TUBAGBOHOL.com with Ligalig Mike Ortega

Inside Bohol => Talk of the Town => Topic started by: Ligalig-Mike on February 16, 2011, 06:33:33 PM

Title: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Ligalig-Mike on February 16, 2011, 06:33:33 PM
President Benigno S. Aquino III said Wednesday he leaves it up to the Armed Forces of the Philippines (AFP) or another official to decide on the transfer of the remains of former President Ferdinand E. Marcos to the Libingan ng mga Bayani (Heroes' Cemetery) in Taguig City.

Aquino said this after a command conference at Camp Aguinaldo in Quezon City amid fresh calls for the late former dictator to be buried in a heroes' cemetery.

The President indicated he is removing himself from the long divisive issue due to his parent's historic battle with the late strongman.

Former President Marcos was ousted in a 1986 "people power" revolt led by the President Aquino's late mother, pro-democracy icon Corazon Aquino.

Mr. Marcos died three years later in exile in Hawaii and his body was flown back in 1993 to his northern Philippine hometown of Batac, where it has been displayed in a glass coffin and has become a tourist attraction.

The recent burial of former military chief Gen. Angelo Reyes at the heroes' cemetery, which is reserved for soldiers, presidents, statesmen and national artists, revived questions on whether Marcos should be similarly honored.

Asked by reporters if he will allow that, President Aquino said that he did not want to make that decision but would instead delegate it to another official, whom he did not immediately identify.

"Whatever I say will be biased," Aquino said at the press briefing in Camp Aguinaldo. "I will let somebody who has less personal attachment to decide on it," he added. (PNA)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: weemall on February 18, 2011, 05:03:10 PM
"There's no enmity, it simply doesn't exist. There's nothing to go away, to take away, or diminish. We don't know each other well enough to like or dislike one another," said by Bong Bong Marcos

dapat matagal na.. he deserves to be there that late Angelo Reyes..
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on February 18, 2011, 05:40:56 PM

Hmm. Laing opisyal ang iyang pasultion sa iyang desisyon?  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: junjun on February 18, 2011, 05:41:37 PM
Absolutely  NO for me, can we consider a person hero if he was toppled by the sovereign people because of his cruel, tyrannic, bloody and corrupt administration? Unsa man nato pag reconcile sa EDSA one ug sa pagkahero ni fernidand marcos? kataw-an tas mga kaapohan nato ani. 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on February 18, 2011, 05:47:25 PM

timaang gid ba na indi gid siyang mkadisisyom, sang mga singsitib sitwisyom?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: taga tigbao on February 18, 2011, 05:50:04 PM
Para naho dili pud ko. Ngano man? Is it one of the signs that the Filipino people have accepted as a country the tradition of corruption?  :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on February 18, 2011, 05:54:07 PM


para sang akon tugot ko gid
pode gid ilibing sang libingang sang bayani pagbutangang lang gid "am nat a hiro layk dim"
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on February 18, 2011, 06:18:09 PM

Hmm. Unsa man, "am nat a hiro layk dim bikos am a sopirhiro"?  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: gwargz on March 10, 2011, 02:26:57 PM
Bisan gani ang anino lang sa lungon ni Marcos
dili angayan makalabay sa Libingan ng mga Bayani,
unsa pa kaha nga ilubong didto?

BASIN MOBANGON ANG MGA PATAY UG MAMALHIN
SA LOYOLA MEMORIAL PARK !!! OR SA LUNETA BA KAHA,
MOTAPAD NI TOTO JOSE RIZAL.

PAKAULAW LANG NA SI BONGBONG MARCOS.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 10, 2011, 05:05:19 PM
Di mauwaw kay sobra kabaga ang nawong.  >:(

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on March 10, 2011, 05:13:06 PM

kobalan na gid nawong nila man  :-[
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 10, 2011, 05:50:03 PM

Indi na gid dultan sang huya haw, manugriplik lang ang hambal sang tao...  :P

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on March 10, 2011, 10:58:51 PM

may ara gid sila taming sang olo daw hrlmit sang romanhong songdalo, matig-a gid sama sang balitprop
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: taga tigbao on March 11, 2011, 12:41:10 AM

Mao. Ang ahong pagtan-aw aning mga Marcoses, they are completely convinced until now that they have done good things to the country during the Marcos' patriarch time. Ug mas nindot kono unta nga sila gihapon ang nagduma sa Pilipinas.

Pwe!  >:(
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 11, 2011, 06:45:06 AM

Bason pud anggid sang hrlmit sang stormtrooper ang balitprop nga taming nila haw...

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 11, 2011, 06:46:12 AM

The delusion lives on...  >:(

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on March 11, 2011, 04:19:47 PM

(http://www.gadgetgrid.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/transformers-optimus-prime-voice-changer-helmet.jpg)

sopistikitid boltis payb litis hilmit indi gid manogdoklan  :-[


Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 11, 2011, 08:42:02 PM
Mas kublan gid si Masinggarsi...


(http://www.mangaspain.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/mazinger-z.jpg)


 8)

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on March 12, 2011, 06:05:21 PM
http://www.mangaspain.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/mazinger-z.jpg[/img]


 8)



nomdom ko sang ona hang tsirt ko gid masingirsi

 ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 12, 2011, 06:07:36 PM

Wala pa gid manugsikat si Ultraman sang Pinas noon haw...

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on March 14, 2011, 08:33:30 PM

waay pa gid sang unang panahong ni limahong panahong sang hapong mahilig mag kaong kaong sudang hang amahong
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 14, 2011, 09:05:16 PM
Kag ang amahong ginagparesang sang tinughong...

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: BolBuhol on March 16, 2011, 05:43:25 PM
tinoghong (tinohog na tahong) namit gid tamostamoson
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on March 16, 2011, 09:44:44 PM

Ang tuhog gid man ang mismong manugtamostamos ya...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:38:03 AM

karon kay nahuman na man mog lamoy sa inyong tinoghong (mao ba niy rason nga wa na motumaw akong migong bolbs?  kay hangtod karon naungot pa ang tinoghong sa iyang tutunlan?), balik sa kong marcos ha?


Marcos burial resolution tears to shreds Edsa mandate

April 10, 2011

MANILA, Philippines—House Resolution No. 1135 seeking the burial of the late strongman Ferdinand Marcos at Libingan ng mga Bayani turned on its head the policy mandate of the 1986 Edsa People Power Revolution that toppled his 14-year dictatorship.

The resolution signed by 216 congressmen flagrantly defied the sovereign will of the people expressed by their uprising in the streets on Feb. 22-25, 1986, restoring democracy dismantled by Marcos when he declared martial law on Sept. 21, 1972.

The House move signaled the start of the campaign initiated by Marcos’ family and political heirs to restore the dictator’s political legacy through the burial of his body on the hallowed grounds of the heroes’ cemetery, according him the honors of a national hero.

This is all in defiance of the mandate of Edsa I.

more at Inquirer.net, http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:39:55 AM


The campaign to rehabilitate Marcos immediately whipped up a storm of controversy over the issue of the whether he deserved to be buried at the military cemetery, burial grounds of outstanding citizens of the Republic, including two past Presidents (Diosdado Macapagal and Carlos P. Garcia), military leaders and men of letters.

The charge against the House resolution was led by the powerful Catholic Church, which was the Marcos regime’s principal protagonist during the dictatorship.

The Catholic Educational Association of the Philippines (CEAP), the largest organized group of Catholic schools and institutions, issued a strongly worded statement on the commemoration of Araw ng Kagitingan, honoring Filipino soldiers who fought heroically to resist the superior force of Japanese invaders in Bataan 69 years ago.

The CEAP called on the congressmen who signed the House resolution to withdraw their signatures, warning them not to be part of the attempt to revise or falsify history. The statement bluntly said the resolution would “desecrate” Edsa I.

The organization pointedly denounced claims of Marcos supporters that he was a war hero as false, and went on to say that the massive corruption of the dictatorship sent the economy to its knees, turning the Philippines into the “sick man” of Asia.

http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:41:53 AM
Epic clash

HR 1131 triggered an epic clash over two great political traditions that have defined the themes of political discourse during the past 39 years.

The discourse is framed by the demolition of Philippine democracy and the establishment of a dictatorship in September 1972 and by the restoration of democracy with the Edsa People Power Revolution of February 1986.

For four decades, these traditions have marked the cleavage line along which Philippine politics has polarized.

Once again, the dictatorship-vs-democratic restoration paradigm has been forced up to the surface with the House initiative seeking the political rehabilitation of Marcos and legitimizing the the dictatorial legacy of his regime.

The House resolution was a sharp attack to overturn the doctrine that Edsa I ended the dictatorship. The revolution was an emphatic and direct exercise by the people of their sovereign right to change regimes.

http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:45:32 AM
Attack on mandate

No legislative act of elected representatives of the people in parliament can revoke that mandate of the Edsa People Power Revolution.

Thus, HR 1135 clearly contravenes the mandate of Edsa I to abolish the dictatorship and cannot be used by members of Congress to engineer the restoration of the Marcos dictatorial legacy and vindicate the regime with the flimsy argument that burying Marcos at Libingan ng mga Bayani would bring to a closure the dark episode of the dictatorship, promote national reconciliation and allow the country to “move on” toward national unity.

