Author Topic: How Did Roman Empire Deteriorated And Totally Collapsed? (Read 16918 times)

Datu Dagohoy · « **on:** March 21, 2009, 05:35:36 PM »

Was it collapsed because of single German traitor ?

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #1 on:** March 21, 2009, 09:13:22 PM »

No.

The Roman Empire collapsed due to multifactorial causes:

1. A corrupt political system that did not operate properly as compared to the Age of Augustus, Tiberius, Hadrian, Trajan, Diocletian and other Great Emperors.

2. Over-taxation of the Empire. Overtaxation lead to the rise of sentiments, yet at the same time, Taxation was necessary in order to maintain the day-to-day operation of the massive corporate venture that was the 'Roman Empire'.

3. Continuous warefare. Rome did not experience peace for more than 50 years in its days of existence. It warred openly with the Gauls, Germanians, Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Dacians, Thracians, Sassamids, Arabs, Slavs etc. Due to its operations abroad lead to the overstretching of its military and thus necessitating the need to tax the citizenry.

4. Corruption from within.

Rome did not fall due to a mere individual. It was the political, economic and social climate within the Empire and in the City of Rome itself that led to the fall of the Western Roman Empire.

Please not that Rome did not just 'FALL' in one day. The fall of Rome was a gradual process that took years to occur. And even then, only the Western Roman Empire fell. The Eastern Roman Empire, founded by Constantine the Great continued on to live until the 15th century AD. Under a new name: The Byzantine Empire.

Cheers.

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Datu Dagohoy · « **Reply #2 on:** March 22, 2009, 04:59:36 PM »

No.

The Roman Empire collapsed due to multifactorial causes:

1. A corrupt political system that did not operate properly as compared to the Age of Augustus, Tiberius, Hadrian, Trajan, Diocletian and other Great Emperors.

2. Over-taxation of the Empire. Overtaxation lead to the rise of sentiments, yet at the same time, Taxation was necessary in order to maintain the day-to-day operation of the massive corporate venture that was the 'Roman Empire'.

3. Continuous warefare. Rome did not experience peace for more than 50 years in its days of existence. It warred openly with the Gauls, Germanians, Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Dacians, Thracians, Sassamids, Arabs, Slavs etc. Due to its operations abroad lead to the overstretching of its military and thus necessitating the need to tax the citizenry.

4. Corruption from within.

Rome did not fall due to a mere individual. It was the political, economic and social climate within the Empire and in the City of Rome itself that led to the fall of the Western Roman Empire.

Please not that Rome did not just 'FALL' in one day. The fall of Rome was a gradual process that took years to occur. And even then, only the Western Roman Empire fell. The Eastern Roman Empire, founded by Constantine the Great continued on to live until the 15th century AD. Under a new name: The Byzantine Empire.

Cheers.

How about Martin Luther, I thought he was one responsible to weakened and led to collapsed the strongest and powerful Roman Empire.

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ben · « **Reply #3 on:** March 22, 2009, 05:14:09 PM »

How about Martin Luther, I thought he was one responsible to weakened and led to collapsed the strongest and powerful Roman Empire.

Ah, you mean the Holy Roman Empire. That was later than the Classical Roman Empire. Think of it as a medieval version of the European Union.

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windgate · « **Reply #4 on:** March 22, 2009, 05:33:01 PM »

Bai datz. Nagsige ciguro ka ug tan aw anang night of the museum kay nag abot abot na man tanan. hehehe

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Datu Dagohoy · « **Reply #5 on:** March 22, 2009, 05:35:51 PM »

Ah, you mean the Holy Roman Empire. That was later than the Classical Roman Empire. Think of it as a medieval version of the European Union.

you mean to say that there was an Un-Holy Roman Empire, who were those well known personalities involved in that Empire other than Emperor Constantine whom the key to Christianized the entire empire?

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reign beau · « **Reply #6 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:33:28 PM »

Sorry, sa topic starter. Pero, naglibog lagi ko ani nga thread.

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windgate · « **Reply #7 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:40:43 PM »

Sorry, sa topic starter. Pero, naglibog lagi ko ani nga thread.

kahinumdum ka adtong artista sir nga si ako si ikaw? mao na si bay datz or to put it bluntly kana bitawng programa ni joey de leon nga wow mali. pareparehas ra ani. hehehe ...peace bai datz

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #8 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:49:45 PM »

you mean to say that there was an Un-Holy Roman Empire, who were those well known personalities involved in that Empire other than Emperor Constantine whom the key to Christianized the entire empire?

