes. one specific example is Lake Tai, Dianchi Lake.

it's actually quite sad when government adopts a purely capitalistic policy without any environmental policy. i believe there should be a balance; its all about maintaining the homeostasis of : 1) the nation's economy and 2) the nation's natural environment.


Lake Dianchi in Kunming, China. EUTROPHICATION.

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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #78 on: June 12, 2012, 01:45:49 PM »
he he he he! truly, there is beauty in simplicity. in simplicity, there is perfection. the moment one becomes complex, dali ra kaayo ma apektahan ang tawo og ang processes. mao na daghan kaayo ang level of depression sa industrialized nations. sa america, itawn, daghan kaayo mga patyente nga gi suffer of clinical depression! i would like to compare the depression levels of first world countries to that of developing countries; a quantitative and qualitative analysis would be good , actually.

depression-associated with over work is usually common theme sa mga patients nako. i wonder if depression is even as common in the philippines as it is here in the u.s.a.

In the U.S. there's almost one mental clinic (psych ward) per city or county; in the Pihilippines, you can count a few for the whole country.... that's the big difference in the two!!!  ;D





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Re: Dubai Reclamation Island Is Sinking: Warning to Panglao Reclamation
« Reply #79 on: June 12, 2012, 01:49:23 PM »
not depression in the u.s. sense.  remember that devastating typhoon that flooded manila?  u.s. soldiers who were around to help were struck over how people went about retrieving what was left of their lives, smiling.  had this been in the u.s., the stress would have been unbearable with people complaining just about anything (i can't quote directly, but the sense is there... it would take me ages to retrieve the exact quote).  in adversity, the heroes in us come out.  those words are not mine either.

Quote me on this: I buried more people who died of clinical depression in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina than as a direct result of the hurricane/flood itself  ???



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