Those who signed the resolution are members of a political institution that was one of the first to be padlocked by Marcos when he declared martial law.

The lawmakers have also become the beneficiaries of a free and independent legislature that was restored by President Corazon Aquino in the wake of the l986 revolution.

And yet they are now at the forefront of the campaign to restore the legacy of the Marcos regime, ignoring in the process the fact that Edsa I was the charter of the abolition of the dictatorship and the restoration of Philippine democracy.

The congressmen are not in step with redemocratization. They are swimming against the historic tide of democratic restoration following Edsa I.

They are backsliding to the era when complicit parliament served as a rubber stamp of the dictatorship. The congressmen would find it hard to claim that their resolution represents the sentiment of the people in regard to Marcos’ rehabilitation.

http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:48:04 AM

No accountability

When the Philippines rejected the dictatorship in Edsa I, we didn’t make a clean break with a sordid past. Even with the restoration of democratic structures we have remained chained to the past.

Representatives of the people in Congress have been beguiled by the false argument that the rehabilitation of Marcos is an act of “statesmanship” that can throw wide open the gates of national reconciliation.

Under this approach, there is no recognition of accountability. There is no concession of wrongdoing and no expression of remorse for the plunder of public wealth and the deaths, disappearances and torture of victims in military “safe houses” of the dictatorship’s gulag system.

The Marcos heirs are back to positions of power and influence after free elections, flaunting their wealth, and mocking the Edsa People Power Revolution as if it never happened. There is no reconciliation without justice and no concession of guilt. The House resolution has torn to shreds the people power mandate that rejected the dictatorship.
 
http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:50:59 AM
 (http://hronlineph.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/marcoses.jpg?w=600&h=388)

http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:52:55 AM

it's because as voters we are idiots.  we put them there.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 08:54:54 AM

i won't be surprised if a minuscule portion of their massive wealth went to some legislators' hands to finance their next electoral campaign.  of course, no legislator in his right mind would admit this.  there are no proofs, anyway.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 15, 2011, 09:04:55 AM

Epic clash[/b]

HR 1131 triggered an epic clash over two great political traditions that have defined the themes of political discourse during the past 39 years.

The discourse is framed by the demolition of Philippine democracy and the establishment of a dictatorship in September 1972 and by the restoration of democracy with the Edsa People Power Revolution of February 1986.

For four decades, these traditions have marked the cleavage line along which Philippine politics has polarized.

Once again, the dictatorship-vs-democratic restoration paradigm has been forced up to the surface with the House initiative seeking the political rehabilitation of Marcos and legitimizing the the dictatorial legacy of his regime.

The House resolution was a sharp attack to overturn the doctrine that Edsa I ended the dictatorship. The revolution was an emphatic and direct exercise by the people of their sovereign right to change regimes.

http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/ (http://hronlineph.wordpress.com/)

This is worrisome. Buffeted as we are by disturbing developments overseas and at our doorstep, we can ill afford the distractions of a house divided.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 09:09:27 AM

interesting.  the u.s. has H.R. 1135, but it's for waste disposal.

"To amend the Solid Waste Disposal Act to authorize Federal grants for the development of innovative recycling techniques." (HR 1135, US)


is our own hr 1135 a civilized way of waste disposal? :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 15, 2011, 09:13:00 AM


Hmm. An attempt at waste purification, obviously...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 09:38:15 AM

216 out of a maximum total of 250 congressmen supported hr 1135; a hands-down majority.

I WONDER HOW BOHOL'S CONGRESSMEN VOTED?  i couldn't find the list of signatories of this bill so far.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 09:48:25 AM

here's from the kids (they're just as concerned, after all):

(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_C3n24Fbl76c/TI9FmdnMXxI/AAAAAAAACME/AcWEAY2HfTc/s400/jejejeje.jpg )
Jejemons showing powerful hand signals they'll use to summon the former dictator (jejephoto from Crazy Jhenny)

http://manilabull.blogspot.com (http://manilabull.blogspot.com)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 09:51:48 AM
 
House Resolution to resurrect Marcos;
Church leaders formulate new and improved holy water

Sunday, April 10, 2011


MANILA, Philippines--Prepare for doom.

A resolution signed by 216 lotus-eating Congressmen is seeking the resurrection of former dictator Ferdinand Edralin Marcos. House Resolution No. 1135 titled A Resolution to Summon the Dark Lord mandates all Philippine black magicians, warlocks, cult leaders, quack doctors, soothsayers, fortune tellers, tarot card readers, demigods, holy cows, jejemons, Beliebers, Ruben Ecleo Jr., RH Bill supporters, and all people impervious to reason and addicted to faith to join forces and pool powers to resurrect the dictator.

The lotus-eating Congressmen said that it is about time for the Philippines to become a tiger economy, and the only way to do that is to discipline the citizens first by way of iron hand.

"Only Ferdie has the guts to announce a martial law. Those who'll resist have two choices, either bend or break," the lotus eaters said.

The lotus eaters have already prepared a cheerful one-line speech that Ferdie is going to make as soon as he is resurrected.

"Good morning my countrymen! As of the twenty-third of this month, I signed Proclamation No. 1081 placing the entire Philippines under Martial Law! Have a nice day! :)"

Catholic Church leaders have told the public via radio sermons and holy mass that people should not be afraid, but instead fight the Dark Lord. The church has formulated a new and improved holy water, which comes in 5, 30 and 50ml spray bottles for only 30, 60, and 100 pesos respectively.

The new formula is said to be more concentrated and more powerful. It also comes in 5 different flavors such as mango, peach, lemon, apple and bagoong. Each bottle has been blessed and therefore has become a holier water.

To be able to fight the Dark Lord, the public is urged to get one bottle of holier water right now!


http://manilabull.blogspot.com/2011/04/house-resolution-to-resurrect-marcos.html (http://manilabull.blogspot.com/2011/04/house-resolution-to-resurrect-marcos.html)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on April 15, 2011, 09:59:25 AM
lol @ 'the dark lord'. Unsa man ni ? Pinoy version of Harry Potter's archnemesis , Valdemort? bwahahahaha.

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on April 15, 2011, 10:00:07 AM
http://manilabull.blogspot.com/2011/04/house-resolution-to-resurrect-marcos.html[/url]

this is so wrong on so many levels. :-X
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 15, 2011, 11:43:47 AM

Bwahaha! A generous dose of humor really does wonders...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:23:56 PM

this indeed is one h-e-l-l of a piece using a literary device (call it by whatever name; satire, parody, lampoon, etc.) written by young people.  and i thought they didn't care about politics!  (stupid me.  how could i forget that elsewhere they're making revolutions.)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:26:25 PM
Analysis

Day of betrayal in Congress

By Amando Doronila
Philippine Daily Inquirer
04/14/2011

excerpts:

Five years later, it was time to physically remove Stalin from a place of honor. Khrushchev read a decree ordering the removal of Stalin’s remains. The decree said: “The further retention of the mausoleum of sarcophagus with the bier of J.V. Stalin shall be recognized as inappropriate since the serious violations by Stalin of Lenin’s precepts, abuse of power, mass repressions against honorable Soviet people, and other activities during the period of the personality cult make it impossible to leave the bier with his body in the mausoleum of V.I. Lenin.”

“A few days later, Stalin’s body was quietly removed from the the mausoleum,” said the article. “There were no ceremonies and no fanfare. About 300 feet from the mausoleum, Stalin’s body was buried near other minor leaders of the Revolution. His body was placed near the Kremlin wall, half-hidden by trees. A few weeks later, a simple dark granite stone marked the grave with the very simple identifying mark ‘J.V. Stalin, 1879-1953.’ In 1970, a small bust was added to the grave.”

http://opinion.inquirer.net/ (http://opinion.inquirer.net/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:31:10 PM

The regime change after the end of the Stalin era of terror ushered in a period of political reform. Khrushchev never questioned Stalin’s role in turning back the German invasion at Stalingrad in World War II, and his status as a hero.

In the Philippines, we are taking a reverse process. The political heirs and family of the late dictator Ferdinand Marcos are moving heaven and earth to reestablish the Marcos legacy after it had been overthrown by the people in the 1986 People Power Revolution. The Soviet people removed the physical monuments of the Stalinist personality cult in the campaign to exorcise the legacy of Stalin in their national memory. Here we have been doing the opposite. Instead of expunging the Marcos legacy, cohorts of the dictatorship are using the democratic institutions restored by the People Power Revolution as the staging ground to bring Marcos back to public adoration through the resolution in the House of Representatives petitioning the President to allow the burial of the Marcos remains in the cemetery of heroes.

http://opinion.inquirer.net/ (http://opinion.inquirer.net/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:32:54 PM

Stalin was an authentic Soviet war hero in the Patriotic War against the German invasion. Marcos’ heroic role in the resistance movement against the Japanese Occupation has been debunked as a monumental fraud.