Datu Dagohoy,

The Holy Roman Empire was nothing more than a name that was utilized by the Germano-Frankish peoples that populated the Holy Roman Empire under the banner of Charlemagne.

The reason why the term, 'Holy Roman Empire' was used by the Germano-Franks was to give a sense of religious-political legitimacy to their Imperial Status.

It was not a Roman Empire, in the literary sense, since the City of Rome was not the capital. But it, did, however, gain the blessings and support of the Papacy in Rome; thereby gaining authority and legitimacy.

Roman Catholicism was the Imperial State religion of the Holy Roman Empire. And as a political structure and unit, it did facilitate and augment the spread of Roman Catholicism (Christianity in the sense, considering there was no concept of multidenominations prior to the Protestant Reformation in the 16th century).

What the Roman Empire started, the Holy Roman Empire under the Germano-Franks built upon. It was Europe's version of trying to establish a sense of unified order and absolutism that was common and nostalgic of the epochs under the Classic Roman Empire. The Empire that was ruled under the God-Emperors (The Caesar's)

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reign beau · « **Reply #9 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:51:41 PM »

kahinumdum ka adtong artista sir nga si ako si ikaw? mao na si bay datz or to put it bluntly kana bitawng programa ni joey de leon nga wow mali. pareparehas ra ani. hehehe ...peace bai datz

Sige lang, windgate. Mag basa-basa sa lang ko kay unsaon daghan ko apsonon. Interested lang ko aning Roman Empire kay it ruled over Rome some two thousand years ago. It influenced greatly on culture and western civilization.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #10 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:56:36 PM »

How about Martin Luther, I thought he was one responsible to weakened and led to collapsed the strongest and powerful Roman Empire.

Datu Dagohoy,

Martin Luther was a Catholic German monk who found inadequacies in the practices of the Roman Catholic Church prior to the Great Reformation. Corruption, selling of forgiveness and the lot was widespread. And his nailing of this Thesis on the Church door signaled the beginning of the Protestant Reformation.

Martin Luther was an intelligent individual, whose mastery in Biblical passages was astute as his observation in Catholic Doctrine. Afterall, Martin Luther himself was a Catholic Monk who seeked merely to reform the Catholic Church.

His actions lead to not only the reformation of the Catholic Church, but to the split between Catholics and Protestants. An interesting and colorful discourse in European history as well as Christian Historiography.

Cheers,
Bran Lorenzo

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #11 on:** March 22, 2009, 11:31:20 PM »

The Fall Of The Roman Empire

Let us discuss this topic, which is rather interesting and sparks my attention, and am also glad that Datu posted this topic thread since it bears great importance for the development and culmination of Western European Culture and History, and the world at large.

How did the Roman Empire Fall? And Why? How can such a mighty Empire that commanded a military force that numbered close to 2 million men could have fallen? How can an empire with such a vast navy fall?

As I said earlier in my posts, the fall of the Greatest Empire in the history of the world was not a result of one individual or one factor, but, instead, was an effect and an inevitable result of multifactorial causes.

By the 5th Century AD, the Roman Empire had grown so large and so vast that over 40 million souls lived within its political sphere. One Fourth of the world's populations lived and died under the rule of the Roman Caesars. By the 5th century, the Roman Empire was divided in two: The Western Roman Empire, whose capital was in Rome and the Eastern Roman Empire, whose capital was in Constantinople. The reasons for the division of the empire was simply political and military. The empire had grown too large to be controlled under one political unit, due to the vastness of the terrain, and areas, ruling over its provinces and effectively emanating Imperial decrees from Rome to its distant provinces took months even years to occur. Bureaucracy was too large, and due to that aspect, corruption was rampant. Constantine the Great, the first Christian Roman Emperor tried to unite the two empires again--establishing a neo-Augutinian edict to unify the two sister cities (Rome and Constantinople), however, following emperors had difficulty in maintaining the military and dealing with the political squabbles in the Imperial Senate--thereby made it mandatory to permanently divide the Roman Empire in two.

Note that corruption was already a problem. What exacerbated the problem and led to the ultimate fall of the declining Western Roman Empire was the presence of the Vandals and Visigoths.