The day 216 representatives signed HR 1135 seeking the burial Marcos as a national hero was a day of infamy in the post-Edsa Philippine democracy. Among other things, the Marcos regime is accused of the murder of several thousand Filipinos who opposed the dictatorship. Filipinos can never live down that day of betrayal by their representatives in Congress.


http://opinion.inquirer.net/ (http://opinion.inquirer.net/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:37:02 PM
Libingan: Home for the Glorious Dead
April 13, 2011

By Zosimo Literatus

excerpts:

Glorious death, bringing honor to the country, fighting for the sake of freedom and democracy… These are the people who can claim to deserve burial in the Libingan. Not just any soldier, not just any president…

Lately, Rep. Salvador Escudero III (1st District, Sorsogon-UNO) filed House Resolution 1135 seeking to urge the administration of PNoy to allow the burial of the remains of late president and strongman Ferdinand Marcos at the Libingan. He justifies in the second paragraph that Marcos was a well-decorated veteran of World War II and a survivor of the Bataan Death March, two historical claims that remained controversial for its questionable veracity. Succeeding paragraphs rattled off his membership in Congress, his presidency and his accomplishments as the longest-reigning president in the country and commander-in-chief of the Philippine armed forces.

In paragraph 7, Escudero capped the list with a claim that Marcos “remained a Filipino patriot to the end of his life and in death deserves to be honored as such.”

http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003 (http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:39:40 PM

But this resolution purposefully mistated the fact that the Filipino who may have been a patriot ceased to be so at the end of his life. Among those ignominous deeds of his dictatorial rule, the latest one deserved the order of the Sandiganbayan to the heirs of the Marcos estate to return the P10 million that the former president had transferred from the National Food Authority (NFA) to a private account in Security Bank on 27 July 1983.

If after all these ignominous things in the history of Marcos regime qualify for deeds that give “glory of his death” and “fights for freedom and democracy” we may as well rename Libingan with something else. And perhaps relocate the remains of those patriots, presidents and heroes of glorious repute somewhere else.

Burying Marcos in Libingan will dishonor the memory of those whose lives were offered to the country with no thought of monetary compensation, the soldiers in Corrigedor and Bataan who had to survive with no food in order to fight off the Japanese forces. Compare that to the US$ 7.5 million of sequestered assets that the US Court awarded to almost 8,000 human rights victims during his martial rule, P10 million diverted money from NFA, and still more that the Philippine government has not uncovered.

http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003 (http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:41:03 PM

 Burying Marcos in Libingan will insult the memory of former president Carlos Garcia, who espoused the “Filipino First” policy, not “myself first” policy, in his administration.

Burying Marcos in Libingan will insult the memory of General Artemio Ricarte, the father of the Philippine Army, who never took an oath of allegiance to the occupying American forces since the Philippine Revolution and the Philippine-American War. Amidst the persecution he suffered from fellow Filipinos and the American forces, he chose to stay in the country to continue his fight, saying, “I can not take refuge in Japan at this critical moment when my people are in actual distress. I will stay in my Motherland to the last.” And he lost his life standing for his Motherland.

Burying Marcos in Libingan will insult our memory as Filipino people, especially the desaparecidos, who judged him as a scoundrel who put himself and his family before his country, and putting an end to his military-protected dictatorial rule, through the EDSA People Power Revolution in 1986.

Burying Marcos in Libingan will insult ourselves as a people. And Filipinos must demand an explanation from their district representatives who supported HR 1135 (click here for the list). It is time for the Filipinos take their stand for the indignity they suffered in the hands of the late dictator.

http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003 (http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 15, 2011, 01:41:55 PM

At the end of the day, the only way the Marcoses can redeem the honor of the deposed dictator is to have him indirectly declared a “hero” when his remains get buried at the Libingan ng mga Bayani. Who can later on dispute that the late strongman Ferdinand Marcos was not a hero when he is buried at the Cemetery of Heroes? Thereafter, it is much easier to embellish history to honor the “heroism” of someone buried in the heroes’ cemetery.

http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003 (http://kuro-kuro.org/archives/3003)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 15, 2011, 08:59:35 PM

Too bad that somewhere else in the world precious youth is wasted on ego-tripping...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: junjun on April 16, 2011, 04:12:51 PM
Who sets the standard for a person to be proclaimed bayani? is a hero measurable? This issue is very old yet continued to exist because of the historical myths that surrounds the life of MArcos. The US govt already declared that the MAHARLIKA group allegedly formed and led by MArcos was a fraud...Isnt he a master of this? E.g The Tasaday issue which happen to be his pet project that fooled even the brightest and smartest scholars that time. Mas deserving pa yung naglililinis sa daan, ang mga balot vendors na naghahanap buhay ng maayos....WIll it make a difference if his body be buried there?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 10:48:41 PM

just a squeak of an answer, junjun.  from the looks of it, it's the power elites who proclaim heroes nowadays.  it's probably their way of having the favor returned to them one day when they themselves or their kin wish to be proclaimed as heroes too, after plundering the country.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 10:51:41 PM
Viewpoint

‘Remembrancer’

By Juan Mercado
Philippine Daily Inquirer
04/09/2011


IN HIS column “Speak Memory,” Cebu Daily News’ Simeon Dumdum wrote wistfully of the need for a “Remembrancer,” an official of medieval times who jogged the memories of “barons” on pending matters.

The Remembrancer also hammered issues that the “nobles” preferred to forget, Dumdum, who is a Cebu Regional Trial Court judge, recalls. In the process, the Remembrancer squelched incipient tyrannies.

Like today’s House Resolution 1135?


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 10:54:11 PM

Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo and clan, together with Imelda Marcos, plus 210 other representatives, signed HR 1135. It badgers President Benigno Aquino III to allow a Libingan ng mga Bayani interment for the late dictator Ferdinand Marcos.

Communal amnesia would expunge all “New Society” crimes. “The Marcos family never expressed any remorse,” Inquirer’s Randy David points out. “They do not seek forgiveness.” They see HR 1135 “as a vindication of their innocence .…They want the nation to revise its remembrance of the past.”

Aquino, whose father was assassinated during the dictatorship, is asked to reverse the verdict of People Power. Also, it would shove, into an Orwellian memory shredder, various crimes—from shell foundations in Lichtenstein, fake war medals, the confiscated 60-piece Roumeliotes jewels, to the 3,257 persons “salvaged,” 737 desaparecidos, plus thousands detained without trial.


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 10:55:59 PM

“Forget the past,” Senators Juan Ponce Enrile, Gringo Honasan and Antonio Trillanes III kibitzed from the sidelines. “Let the country move on.” They parrot Chilean dictator Augusto Pinochet (1915-2006).

Under Pinochet’s iron-fist rule, 2,279 persons were murdered by state agents. Thousands disappeared. “It is best to remain silent and forget,” Pinochet said after his extradition from the United Kingdom and imprisonment. “It is the only thing to do: we must forget.”

No, disagrees Czech author Milan Kundera. “The struggle of man against power is the struggle of memory against forgetting,” he writes in “The Book of Laughter and Forgetting.”


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 10:57:19 PM

Today’s battle for memory defines tomorrow for our grandchildren. So, bear in mind how other countries dealt with the moral debris left by dictators.

Argentina’s human rights trials forced people to discuss issues over dinner. Chile has a monument “To the Disappeared.” South Africa’s Truth Commission documented abuses even by Nelson Mandela’s wife Winnie.

Protestant and Catholic churches in Brazil published secret regime documents titled: “Brazil Nunca Mais (Brazil Never Again).” In Guatemala, Catholic bishops drew up a four-volume work “to recover historic memory” of its 30-year civil war that left 100,000 dead or disappeared.


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 10:58:23 PM

Here, congressmen stared blankly at the 7,526 “remembrancers.” Cebu’s Judge Meinrado Paredes and Inquirer columnist Ma. Ceres Doyo were among the Marcos victims who received token $1,000 checks awarded by the US District Court of Hawaii. Their presence recalled the Court’s decision finding Marcos “liable for systematic torture, summary executions and disappearances.”

Former Sen. Rene Saguisag is a pro-bono “Remembrancer.” The Marcoses were kleptocrats according to a Sandiganbayan decision of 2003 (406 SCRA 190), he recalled in a letter to veterans. Impunity blanketed the 169 workers’ deaths in Imelda Marcos’ Film Palace. Marcos’ daughter Imee ignored the Hawaii court’s penalty for the 1977 salvaging of Archimedes Trajano, the Mapua student who questioned the then Kabataang Barangay head.

“Marcos may not belong in the Libingan,” Saguisag added. It would be different if a new law renames the 142-hectare cemetery as Libingan ng mga Bayani at mga Pangulo.


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 11:01:08 PM

Saguisag’s proposal looks into the future. Even former presidents go the way of all flesh. A president convicted of plunder, or one who owned up to “Hello Garci” mucking with electoral process, may be interred without an uproar.

Will the work of all these “remembrancers” be for naught?

Social Weather Stations reports that 50 percent of Filipinos agree to a Marcos Libingan burial. And 49 percent say no.

Isn’t that a repeat of an Ateneo-Social Weather Station survey of June 1986? Conducted just after People Power, that survey found only 4 percent wanted Marcos to return from exile, and to be tried and convicted.


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 11:02:36 PM
Forgetting seemed preferable to “uncovering the facts, giving the nameless dead their true names and decent burial, and prosecuting the perpetrators,” Sociologist John Carroll, SJ told the 1999 Ateneo-Wisconsin University conference on “Memory, Truth-Telling and the Pursuit of Justice.” “The Philippines is a nation in denial.”

Of the 5,000 World War II collaboration cases filed with the People’s Court, only 156 ended up with a conviction. “(It) created the impression that there was no real difference between patriots and traitors. Or that it was not worth the effort to sort them out.”

In 1986, People Power drove Marcos and his cronies into exile. Serial coups battered the succeeding (Cory) Aquino administration, which survived and made a peaceful orderly transition to a duly elected government. But none of the Marcoses or coup artists were penalized. Instead, they became political and economic kingpins.

Punishment is not a matter of revenge or even justice, Father Carroll wrote. It is the community rising to reaffirm values seriously violated. “Not to react as a community would be to reduce a community’s values or ‘common conscience’ to personal preference—and invite collapse.”

(underscoring mine)


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 16, 2011, 11:06:59 PM

In the Philippines, willingness to forget Marcos’ massive crimes reflects weakness of common conscience, he added. “Unless, the nation rises up to vindicate and reaffirm those values, it may be condemned to wander forever in the wilderness of valueless power plays of the elite.”

(underscoring mine)


http://newsinfo.inquirer.net (http://newsinfo.inquirer.net)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 17, 2011, 05:58:57 AM


Hmm. Records show that time and again we have neglected "to reaffirm values seriously violated".
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: fdaray on April 17, 2011, 12:48:59 PM
Nganong dili man ilubong si Marcos sa Libingan nga mga Bayani nga dili man tanan gilubong diha mga bayani. ? Dapit ilubong regardless of any reason.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hofelina on April 18, 2011, 06:06:10 PM
we are supporting this;
http://www.asienhaus.de/public/archiv/PAHRA_petition.pdf (http://www.asienhaus.de/public/archiv/PAHRA_petition.pdf)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 18, 2011, 08:34:02 PM
http://www.asienhaus.de/public/archiv/PAHRA_petition.pdf[/url]

i hope this petition gathers more signatures.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on April 18, 2011, 09:43:34 PM
asos jod pride ra tanan naa aning marcos ngano man diay kon ilubong siya deli sa mga bayani na lobnganan,,,,,dakong sagpa nis PILIPINAS,,,dektador god,,nya pasidunggan pa????
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 18, 2011, 10:23:28 PM


Hmm, iapil na lang pud kaha ang congressmen nga nagpasiugda ani...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: taga tigbao on April 25, 2011, 01:04:02 PM
Tan-awa ninjo kung mipirma ba ang congressman sa Bohol sa House Resolution 1135, A RESOLUTION URGING THE ADMINISTRATION OF PRESIDENT BENIGNO C. AQUINO III TO ALLOW THE BURIAL OF THE REMAINS OF FORMER PRESIDENT FERDINAND EDRALIN MARCOS AT THE LIBINGAN NG MGA BAYANI.

http://blogwatch.tv/news/list-of-reps-who-authored-the-resolution-supporting-the-burial-of-ferdinand-marcos-at-the-libingan-ng-mga-bayani/ (http://blogwatch.tv/news/list-of-reps-who-authored-the-resolution-supporting-the-burial-of-ferdinand-marcos-at-the-libingan-ng-mga-bayani/)

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 25, 2011, 02:31:27 PM

i caught the names of bohol congressmen AUMENTADO, ERICO BOYLES and YAP, ARTHUR CUA.  bisan unsaon nakog balik-balik, di gyod nako makit-an ang RELAMPAGOS, RENE L.  i hope wa ko matamataha.  this is one way of knowing our congressmen.  did their votes ever speak for the people they represent?  did they make any consultations?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on April 25, 2011, 02:43:33 PM

Oi, cannot open the Internet site man sa akong computer... :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hofelina on April 25, 2011, 04:20:23 PM
to hubag bohol, tua na watch ot list imong IP Doy! ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: taga tigbao on April 25, 2011, 05:55:49 PM

Agree ko ani nga statement.

Among congressman pud akip, MERCADO, ROGER.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on April 28, 2011, 05:32:58 PM


Angelo Reyes the former army chief who is a traitor by defying his sworn allegiance to protect the constitution was about to be charged in court of corruption committed suicide and never give the people a chance to know whether he was guilty or not...  but interred in the Libingan anyway. Marcos wanted to face the music but never given a chance for his day in court.
 
The Philippine government charged him in a Seattle court of accepting bribe from Westinghouse Inc.. The court decided in favor of Marcos and Westinghouse Inc. agreeing to Westinghouse Inc. that the 10 million dollars given as commission to Marcos is not a bribe but the money is a commission. This is a policy of Westinghouse Inc. and I agree also because even in our country commission is legal.
 
Imelda was also charged in New York of R.I.C.O. case but was pronounced innocent by the court. The court argue that the sin of Marcos is not the sin of Imelda.

 AFP Regulations G 161-373: “Allocation of Cemetery Plots at the LNMB”, which was issued on April 9, 1986 by GHQ under then AFP Chief of Staff General Fidel V. Ramos and then President Corazon C. Aquino, as amended by AFP Regulations G 161-375 on September 11, 2000, is the set of regulations that govern the interment at the LNMB."  

Marcos deserves to be buried in the LNMB because... according to the former senator Ernesto Macedo; "former President Marcos is entitled to be interred at the LNMB because he belongs to not one but four categories in the allocation of plots at the Libingan."

— As Medal of Valor awardee

— As former President

— As former Secretary of National Defense

— As veteran of World War 2

This is the truth about Marcos and I hope this will put him to rest at the Libingan ng mga Bayani. He maybe a villain to some but a hero to the vast majority of the people. Let us try to live with it.
 
Marcos and Erap were disgraced and demonized by the media. They did not disgrace their honor.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on April 29, 2011, 02:49:07 AM

as the rest of us wait for more reasons on how "to try to live with it", here's an unemotional take on this topic:

Was Marcos a Hero?

No. But he was a soldier


(http://philippinesfreepress.com.ph/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/2011_04_23_marcos.jpg)
HOME Marcos’s family brings his body home from Hawaii in 1993 (Photo: Jun Camarillo)


SORSOGON Rep. Salvador Escudero III has introduced a resolution supporting the burial of the waxy corpse of dictator Ferdinand Marcos in the Libingan ng mga Bayani—the misnamed heroes’ cemetery where among the honored sleepers are war veterans, guerrillas, former presidents, and people like Haydee Yorac who distinguished themselves in service to the people of the Philippines. But basically it is a military cemetery. All soldiers who die in battle in any of our conflicts are entitled to be buried there.

Nearly 200 congressmen have signed the resolution. Sen. Ferdinand Marcos Jr., son of the dictator, has been pressing since February for the burial among dead soldiers of his father, who, he says, was a war hero. This was disputed during the campaign for the 1986 snap election. The dispute had to do with whether Marcos deserved all of the 27 war medals that he claimed he had earned. There were questions about the authenticity of those medals, but Marcos insisted they were authentic. The opposition couldn’t care less—the only thing that was in dispute was whether he deserved them all.

What is undisputable is that Marcos was a soldier against the Japanese, something very few Filipinos were.

To be sure, Marcos’s guerrilla unit Ang Mga Maharlika, was a product of his imagination. No war veteran remembers it, much less fighting as a member of it. But that he fought the Japanese is not disputed or has been disproved, nor that he wore the uniform of a soldier for which he was socially despised by the old rich who whispered that he was too poor to date their daughters in proper linen suits.

To be sure, too, Marcos fought for the country’s freedom from Japanese occupation, although in 1972, as president, he contrived to suppress that freedom. But again there is no question that he was able to hold together a fissile and fragile economy when the Arabs clamped a global embargo on oil exports and destroyed most of the world’s economies. Marcos’s iron grip, with which he held the opposition by the neck, also held the economy together.

Saving the economy during that difficult time, however, would not entitle Marcos to be buried among dead soldiers. What entitles him is his having been a soldier, decorated or not. He was, and so it seems he is entitled to be buried in the Libingan ng mga Bayani. Sen. Antonio Trillanes IV, a former soldier, supports Escudero’s resolution for the same reason: hero or heel, Marcos was a soldier and he should be buried there. But not among ex-presidents, national artists and scientists and other notable men and women, but among the soldiers, under the same poor-quality marble cross with just a few words roughly carved on it— the dates of his birth and death and a single word to describe his service: “SOLDIER.”

Marcos’s friends are behind the House resolution, supposedly inspired by a recent Social Weather Stations poll that found that 50 percent of the Filipinos favor Marcos’s burial in the Libingan ng mga Bayani. President Benigno Aquino III, whose father, Sen. Benigno Aquino Jr., was one of the victims of Marcos’s martial-law regime, has stepped aside and tossed the job of making a decision to Vice President Jejomar Binay, who, in turn, has formed a committee to study the matter.


http://philippinesfreepress.com.ph/ (http://philippinesfreepress.com.ph/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on April 29, 2011, 03:19:41 AM
MARCOS? :-[ NO-ONG ALAW NI LIZAL PA YAN! :P Adto na ilubong sa kangkongan :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on April 29, 2011, 01:18:58 PM
 
     
This is the irony in the life of Marcos because the perceived wrongdoings and allegation of corruption attributed to him and his family have been designed to erase his name in the pages of Philippine history. This un-Filipino way of treating Marcos stemmed not from the culture of our people but I believe this is a culture of the illustrado. As my older folks narrated to us; this alien culture came from Europe and introduced by the Spaniards to a few Filipinos especially people who came from peninsular Spain and the Filipino mestizos. It was also brought to the province of Bohol. This culture was a kind of apartheid and most of the Tagbilaranons abhorred it. They coined this cultural division as; "taga ubos ug taga ibabaw". The "taga ubos" were only a few and because of inter-marriages between the "taga ubos and taga ibabaw" we fused together to become one people.