Due to the shear expanse of the territory of Rome, most of its legions were scattered around the provinces, many in Brittania, many in Hispanola, many in North Africa, Many in Judea (Palastina), many in Latinium (Italian peninsula), many in Germania, in Gaul, etc) Due to the scattering of the legions, Rom had difficulty in dealing with the constant arrival of Barbarians arriving in its borders and settling in Roman territories. Rome made peace with the Visigoths, and utilized them to augment its legions; a result of this closeness was Visigoths learning of Roman military cadence and tactics. Which would haunt Rome in the future.

During the continuity of these events, the Roman Military Machine had been greatly weakened by constant wars, and the de-centralization that occurred after Barbarians populated the empire. Many of Rome's soldier's adapted and took up barbarian culture (an effect of being stationed in the distant provinces and away form Roman culture). At the same time, there was continuous political bickering in the Imperial Capital. Senators against senators, bribery was rampant, corruption within the bureaucracy widespread and the Emperors themselves were being murdered on a regular basis--thereby manifesting an environment and feeling of 'inconcistency' within the Empire.

The fall of Rome culminated in the 5th century. Alaric, the Visigoth King and a Roman Magister Militum (master soldier) stormed the city of Rome after months of sieging the Great City.
The Visigoths were able to storm the city so quickly and so decisively because the tactics they utilized were Roman Tactics. They used Roman military sieging techniques (which they learned form the Romans, ironically).

Rome's Military Legions were unable to come to the aid of the City due to preoccupation in military campaigns and distant wars (Against the Suenes in Spain, against the Berbers in North Africa, against the Vandals, against the Ostrogoths, the Dacians, etc) By the time a Roman Military expedition was sent to relieve the City of Rome, it was already too late.

The Emperor was abdicated from the throne, and the Visigoths penetrated and had already ripped through the Imperial City. The Heart of the Roman Empire.

Logistics and the size of the empire was its ultimate downfall.

-Lorenzo

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Datu Dagohoy · « **Reply #12 on:** March 23, 2009, 03:56:55 PM »

Christianity has more followers than any other religion. It centers on Jesus Christ, whom Christians consider to be the Son of God. His birth marks the first year of the Christian calendar, the one most people use today.
HOW DID CHRISTIANITY BEGIN?
The story of Christianity begins with Jesus. He was born about 2,000 years ago in Bethlehem, a town in the ancient Middle Eastern region of Judea.
Jesus preached that God is love. He told people to love even their enemies. He also spoke about the Kingdom of God. Jesus said God was coming to Earth to be with his people in the Kingdom of God. He urged his followers to ask God to forgive them for their sinful ways so they could enter the Kingdom of God.
The teachings of Jesus were popular. He won many followers. But the Roman rulers of Judea feared Jesus. They thought he wanted to overthrow their government, and they accused him of treason.
Jesus was crucified, or nailed to a cross, to die. Crucifixion is how the Romans executed criminals. But Jesusâ€™ followers believed that he came back to life and rose into heaven. This event is called the Resurrection. The crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus are central to Christianity.
Christians honor the anniversary of the Crucifixion on Good Friday. They celebrate the Resurrection on Easter Sunday.
WHAT IS THE BIBLE?
After Jesus died, his followers, called apostles, spread his message. They gathered everything they remembered about Jesus into a collection of writings. This collection is called the New Testament. Christians refer to Hebrew sacred writings composed before Jesusâ€™ birth as the Old Testament. Together, the New Testament and the Old Testament form the Christian Bible. The Bible is the holy book of Christianity.
WHAT DO CHRISTIANS BELIEVE?
Most Christians see God as a Trinityâ€”a being that exists as three persons. There is God the Father, Jesus Christ his Son, and a guiding force known as the Holy Spirit. Christians believe that anyone who accepts Jesus as the Savior will live forever in heaven after death.
People accept Jesus in a ceremony called baptism. During this ceremony, they are sprinkled with water or dipped in water.
Most Christians go to religious services on Sunday. This day is known as the Sabbath. It honors the resurrection of Jesus, which most Christians believe occurred on a Sunday.
A community of Christians with shared beliefs is called a church. The building in which they worship is also called a church.
HOW DID CHRISTIANITY GROW?
The first Christians were poor people living in the Roman Empire. After a time, richer Romans started converting, too. As Christianity gained more followers, Roman leaders began to see the religion as a threat. Christians refused to worship the Roman emperor. The Roman leaders treated the Christians cruelly, but their actions only strengthened the beliefs of Christians.
In AD 312, Roman emperor Constantine himself converted to Christianity. Rome became a Christian empire.
MANY KINDS OF CHRISTIANS
After the year 395, Rome split into two empires. There was one branch in the east and another in the west. Gradually, Christianity developed two branches, too. In the Eastern Empire, it became the Orthodox Church. In the Western Empire, it became the Roman Catholic Church.
Priests called bishops had special authority in both the eastern and western churches. In the west, the bishop of Rome became the top religious leader. He is known as the pope.
In 1512, a man named Martin Luther protested against the power of the pope and the traditions of the Roman Catholic Church. Luther believed that the church had strayed from the teachings of Jesus. He said people needed only faith and the Bible to live Christian lives. His ideas spread.
Groups that left the Roman Catholic Church to form their own churches were called Protestants. In England, King Henry VIII led the protest. He established the Protestant Church of England and made himself the head of it.
The movement to reform Christianity is remembered as the Protestant Reformation. As a result of the Reformation, there are Baptists, Lutherans, Methodists, Presbyterians, and many other Protestant groups. Today, about 2 billion people in the world call themselves Christians.