But not so long ago I witnessed with my own eyes twice the cultural division displayed by the people during Edsa I and Edsa II. This is the scenario as narrated by my uncles and my lola as it happened in a small town as Tagbilaran.

The Philippines Free Press again as it was before Martial Law is a staunch Marcos critic. Today the PFF don't have a living Marcos to be lambasted by their columnists. What they have is only a corpse but still the hatred won't stop. The PFF wants Marcos body to be buried in the Libingan with only the word "soldier" to be written in his tombstone... sort of hiding his grave away from the people. Just like Jose Rizal our national hero was buried in an unmarked grave... the Spanish authority wanted his grave unknown to the people. They put his initial in reversed as; "RPJ". I can see the coincidence if the PFF idea is to be followed.

I'm quite amused by the acceptance of the PFF that; "Marcos fought for the country’s freedom"... but it continues to say that Marcos "contrived to suppress [that] our freedom"; which is wrong! Marcos did not create the situation to suppress our freedom. The situation was created by the NPA when they bombed the Liberal Party rally at Plaza Miranda. Marcos is a patriot and he did not want our country to be devoured by Communism which is an alien ideology to the Filipinos. He knows of a threat by the NPA, so he took a preemptive action ahead of the NPA by declaring Martial Law.

The PFF caption says:

Was Marcos a Hero?

Answering itself... it says; No. But he was a soldier.

Explanation:

The short dialogue cum news caption is stressing a propaganda line to denigrate the memory of Marcos, his life as a soldier and as an honorable person. Of course a soldier and a hero are not the same but actually the PFF caption is hiding something.
 
It did not ask the question; "Marcos a medal of valor awardee; is he worthy to be called a hero?"

Now the complete idea of the PFF is written below. 

The PFF wrote:

"Nearly 200 congressmen have signed the resolution. Sen. Ferdinand Marcos Jr., son of the dictator, has been pressing since February for the burial among dead soldiers of his father, who, he says, was a war hero."

Reply:

Saying that his father is a hero... I think this is another invention of the PFF. Of course if Ferdinand Marcos Jr. has the evidence that his father is a hero... I think there's no need to blow his own trumpet... but let the record shows it!

The PFF continues:

This was disputed during the campaign for the 1986 snap election. The dispute had to do with whether Marcos deserved all of the 27 war medals that he claimed he had earned. There were questions about the authenticity of those medals, but Marcos insisted they were authentic. The opposition couldn’t care less—the only thing that was in dispute was whether he deserved them all."

Reply:

The saying goes this way; "a fish is caught by its own mouth." In the same manner as the PFF saying that; "This was disputed [medals of Marcos] during the campaign for the 1986 snap election"... is like the PFF is caught by its own words. The dispute is clear that the Marcos political enemies are only taking the "medals" as the issue to denigrate him. It is my belief that Marcos deserves all the 27 war medals awarded to him.

According to Brig. Gen. Restituto Aguilar, historical consultant of the AFP Museum said; “Those who contest the authenticity of his medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”. 

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 02, 2011, 08:28:46 PM
bisan pag ilobong sa libingan na mga bayani,,kay di jod siya bayani,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 02, 2011, 08:39:30 PM


Ayaw bay, mokaon ra ba kong tangkong...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 02, 2011, 08:42:30 PM


Patay, wa na jud diay koy tsansa nga makaentra sa LNMB kon maohon... :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 02, 2011, 08:45:57 PM


Unsa man diay siya, Bay Chris? ???
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 02, 2011, 09:03:00 PM
Bai HB, MALCOS iya apelido :D dili siya pareha nila Fernando Bayani, Tetchie agBayani ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 03, 2011, 10:35:47 AM

Mao nay imong panghuna-huna... pero lahi na si gihuna-huna ni Gen. Douglas MacArthur ug Gen. Jonathan Wainwright. Kining duha ka heneral nga amerkano giila nila ang pagka-bayani ni Marcos panahon sa gira mao nga niadtong 1942 gipasidunggan si Marcos ug mga medalya. Daghang medalya nga pasidungog ni Marcos sa kainitan sa gira. Girekomenda pa siya ni Gen. Wainwright sa Congressional Medal of Honor sa Amerika. Kini ang kinatas-an nga medalya para sa sundalo sa Amerika.

Akong gitahud ang imong panghuna-huna nga sa imong sulti; "di jod siya bayani".

WN
 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 03, 2011, 11:27:48 AM


I was once also an anti Marcos activist. I was at the MIA the time Ninoy Aquino was assassinated. I was there in the streets of Manila demonstrating against the government of Marcos... and at the same time I was employed with RFM a company owned by the Concepcions.

Since being an activist against Marcos my neighbor in Antipolo himself also an activist enrolled me to be a member of ATOM. The group of Butch Aquino who always led demonstrations and rallies against Marcos. While actively affiliated with the group I found out that most of the members are former students from UP, Ateneo, La Salle, UST and etc... etc... and at that time they are employed as junior managers of big companies in the Philippines. Like for example SMC, PMC, Nescafe, Baguio Oil and some of them are in the banks also having access to the Makati banking business who as anti Marcos the promoters of intrigues of a run in the bank. And for those who are in the production of prime commodities they managed production forecast.

My activities turned sour with them when I realized that these junior managers cum political activists were manipulating the production forecast of their companies. They knew when the production of a prime commodity is at low level. For example are pork, chicken, coffee, milk, rice and etc. When rice is forecasted at its low level these junior managers cum anti Marcos activists start to disseminate information that there will be a shortage of rice. The rich made it easy for them to buy by the sacks while the poor are left with nothing in the supermarket shelves thus creating an artificial rice shortage. There was no real crisis in a true sense of the word but these political activists cum junior managers created an artificial crisis. The same thing with other prime commodity products. The purpose is to make the people angry against Marcos.

Their medium of disseminating information to the people is the Pahayagang Malaya newspaper of Joe Burgos. Another anti Marcos newspaper.

During the time of Marcos the Philippines was exporting rice to other countries. Marcos established the Kadiwa Store where prime commodities for the poor were sold at a low price. And all over the country low prices of commodities were available and big business cannot easily jack up their prices. In order to afford maximum protection to consumers, prevent price manipulation and hoarding... the Price Stabilization Council was decreed by Marcos to increase its vigilance, particularly its price monitoring and enforcement.

 
The price of a liter of gasoline at the pump was pegged at a low price because Marcos subsidized oil companies through the Oil Price Stabilization Fund or OPSF. Therefore oil subsidy through the OPSF protected the country and cannot be hard hit if there is an oil crisis in the world.

The Economic Processing Zone Area or EPZA started in Bataan, Baguio city, Mactan Island, Cebu and Rizal province. The initial introduction into the Philippine market of Volkwagen Sakbayan, Mitsubishi Cimmaron, Ford Fiera and Toyota Tamaraw happened during the time of Marcos before any Asian country could start their own car industry. We started exporting Ford engines and spare parts to Australia and New Zealand. Right now, today, at the present time we are overtaken by Malaysia with their Proton car, In India with their Tata car and Ford Fiera is diverted and improved in Indonesia. 

All these developments happened because Marcos put regulations in the running of the government and for the interest of all Filipinos. Big business interest and politicians were antagonistic of what Marcos did. Marcos cannot have the best of both worlds... either he'll love the influential media, the Manila elite, politicians and big business or despise the people. Marcos chose to protect the people... which is why he was toppled from power.

When the media started to demonize Marcos as a thief and a dictator trusting that their propaganda can easily be absorbed by the gullibility of the people they didn't realize that a plot was hatched to restore the power of big business and corrupt politicians.

After Marcos everything he did for the interest of the people were gone. The PSC, OPSF, Kadiwa Center... etc... etc... were abolished by the new government. The Ministry of Energy was also abolished plunging Manila and the nearby provinces into complete darkness.

Who do you think be blamed for this economic disaster and flight of capital away from our country... Marcos? He was the one who started the development and is he also the one to drive them out? That makes it ridiculous and absurdly contrary to reason. While Marcos ignited the industrialization of our country his political enemies destroyed the developments he established and put Filipinos as contract workers in the Middle East, domestic helps in Singapore and Hongkong and as usual our women are the more easy target for sex slaves to other countries.

The great bard, William Shakespeare, once wrote: "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones."

Salamat!

R.A. Matig-a

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: kan-ogong on May 04, 2011, 11:37:13 AM
naka anha baya tu si Macoy sa Tubigon kay iya gipangita katung nag tabang nya panahon sa gera.naka abot man diay na sya sa Tubigon atung panahonj sa hapon unya gitaguan sa Tubigon Tomas man siguro to ngalan.Maayo pa adto na lang sya ilubong sa Tubigon.para wala samok.Maayo pa gud si Marcos kay mahal niya mga Bol anon.Tungod pod ni Victor Nituda nga iya Secretary of Information.panahon ni Marcos abot abot mi ako mga classmate sa Manila ngita trabaho padala mig sulat ni Marcos abi namo dili basahon nakurat man me kay kami mga Bol anon nga misulat kay nagreply man sya para mag report sa work.wala ko mo adto kay gikuyawan man ko but im proud nga iya gibasa amo mga sulat.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 04, 2011, 11:42:45 AM


OK pud ni nga sugyot...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 04, 2011, 12:31:10 PM

Kan - Ogong, taga Tubigon ka? naa kabai nailhan nga Molat ang last name nga taga tubigon? just curious....
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 04, 2011, 01:49:17 PM


the irony in the life of marcos is that he made his own life ironic.  there's no doubt about his sincerity when he ran for the top office of the land in the beginning.  along the way, he fell victim, or he allowed himself to be victimized, by the heady addiction of power, and ended up refusing to go down by whatever means.  he was a despot, no matter how we look at it, and like most other despots in the world, he wanted to keep power within his family.  the fact that he had a memo prepared for his wife to take over his presidency of the land is not a media invention, as we may know.

whatever wrong values were brought along by our colonizers have nothing to do with his decision to stay on and on and on.


“Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely.” (Lord John Dalberg-Acton)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 04, 2011, 02:51:44 PM

the philippine free press magazine has always been a critic of any wrongdoings of any administration, marcos’s or not, long before anyone of us here at tb was probably born.  it is not as if its opinion makers (the columnists) focused only on marcos’s time.  it did have more of marcos, because there was more to write about him considering the number of years he had stayed at malacañang.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 04, 2011, 05:44:59 PM

 our freedom"; which is wrong! Marcos did not create the situation to suppress our freedom. The situation was created by the NPA when they bombed the Liberal Party rally at Plaza Miranda. Marcos is a patriot and he did not want our country to be devoured by Communism which is an alien ideology to the Filipinos. He knows of a threat by the NPA, so he took a preemptive action ahead of the NPA by declaring Martial Law.

yes, marcos fought for the country’s freedom, the freedom from foreign domination, like thousands of other filipino soldiers during world war 2. 

when the philippine free press points out that he “contrived to suppress [that] freedom”, it meant that marcos took away the democratic freedom that was known by the filipino people, that freedom for which those soldiers both dead and living fought for during world war 2, first with the suspension of the writ of habeas corpus, then by martial law, and later by instituting constitutional change (through a rubber stamp constitutional convention) to continue to hold the reins of power. 

the bogeyman of communism was his most convenient reason then, from the plaza miranda bombing (as yet unsolved) to the supposed ambush of enrile (solved, with enrile admitting that it was plain drama).  even the assassination of benign aquino jr was at once blamed on the communists.

was the communists’ npa ever a threat to national security in the real sense of the word?  on hindsight, but for the usual government yarn then, the more threatening at the time was our own military that had more political power and better weapons than the ragtag npa, which didn’t have the support of the greater part of the population.  but the communists provided the marcos government with the best excuse to wield power sans check and balance.     
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 04, 2011, 07:19:59 PM

heroes are deemed worthy of the name, so why should the article's writer still ask if he were worthy of the name when he can settle for simply asking whether he was a hero or not?  

Quote
Now the complete idea of the PFF is written below.  

The PFF wrote:

"Nearly 200 congressmen have signed the resolution. Sen. Ferdinand Marcos Jr., son of the dictator, has been pressing since February for the burial among dead soldiers of his father, who, he says, was a war hero."

Reply:

Saying that his father is a hero... I think this is another invention of the PFF. Of course if Ferdinand Marcos Jr. has the evidence that his father is a hero... I think there's no need to blow his own trumpet... but let the record shows it!


yet trumpet ferdinand marcos jr did.  in fact, the reason why the whole family decided against burying marcos's body permanently elsewhere was because they themselves wanted him buried at the libingan ng mga bayani, all these years lobbying with political friends for support, and all these years insisting, trumpeting, that their family head was a hero.  and the family has the evidence, marcos's own account of his war exploits and the medals themselves.

Quote
The PFF continues:

This was disputed during the campaign for the 1986 snap election. The dispute had to do with whether Marcos deserved all of the 27 war medals that he claimed he had earned. There were questions about the authenticity of those medals, but Marcos insisted they were authentic. The opposition couldn’t care less—the only thing that was in dispute was whether he deserved them all."

Reply:

The saying goes this way; "a fish is caught by its own mouth." In the same manner as the PFF saying that; "This was disputed [medals of Marcos] during the campaign for the 1986 snap election"... is like the PFF is caught by its own words. The dispute is clear that the Marcos political enemies are only taking the "medals" as the issue to denigrate him. It is my belief that Marcos deserves all the 27 war medals awarded to him.

isn't it that the pff only reported what was going on?  naturally, it was politics as usual.  it’s not as if we don’t know that political campaigns in our political culture will not always bear the mark of mutual mudslinging.  it wasn’t as if marcos and his minions didn’t undertake their own negative tirades against their political enemies.  remember the “walang alam” slogan against cory aquino?  there was, and there will always be, mutual denigration.

Quote
According to Brig. Gen. Restituto Aguilar, historical consultant of the AFP Museum said; “Those who contest the authenticity of his medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”.  

spoken like a true functionary.  but of course, as a historical consultant he shouldn't take sides.  the statement does not in any way contradict either the truth or untruth of the authenticity of the medals.

meantime, when something is questioned, there must be some weakness in that thing.  your belief that marcos deserved all his 27 war medals must have some basis, such as your readings and your choice of what to believe in your readings.  that’s your right.  this is mine:  what are the bases for the doubts cast over marcos’s medals?  in general, some of the medals were earned or bestowed on him in accordance with his own reports and claims.  thus, the medals may be authentic but the reasons for their awarding could be fake.  (please note the qualifications of “may be” and “could be”.)

two examples stand out.  the u.s. army never acknowledged the existence of the guerrilla unit named “ang maharlika” and marcos was never rewarded for his claimed bravery at the battle of bessang pass.  consider this:

"Marcos’s daring war adventures first saw print in a 1948 magazine series.  The young lawyer supposedly had formed a 9,200-strong guerrilla group called Mga Maharlika (The Nobles) in North Luzon.  Unmindful of danger, he led more than 300 skirmishes with the mighty Japanese Imperial Army, for which he was decorated 27 times.  Thus did Marcos earn in 1947 a post in the Philippine commission that lobbied with the US for veterans’ benefits.   Riding on the daredevil acclaim, he handily won in 1949 a congressional seat.

If there were doubts then about Marcos’s claims, nobody said so aloud. Only in 1982 did war vets begin to murmur, when Marcos, ten years into his military rule, alleged himself to be the real hero of the Battle of Bessang Pass.  Overrunning the gorge was vital to the US Army’s pursuit of General Yamashita in the Cordillera Range.  Marcos mentioned General Volkmann as confiding that Yamashita almost surrendered to the Maharlika guerrillas.  War historians grumbled, for nowhere was Marcos near the battleground."


From GOTCHA By Jarius Bondoc (The Philippine Star) , April 08, 2011 12:00 AM
http://www.philstar.com (http://www.philstar.com)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 09:28:39 AM

islander wrote:

"the irony in the life of marcos is that he made his own life ironic.  there's no doubt about his sincerity when he ran for the top office of the land in the beginning.  along the way, he fell victim, or he allowed himself to be victimized, by the heady addiction of power, and ended up refusing to go down by whatever means. he was a despot, no matter how we look at it, and like most other despots in the world, he wanted to keep power within his family."

Reply:

This is also the irony if we believe too much of the newpapers who cast aspersion and bias opinion against Marcos. If you have no doubt in his sincerity of running for the highest office of the land then it's not addiction. His declaration of Martial Law was to save the Philippines from communist despotism. In 1972 it's either Marcos dictatorship or communist despotism.

islander wrote:     

"the fact that he had a memo prepared for his wife to take over his presidency of the land is not a media invention, as we may know."

Reply:

It's a media invention and there is no memo of that kind. I think the government introduced by Marcos is new to us and most do not understand how it works. We are being misled by the media that if Marcos dies Imelda will take over. No... it is not that way a parliamentary system works. Cesar Virata who was the prime minister will call for an election.

islander wrote:     

"whatever wrong values were brought along by our colonizers have nothing to do with his decision to stay on and on and on."

Reply:

It was not his decision to stay on forever. He was elected by the people.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 05, 2011, 10:33:58 AM
hehehe...unsa mai imong ika sulti sa SNAP ELECTION, pildi pero gusto pa magpabilin sa pwesto? ngutana lang!
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 11:13:20 AM

islander wrote:

"the philippine free press magazine has always been a critic of any wrongdoings of any administration, marcos’s or not, long before anyone of us here at tb was probably born.  it is not as if its opinion makers (the columnists) focused only on marcos’s time.  it did have more of marcos, because there was more to write about him considering the number of years he had stayed at malacañang."

Reply:

The PFP should understand that publishing the "truth is always an overmatch" for lies and falsehood. But like the Philippine Free Press whether the disputed issue is a lie doesn't matter as long as contending parties pay the PFP well. The ethical point here is to rectify what had been published as lies and falsehood. But not for the PFP!

Before Martial Law when Ninoy Aquino's popularity as a critic of Marcos got hold of dossiers pertaining to Muslims massacred [This was known as the Jabidah Massacre.] by the military in Corregidor the PFP and other anti Marcos newspapers bannered the story without even bothering to investigate whether there is truth to their story. Ninoy in a privilege speech spoke of a massacre in congress and that a certain recruit named Arula who survived the massacre was picked up by fishermen in Manila Bay. This was not true and Ninoy believing his own lies went to Sulo to inquire about the person Arula after his speech in congress and he cannot find such a person.