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Datu Dagohoy · « **Reply #13 on:** March 23, 2009, 03:59:28 PM »

Martin Luther

Martin Luther was a German preacher who trusted the Bible and quarreled with the pope. His search for religious truth led to the creation of a new branch of Christianity called Protestantism. Protestants do not accept the authority of the pope, the person who heads the Roman Catholic Church.

A RELIGIOUS LIFE

Martin Luther was born in Eisleben, Germany, in 1483. At the age of 21, he joined a monastery, and at 23, he became a Roman Catholic priest. From 1512 until his death, he was professor of theology (religion) at the University of Wittenberg in Germany.

CALLS FOR REFORM

Luther lived at a time when many people were criticizing the Roman Catholic Church. They said its leaders were corrupt and lazy. They complained that its priests did not teach people the true message of Jesus Christ.

Luther shared these criticisms. His Bible studies also led him to challenge key Catholic ideas. In particular, he believed that people could only be saved from sin by faith in God and trust in Godâ€™s grace (love and mercy). He did not believe Catholic preachers, who said that good works and rich gifts to the church were also necessary. He was outraged when preachers offered to sell Godâ€™s forgiveness to raise money to build a cathedral. In 1517, Luther nailed a list of 95 complaints to a church door in Wittenberg.

EXCOMMUNICATION!

Catholic leaders could not ignore Lutherâ€™s protest. In 1521, the pope excommunicated Lutherâ€”that is, he banned Luther from taking part in Catholic worship. The princes who ruled Germany tried to make Luther apologize. But Luther refused. He told them rulers should not interfere in religion.

Luther spent the rest of his life teaching and writing. He met scholars and priests who came to Wittenberg to discuss religious reforms. He translated the Bible into German, so that ordinary people could study it. His text was so widely read that it helped shape a new version of the German language.

A NEW CHURCH

Luther died in 1546, but his ideas remained powerful. His followers founded Lutheranism, the first form of Protestantism. Lutherans worshiped simply and trusted in Godâ€™s grace. Lutheranism spread from Germany to many parts of Europe, and then to most parts of the world.

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Amir · « **Reply #14 on:** March 27, 2009, 11:19:59 PM »

tungod man god ni Martin Luther (German nga Pari) ga protestanti sya, unya ga concentrate sya sa europe unya ang Roman Catholic ga concentrate sa parting east part of the world.

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Raquelproud boholana · « **Reply #15 on:** March 28, 2009, 03:32:00 AM »

I think the answer on this is the Roman Empire spend huge amount of money on the Army trying to control the empire. Plus they keep raising taxes on everybody to pay for all the government expenditure. Huge bloated bureaucracy. Too many unproductive people living off the productive members.
Collapse gyud ang empire kung magsalig na tanan sa welfare sa goberno,ug segi na padala ug gira sa tibook kalibutan.Di lang ni sa roman empire nahitabo but magbalik balik jud ni mao ni giingon history repeat itself.

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raldampong · « **Reply #16 on:** March 28, 2009, 05:15:03 AM »

Its the In-fighting between the Commander Agustus and Commander Mark Anthony in Alexandra, Egypt. That lead to that dismantled the Roman Army.