Marcos allegedly signed an approval to recruit Muslims to be trained clandestinely by the military to sabotage Sabah. In an act of treachery in the person of Ninoy; he divulged to the world of a massacre of muslim in Corregidor. The story of a massacre was a myth creating a crisis for the Philippines when the Australian and the New Zealand navies were deployed right in front of Palawan in defense of Malaysia... an ally in the British commonwealth. The British deployed also the Gurkha Fighters in Sabah to help Malaysia in case the Philippines invade Sabah or North Borneo.

The Philippine government apologized to the Malaysian and the British Commonwealth saying that it was only part of the free rolling Philippine press. But the PFP and other anti Marcos newspapers never rectify their story.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 01:25:19 PM


islander wrote: 

"when the philippine free press points out that he “contrived to suppress [that] freedom”, it meant that marcos took away the democratic freedom that was known by the filipino people, that freedom for which those soldiers both dead and living fought for during world war 2,..."

Reply:

I think you are wrong. He did not contrive to suppress our freedom but the communists did. The bombing of Plaza Miranda created the situation as attested to by Cor. Victor Corpuz... after the fall of Marcos when he returned to his unit in the AFP. Ex senator Jovito Salonga a political opponent of Marcos accused him as the mastermind in the Plaza Miranda bombing; but after listening to accounts of the bombing by former communists Romulo Kintanar who returned to the fold of the law saying that; Plaza Miranda bombing was the brainchild of the communists... he [Salonga] stops his accusation.

By the way... Romulo Kintanar was executed by the Ka Rosal liquidation squad being a traitor to the communist cause.

islander wrote:   

"first with the suspension of the writ of habeas corpus, then by martial law, and later by instituting constitutional change (through a rubber stamp constitutional convention) to continue to hold the reins of power."

Reply:

The writ of habeas corpus was suspended because Marcos knew about the Plaza Miranda bombing through intelligence reports that it was a prelude of things worse to come. The landing of arms shipment from China aboard M/V Karagatan off the coast of Degoyo Pt. in Luzon was one factor in the declaration of Martial Law. Here is an excerpt of a book narated by a crew member of M/V Karagatan named Ka Terry reported by Jo Clemente of the Inquirer;

"WE STAYED for 10 days at the Chinese naval base playing basketball while they took care of our fishing vessel and loaded boxes of M-14 rifles and ammunitions. In between, we were taught how to use the AK-47 and the anti-aircraft launcher. That could have been the next shipment."

That was Ka Terry speaking in flawless Kapampangan as he described their brief stay in China in 1972. He was part of the crew of the MV Karagatan, the vessel that was tasked with delivering arms for the underground New People's Army in the Philippines.

Ka Terry is now 51 years old.

islander wrote: 

the bogeyman of communism was his most convenient reason then, from the plaza miranda bombing (as yet unsolved) to the supposed ambush of enrile (solved, with enrile admitting that it was plain drama).  even the assassination of benign aquino jr was at once blamed on the communists.

Reply:

Bogeyman? hehehe... I think this is the usual terminology of the Marcos critics to discredit Martial Law.

And one thing I can say about Enrile is that; when his life was already in danger during his defiance against Marcos and to attract sympathy from the people he invented a story that his "ambush" was staged by Marcos. His story is unbelievable because it was done at the time when he rebelled against his boss Marcos. If it is for the sake of the people... he should have divulged it long time ago.

islander wrote: 

"was the communists’ npa ever a threat to national security in the real sense of the word? on hindsight, but for the usual government yarn then, the more threatening at the time was our own military that had more political power and better weapons than the ragtag npa, which didn’t have the support of the greater part of the population.  but the communists provided the marcos government with the best excuse to wield power sans check and balance."

Reply:

Yes. The CPP-NPA currently poses the greatest armed threat to the Philippine government and has the widest grass-roots support among the various Philippine leftist insurgent groups. The conflict between the CPP-NPA and the Philippine government has taken thousands of lives since the NPA’s inception. The peace talks between the NDF and the government is going nowhere.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 02:12:18 PM

islander wrote:

"heroes are deemed worthy of the name, so why should the article's writer still ask if he were worthy of the name when he can settle for simply asking whether he was a hero or not?"

Reply:

You are right! "Heroes are deemed worthy of the name." Other people think he is not worth the name of a hero. But honorable men like Gen. Jonathan Wainwright and Gen. Douglas MacArthur think otherwise. They believed Marcos is a hero by honoring him [Marcos] with war medals. These war medals were awarded to Marcos at the time when the war in the Philippines was raging in 1942. The US and Philippine governments never reported that those medals awarded to Marcos were fake medals. 

I for one agree with the 2 generals.

WN

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: fdaray on May 05, 2011, 02:22:28 PM
Ang tanan ba nga gilubong sa Libingan nga mga bayani, mga bayani, dili?...,  bisan ug kinsa? So, why not bury Marcos there.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 02:29:51 PM

islander wrote:

"yet trumpet ferdinand marcos jr did.  in fact, the reason why the whole family decided against burying marcos's body permanently elsewhere was because they themselves wanted him buried at the libingan ng mga bayani, all these years lobbying with political friends for support, and all these years insisting, trumpeting, that their family head was a hero.  and the family has the evidence, marcos's own account of his war exploits and the medals themselves."

Reply:

That is your opinion and I respect it. But the reason why the Marcos family wanted him [Marcos] buried in the Libingan and not elsewhere is because Marcos qualified in 4 categories for burial in the Libingan.

Here are his qualification;

1. He is a recipient of 27 genuine war medals awarded to him in 1942 by Gen. Jonathan Wainwright and Gen. Douglas MacArthur.

2. He is an awardee of the Philippine highest award to a soldier. The congressional medal of valor.

3. He was once the president of the Philippines.

4. He served in the government as secretary of National Defense.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 03:01:41 PM

islander wrote:

"isn't it that the pff only reported what was going on?  naturally, it was politics as usual.  it’s not as if we don’t know that political campaigns in our political culture will not always bear the mark of mutual mudslinging.  it wasn’t as if marcos and his minions didn’t undertake their own negative tirades against their political enemies.  remember the “walang alam” slogan against cory aquino?  there was, and there will always be, mutual denigration."

Reply:

Thanks for your opinion. After all the exchanges of views you admitted that; "naturally, it was politics as usual." I agree! Hehehe...

It's not only the smears and mudslinging but the hate against Marcos and I will also include Erap lingers on... because this is drawn in our political culture of putting down a political adversary. The denigration as you say is very clear and the case of Cory Aquino dubbed as "walang alam" is like the issue attributed to Erap as only an actor. Cory Aquino is no push over when it comes to her education but the "walang alam" is a derision of her in-experience in politics.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 05, 2011, 03:58:02 PM
That was Ka Terry speaking in flawless Kapampangan as he described their brief stay in China in 1972.[/b] He was part of the crew of the MV Karagatan, the vessel that was tasked with delivering arms for the underground New People's Army in the Philippines.

Ka Terry is now 51 years old.

If Ka Terry is 51 now, he was 12 in 1972. Hmm, precocious kid...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 05, 2011, 04:00:56 PM


...and he was driven out by the people.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 05:16:34 PM


islander wrote:

"spoken like a true functionary.  but of course, as a historical consultant he shouldn't take sides.  the statement does not in any way contradict either the truth or untruth of the authenticity of the medals."

Reply:

Gen. Restituto Aguilar is an historical consultant of the AFP Museum... his bias is because he is hired by the government of the Philippines. He has in his possession facts to the authencity of the Marcos medals. Which is why he said; "Those who contest the authenticity of his [Marcos] medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”.

You see... any person who disagree to the genuineness of the Marcos medals are welcomed to contest but must have proof to substantiate their claim.

The issue about the Marcos medals saw print in We-Forum of Joe Burgos Jr. written sometimes in the early 1980's by former governor of Sorsogon Bonifacio Gillego... and until now the issue remains in the newspaper. Nobody dared to question those medals in a higher venue other than the media or proof to the contrary that Marcos is an impostor during the war. The truth is; there is no proof to substantiate claims in the media that the Marcos medals are fake. Everything against the exploit of Marcos during WW-II is purely mudslinging. "Naturally politics is playing as usual."       

islander wrote:

"meantime, when something is questioned, there must be some weakness in that thing."

Reply:

Not necessarily. The things that is questioned by the media are the Marcos medals... and some people just swallow it hook, line and sinker. This not strange because there are lots of gullible people around. To show strenght of their claims they should show proof. According to the Philippine government through Gen. Restituto Aguilar; "Those who contest the authenticity of his [Marcos] medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”. Until now nobody shows up to contest the Marcos medals. 

islander wrote:   

"your belief that marcos deserved all his 27 war medals must have some basis, such as your readings and your choice of what to believe in your readings.  that’s your right."

Reply:

Of course! It's not only a belief but it's a fact of history that Marcos was awarded these medals during WW-II.

islander wrote:

"this is mine:  what are the bases for the doubts cast over marcos’s medals?  in general, some of the medals were earned or bestowed on him in accordance with his own reports and claims.  thus, the medals may be authentic but the reasons for their awarding could be fake.  (please note the qualifications of “may be” and “could be”.)"