When Popei died, Julius Ceasars take over the reined as Emperor and declared himself Emperor-God and his married to Cleopatra, thought to make Roman Empire more stronger and bigger.

Some Senator are not happy because of Mark Anthony being the Commander in Chief of the Army.

Cecero, an great orator of the senate started to allied with the opposition that lead to the stabbing of Julius Ceasar in the Senate.

When Mark Anthony stationed in Alexandra it weaken the forces that loyal to Julius while Agustus is plotting a coup d'tat againts his adapted Father which is Juluis Ceasar.

Titus Polo, a braves Roman Soldier who impregnated Cleopatra was real father of the Son of GOD which is little Ceasar. When Agustus Army defeated Mark Anthony, Cleopatra sent their son exiled in India with some of their trusted Caretaker of their Son.

While Mark Anthony father a son and a daughter Selene Cleopatra to Cleopatra. Cleopatra was considered the last Pharoah of Egypt, but in reality its Little Ceasar the son of Titus.

The Son of God was educated in India? And came back to claim his Holy Roman Empire. But not thru WAR, but in the name of a New Religion called Chiristianity.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #17 on:** March 28, 2009, 06:09:21 AM »

I think the answer on this is the Roman Empire spend huge amount of money on the Army trying to control the empire. Plus they keep raising taxes on everybody to pay for all the government expenditure. Huge bloated bureaucracy. Too many unproductive people living off the productive members.
Collapse gyud ang empire kung magsalig na tanan sa welfare sa goberno,ug segi na padala ug gira sa tibook kalibutan.Di lang ni sa roman empire nahitabo but magbalik balik jud ni mao ni giingon history repeat itself.

Yes, very true.

It is also important to note that when the Roman Empire was in its zenith, during the Julius-Nervian Dynasty, most of the peoples in Europe were still primitive, therefore, many of them including the Gauls, Visigoths etc fell quickly under the banner of Roman Legions.

It is undeniable that the Imperial Army was the most organized military fighting force in the world at the time. It was the order, and discipline of the Roman Empire that allowed it to surmount over obstacles. Facilitated the Romanization of most of Europa (the regions that were under Roman control).

However, as centuries passed, Roman culture, technology, language, religion, and domestic culture being exported abroad led to the formation and development of distinct cultures in many barbaric societies that arrived in the Roman Frontier. Per se the Ostrogoths, Dacians, Vandals Visigoths etc. Which would ultimately be one of the many factors that led to the ultimate demise of the Western Roman Empire.

The Roman Military was, indeed, great and numerous. But it was spread out thin to control and provide law and order throughout the continuity of the Empire.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #18 on:** March 28, 2009, 06:15:43 AM »

I want to clear up some misconception in here.

The Roman Empire did not fall completely in one particular date. The Empire's collapse took centuries.

Yes, the Western Roman Empire did collapse in the 5th century. After its collapse, the many provinces of the Western Half of the Roman Empire splintered into princedoms, and kingdoms and Italian states.

However, the Eastern Half of the Roman Empire was spared from total collapse in the 5th century. The Eastern Roman Empire, whose capital was in Byzantium (Constantinople) was prosperous (economically) enjoying the bounty of trade with the Orient to the east, Arabia in the south, and Eastern Europe to its north.

After the fall of the the Western Roman Empire, the Eastern Roman Empire continued to live on. Albeit under another name, and ushered a new age. Emperor Justinian I declared that the old 'Eastern Roman Empire' would be known as The Byzantine Empire.

The Byzantine Empire would last for another 1,000 years; until the 15th century when the Muslim Turks finally extinguished the only remnant of the ROMAN EMPIRE. Constantinople fell in 1453 and under the Turks, it would be renamed as "Istanbul".

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #19 on:** March 28, 2009, 06:23:11 AM »

The Roman Empire

When one looks at the map of the classical Roman Empire during the age of Pax Romana "Roman Peace", during the age of Emperor Augustus the Great, one is simply amazed that such a vast empire existed and worked and functioned for almost a thousand years. The depth of the expanse of the Roman Empire is larger than the modern-day European Union. The Empire not only controlled Europe, but also had provinces in Africa and Asia Minor.

1/4th of the world's population lived and died under the rule of the Caesars.

The Classical Roman Empire.

The Byzantine Empire (former Eastern Roman Empire)
The zenith of the Byzantine Empire under Emperor Justinian the Great.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #20 on:** March 28, 2009, 12:31:42 PM »

On the Roman Army:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ndh3b9wC-A0&feature=related

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raldampong · « **Reply #21 on:** March 29, 2009, 10:35:01 PM »

Its the In-fighting between the Commander Agustus and Commander Mark Anthony in Alexandra, Egypt. That lead to that dismantled the Roman Army.

When Popei died, Julius Ceasars take over the reined as Emperor and declared himself Emperor-God and his married to Cleopatra, thought to make Roman Empire more stronger and bigger.

Some Senator are not happy because of Mark Anthony being the Commander in Chief of the Army.

Cecero, an great orator of the senate started to allied with the opposition that lead to the stabbing of Julius Ceasar in the Senate.

When Mark Anthony stationed in Alexandra it weaken the forces that loyal to Julius while Agustus is plotting a coup d'tat againts his adapted Father which is Juluis Ceasar.

Titus Polo, a braves Roman Soldier who impregnated Cleopatra was real father of the Son of GOD which is little Ceasar. When Agustus Army defeated Mark Anthony, Cleopatra sent their son exiled in India with some of their trusted Caretaker of their Son.

While Mark Anthony fathered a son and a daughter Selene Cleopatra to Cleopatra. Cleopatra was considered the last Pharoah of Egypt, but in reality its Little Ceasar the son of Titus.

The Son of God was educated in India? And came back to claim his Holy Roman Empire. But not thru WAR, but in the name of a New Religion called Chiristianity.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #22 on:** March 31, 2009, 11:54:58 AM »

Interesting perspective, Mr. Rald.

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raldampong · « **Reply #23 on:** March 31, 2009, 10:38:22 PM »

Interesting perspective, Mr. Rald.

Dong Bran, many researcher believe that Little JC (Julius Ceasar) was Jesus Christ in real life he twelve when sent to India. Selene Cleopatra is Magdalene and James is his half brother fathered by Mark Anthony, they are half brother of Jesus and their mother is Cleopatra.

Little Julius Ceasar came back to Alexandra when he was 30 to find his half sister and half bother and married her.

A russian writer in the 12 century translated a 1000 years old Tibetan scripture about a holy man from Mediteranean region came as scholar and left when he was in his 30's. The date was almost coincide from the reigned of Emperor Tibirius. Little JC was almost age of Tibirius. The only accurate dating they can fined.

This coincide the missing years of Jesus as an adult and knowledges in Holy teaching. Speak different languages other than Aramaic and can read sancrits.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #24 on:** April 01, 2009, 07:35:21 AM »

Mr. Rald, Id like to read more into this research. It sparks my quaint interest.

The only discrepancy that I immediately recognize is purely chronological-based.

Caesar Julius was murdered in 44 BC, giving a 40 some year gap. Christ Jesus was speculated to have been born during the reign of Herod I, which was in the early 1st century AD, and was said to have died in his 30s, estimating the Lord's death on the cross in around 33 AD.

Gaius Julius Caesar was murdered in 44 BC, and his son was said to have been sent to India. Historically speaking, that would have made him around 70 years old during the time of Christ's death. And around the age of 40+ during the time when Christ was born.

Nonetheless, interesting perspective.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #25 on:** April 01, 2009, 07:48:50 AM »

Mr. Rald, you did bring up an interesting point. Emperor Worship. Yes, you are right, Sir, during the time after Augustus, the state promulgated the act of Imperial Divinity. Thereby making it a Roman Law, and since the Imperial Senate and the Praestors controlled religious festivities, made it necessary for Roman citizens to usher Divine praises to the Emperor of Rome.

This was actually nothing more than precedent.

After the murder of Gaius Julius Caesar in 44 B.C by Cassius, Brutus and supporters, the people of Rome, under influence by Marcus Antonius, who was also Co-Rulers of the 1st Triumirate. (Power shared with Octavius).

Gaius Julius Caesar was so popular within the plebians, that even after his ceremonial cremation, the people of Rome demanded his divination. Under redress by the People of Rome and by the Armies of Rome, the Imperial Senate acquiesced to this request.

Formally and officially deified Julius Caesar as a GOD. He would be known as Divus Iulius.

And it was only after the rule of his grand nephew, Octavius, who would be known as Augustus Caesar, the 1st Emperor, that the precedent of Imperial Divinity took place. Augustus was praised and honored by his subjects, and was considered a God in life and in death.

Imperial Divinity and Right of Divinity was used by Roman emperors to legitimize their rule. By claiming favor from the gods. But this precedent ended, officially, upon the coronation of Emperor Constantine I. Constantine was also a Christian. And denied the divinity of the emperor, recognizing only the divinity in Christ.

It was Constantine who brought up laws and edicts that made it hostile to be pagan; by levies of taxation.

Emperor Diocletian, was really the last pure 'pagan' Roman Emperor that maintained the divinity of the Emperors. As after Constantine I, most emperors were Christian.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #26 on:** April 01, 2009, 08:20:02 AM »

Lets analyze the statues of the Roman Emperors and observe the divinity portrayed in their image.

This statue is of Emperor Gaius Julius Caesar Augustus Germanicus (CALIGULA "little boots")

Caligula applied the Imperial Directive and asserted his Divine Authority in his decrees. Notice in his statue that he is crowned with the Wreath, which signifies Divinity. Again he is robed in ceremonial priestly attire, which required little covering on the upper torso, as a role of the priest required to offcer sacrifices to the gods. Priests didn't wear upper torso clothing since it would be stained red by the blood of sacrifices.

Caligula's statue indicates that he is the Chief Priest of the Empire, as the role of the Emperor was the protector of the Religious activities and the primarch of worship. By wearing the Imperial Crown and the attire of a Roman Priest, he declares that his authority and power comes not only by political right, but by the favor of the gods.

Also notice that in his left hand he has the mantle of the Consul and Praetor, signifying political power. And in his left hand, he holds a worshiping plate. In roman religion, you would offer burnt offerings on such plates to the statues of the gods. Caligula holds one on his left hand, signifying the need to offer divine praises and sacrifices to him. It declares his divinty.

Notice that by his feet, is the emblem of the Roman Empire. The Roman Eagle. Usually, a Roman Eagle's wings is outstretched (as seen in the banner of legions), but in this case, its wings are folded, signifying fealty and respect. A sign of prostration. The Roman Eagle, which is the symbol of the State also standing by the foot of Caligula, indicating that the State is below the Emperor Caligula. Notice that the Eagle looks up to Emperor Caligula. It signifies Caligula's Divinity. It declares, "I am A God-Emperor, By whose authority was given to me by the gods above, and by right and right alone, to rule and command Rome, its legions, its people, and empire"

Another statue to analyze:

This is yet another statue of Emperor Caligula.
Note he is dressed in full military breast plate, which signifies his Imperial Authority.
Yet on his head, he is wearing the headdress of a roman priest.

The emperors combined items of their Imperial office with that of religious symbolism (either it by a priestly regalia) to portray their authority. Divine Authority.

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raldampong · « **Reply #27 on:** April 01, 2009, 02:14:20 PM »

The researcher found out that there's a seven years descrepancy in converting the Roman calendar to Gregorian plus there's no 0 AD or 0 BC.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #28 on:** April 01, 2009, 02:15:07 PM »

Interesting perspective, Sir.

I'll have to read more about it.

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #29 on:** April 01, 2009, 04:00:43 PM »

ngano tawong miabut man mo ni martin. roman empire may gihisgutan! pagka bu**** aning topica uy? wa bamo kuyapi?

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #30 on:** April 01, 2009, 04:01:28 PM »

mura mag na saag sa panahon sa datu!

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raldampong · « **Reply #31 on:** April 02, 2009, 04:07:53 PM »

Buwad, theres a connection it collapsed because promised to dismantle all Kingdom and the Kingdom of God will remain. As He himself declared as "Son of God" he came back to claimed it thru His Holy Teaching.

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Amir · « **Reply #32 on:** April 02, 2009, 07:24:01 PM »

Buwad, theres a connection it collapsed because promised to dismantle all Kingdom and the Kingdom of God will remain. As He himself declared as "Son of God" he cmame back to claimed it thru His Holy Teaching.

Tama Sir karon palang bag-o daghan ng mga kingdom nga nabungkag, latest was Kingdom of Nepal, Thailand hapit sab na mabungkag basta daghan pang uban

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #33 on:** April 06, 2009, 10:11:12 AM »

The Roman Empire served its purpose.

The Empire brought nations and kingdoms under one rule, and it provided, due to effective infrastructure and mass communication allowed through its roads and postal systems and its massive navy, allowed the free-flow of thought and discourse.

Not only did it allow the exportation of Roman law, Roman culture, Roman military tactics, but also even Roman-based religions.

Christianity, Through the Grace of God Almighty, conquored the city of Rome in AD 300. Even before that, during the age of Caligula and Nero, there were already practicing Christians in the city of Rome. Many of them were massacred and were martyred.

But think about the miracle of Christianity.

That this faith, which was under attack for centuries, managed to overtake the entire city. The conversion of Emperor Constantine on the Battle of Mirvian Bridge led to the change of Roman History, itself.

When Rome became Christian, it exported and facilitated the growth of the faith. Roman Christianity exported the faith to Germania, to Gaul, to Hispola, to North Africa, to Egypt, to Constantinople, to Macedona, to Dacia, to Brittania, etc etc.

Even though the Roman Empire collapsed, politically speaking, the unifying factor did not. Christianity lived on, and spread vibrantly throughout Europe. And from Europe, it would be exported throughout the entire world.

The Old Roman Colony of Hispanola would one day become the mighty Spanish Empire. And Spain expoted Roman Christianity (Roman Catholicism) to the new world. North and South America, as well as the Philippines.

Catholicism in the Philippines is a DIRECT link to the Roman Empire via the maternal link with Spain.

Philippines --Spain--Imperium Romanum.

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raldampong · « **Reply #34 on:** April 06, 2009, 04:27:01 PM »

You are right Dong Bran, But the question still unanswered. Who is the real son of GOD. Where was he for the last 17 years. IS he influenced from the teaching from Budhism.

All this question will rewrite history if proven right.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #35 on:** April 07, 2009, 12:16:07 AM »

Discussing Jesus Christ is not necessary in this thread. All I know is that Jesus Christ is the ONLY BEGOTTEN son of GOD.

Jesus Christ is eternally begotten of The Father, and is equally part of the Trinity of the Eternal God Head. The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit.

The Bible left 17 years out of Jesus' Life because it is unecessary in preaching the purpose of Christ's Descent from Heaven to Earth.

Christ came to the World to die for our sins.

Let us discuss this in another thread.

Cheers.

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raldampong · « **Reply #36 on:** April 07, 2009, 03:08:48 PM »

Dong Bran, I can't debate anymore beyond this point. Its not really proven researched about Jesus as the son of Cleopatra and Gaus Julius Ceasar and boilogical father Titus Polo.

Since Christians brought down the Roman Empire on his knees by converting to Christianity and Christianity is Jesus.

Its is rightfully to say that, Jesus Holy teaching brought down Kingdoms. Amen

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #37 on:** April 09, 2009, 03:29:47 AM »

I do agree with you that Christ transfigured not only himself, but those who condemned Him on the cross.

The Roman Empire crucified the Lord Jesus Christ on the tree of the Cross.

Ironic and yet befitting that it would be Christianity that would supplant the Old Roman Pagan worship as the state religion.

Christianity boomed in Rome; and from Rome and at Rome, it would spread the Word of God to the 4 corners of the World.

The historiography of Christianity is a Living Miracle.
Provided by the Grace of Our Lord Jesus Christ.
The Salvation of The Whole World.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #38 on:** April 11, 2009, 09:57:15 AM »

We talked about the fall of the Roman Empire, let us also talk about its Rise.

Classical Roman Epoch is one of my favorite epochs in history.
Before Rome, there was barbarity in Europe, uncivilized, anarchy.
After Rome, there was Roman Law, Roman Order, Roman Culture and Civility.

Let us celebrate the life and works of Gaius Octavian Caesar (Augustus), The First Emperor of Rome.

Pater Patriae: Father of the Fatherland.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgbbPYE-Ics

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #39 on:** April 11, 2009, 11:42:43 AM »

How about Martin Luther, I thought he was one responsible to weakened and led to collapsed the strongest and powerful Roman Empire.

No, Martin Luther didn't do such thing. Martin Luther was a Catholic Monk turned reformer, whose 95 thesis led to the reformation of the Roman Catholic Church and some questionable tactics.

The classical Roman Empire collapsed in the 5th century AD (Western Roman Empire) and in the 15th century (Eastern Roman Empire/ Byzantine Empire).

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