Reply:

Actually the doubts come from baseless accusation. Devoid of any iota of evidence. The bases for the doubters comes from; "naturally, it was politics as usual." This is straight from the horse's mouth.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 07:59:40 PM

islander wrote: 

"two examples stand out.  the u.s. army never acknowledged the existence of the guerrilla unit named “ang maharlika” and marcos was never rewarded for his claimed bravery at the battle of bessang pass."

Reply:

The best piece of information whether the "Ang Mga Maharlika" headed by Marcos is a non existent guerilla unit during the war should come not from baseless ideas of thought from authors of books, newspaper reports or issues coming out of political innuendoes. To have a credible information about Marcos' Maharlika unit and his exploit during the war should come from a source in the military especially the history of WW-II. In this case there is no argument that Marcos records are in the military.

islander wrote:     

consider this:

"Marcos’s daring war adventures first saw print in a 1948 magazine series.  The young lawyer supposedly had formed a 9,200-strong guerrilla group called Mga Maharlika (The Nobles) in North Luzon.  Unmindful of danger, he led more than 300 skirmishes with the mighty Japanese Imperial Army, for which he was decorated 27 times.  Thus did Marcos earn in 1947 a post in the Philippine commission that lobbied with the US for veterans’ benefits.   Riding on the daredevil acclaim, he handily won in 1949 a congressional seat."

Reply:

You are right! If you have doubts about what you wrote then consult the military historian and not the newspaper writer.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 08:03:14 PM

Election by the people carries a heavier weight of credibility than a people's uprising. In our constitution election is the legal way to become president.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 05, 2011, 08:16:38 PM

Mao pud ni resulta sa imong "bias" nga panghuna-huna batok ni Marcos. Pildi si Cory sa eleksyon. Si Marcos ang hing-daug. Di jud mahitabo nga modaug si Cory ni Marcos adtong panahona... ngano? Tungod kay si Marcos nakagamut na sa mga probinsiya. Si Cory nailhan lang sa mga ciudad. Pero sa mga balita sa mantalaan kontra kaajo ni Marcos ug mao ni imong gibasihan. Ang eleksyon kinahanglan naay imong organisasyon [political machinery] para ka modaug Si Cory wa'y makinaryas; si Marcos tibook Pilipinas ang iyan organisasyon. Tanan mga mayores sa probinsiya tua dapig ni Marcos.

Unsaon pagdaug ni Cory?

WN

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 05, 2011, 08:39:12 PM


And what's the legal way of deposing a dictator?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 05, 2011, 09:16:52 PM
 para ka modaug Si Cory wa'y makinaryas; si Marcos tibook Pilipinas ang iyan organisasyon. Tanan mga mayores sa probinsiya tua dapig ni Marcos.

Unsaon pagdaug ni Cory

WN



 hehehe, mao bah? :o   ang imong gisulti mahintungod ani nga snap election, "LAYO RA KAAYO SA TINO-OD"  :D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 04:08:45 AM


you forget that during marcos's two-decade rule he controlled the media for over half of the period.  one of the first things he did after he declared martial law was the closure of all media outlets.  these slowly resurfaced when it was made sure that they would toe the government line.  add the fact that some outlets were taken over by his close associates (a kinder term for cronies), like roberto benedicto, and abs-cbn of the lopezes and rpn came under direct government management, among others.  and they cast aspersion against marcos?  come on.

your declaration that martial law's purpose was to save the country from communist despotism is those media's line.  yet you don't believe in the media?  how can you negate yourself?

Quote
islander wrote:    

"the fact that he had a memo prepared for his wife to take over his presidency of the land is not a media invention, as we may know."

Reply:

It's a media invention and there is no memo of that kind. I think the government introduced by Marcos is new to us and most do not understand how it works. We are being misled by the media that if Marcos dies Imelda will take over. No... it is not that way a parliamentary system works. Cesar Virata who was the prime minister will call for an election.


it is not a media invention.  neither is your claim that it's a media invention an invention of the media because it is your invention. yes, cesar virata was the prime minister then who will call for an election, when told by marcos to do so.

Quote

islander wrote:    

"whatever wrong values were brought along by our colonizers have nothing to do with his decision to stay on and on and on."

Reply:

It was not his decision to stay on forever. He was elected by the people.

WN


if it wasn't, why didn't he simply go down and not run again after two terms because in the first place that was all that the 1935 constitution allowed him?  by 1972, he was already on his second and last term as president.  political analysts were already wagging that he was bound to stay longer.  everything in him, words and deeds, led those keen enough to understand human nature that it wasn't in him to give up power that easily.  

1969 elections

marcos wins a second term, a first in philippine history, in an election allegedly marred by violence, massive cheating, and heavy spending on marcos's part.

1971 constitutional convention

When news broke out that Marcos planned to amend the constitution, allowing him to run for a third term in the presidential elections of 1973, student-led protests erupted in the streets, in what has since become known as the First Quarter Storm of 1970.  Later, student movements also led the Diliman Commune of February 1971.  Despite the violent protests, the Constitutional Convention still convened in June 1971.
http://pcij.org/ (http://pcij.org/)

1986 snap elections

The snap elections were finally held on 7 February 1986, with Cory Aquino and Salvador “Doy” Laurel running against Marcos and Aurelio Tolentino for the presidency and the vice-presidency.  The heavily-anticipated elections were marred by vote-buying, oppression, and fraudulent results; with Commission on Elections (COMELEC) results were in favor of Marcos while the National Movement for Free Elections (NAMFREL) results were in favor of Aquino.  In protest, thirty computer operators walk out of the COMELEC tabulation center during the tabulation two days after the election.

One of the most brutal incidents that happened in connection with the snap elections was the killing of lawyer Evelio Javier, opposition ex-governor of Antique, on 11 February 1986.  Javier was chased and shot to death in broad daylight at the provincial capitol.  The assassination was considered as one of the tipping points that led to the revolution. At his funeral mass, the official statement of the Catholic Bishops' Conference of the Philippines was read, condemning the elections. (wikipedia)


if these are still media inventions for you and you are therefore inclined not to believe, how does catholic church invention suit you?
  
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 04:29:10 AM


either ka terry was a child soldier (horrors!)

or

way nada (with due respect) copied this directly from a history book published more than a decade ago (this must be a history book because he doesn't believe in media reports, though i can see that the reporter he names is one jo clemente of the inquirer)...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 06, 2011, 04:35:16 AM
This is a very interesting discourse. Thanks Way Nada, Islander, Manong Hubs and all the rest.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 07:32:34 AM

most welcome, manoy lorenz. ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 07:56:21 AM

Again it is always in an election. Remember revolution is always illegal.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 08:00:31 AM

Maybe he was a teenager at that time. The book was written not this year of course.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 06, 2011, 08:06:13 AM

aha! Your post reminds me of the famous jest Francois la Rochefoucauld-Liancourt once said, "“The young are generally full of revolt, and are often pretty revolting about it.”
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 06, 2011, 08:10:29 AM
Way Nada, I would like to share a quote from from Shakespeare with you, "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones."

Tho it may be argued and discussed that Marcos was corrupt etc etc, in the end, the man authored over 90 Republic Acts, all of which are still in effect to this day.

I would like to share a rhetorical question to the rest in here: If he was so bad and if his presence in the Philippines was negative, then why didn't the presidential administrations after Marcos repudiate the some 92 Republic Acts that Marcos authored?

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 06, 2011, 08:21:55 AM
 by the military in Corregidor the PFP and other anti Marcos newspapers bannered the story without even bothering to investigate whether there is truth to their story. Ninoy in a privilege speech spoke of a massacre in congress and that a certain recruit named Arula who survived the massacre was picked up by fishermen in Manila Bay. This was not true and Ninoy believing his own lies went to Sulo to inquire about the person Arula after his speech in congress and he cannot find such a person.

Marcos allegedly signed an approval to recruit Muslims to be trained clandestinely by the military to sabotage Sabah. In an act of treachery in the person of Ninoy; he divulged to the world of a massacre of muslim in Corregidor. The story of a massacre was a myth creating a crisis for the Philippines when the Australian and the New Zealand navies were deployed right in front of Palawan in defense of Malaysia... an ally in the British commonwealth. The British deployed also the Gurkha Fighters in Sabah to help Malaysia in case the Philippines invade Sabah or North Borneo.

The Philippine government apologized to the Malaysian and the British Commonwealth saying that it was only part of the free rolling Philippine press. But the PFP and other anti Marcos newspapers never rectify their story.

WN


The Malaysians (with the help of the British Forces and Australian Forces) was able to defeat the Indonesian-Malaysian Konfrontasi. The result of which led to Sukarno's loss of legitimacy and an administration change in Indonesia.

I would deign to add that Marcos, who was a law bar top-knotcher, was not as stupid as Sukarno in engaging the Malaysians (with their Commonwealth clout). Tho the state of Malaysia is a British invention and despite North Borneo's historical relations with the Philippines, Marcos knew there really was nothing he could do after Malaysia proved itself that it could defend her right to national sovereignty.

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 08:45:19 AM


don’t tell me it was wrong for the philippine free press magazine (which was established in 1907) to honor marcos as man of the year in 1965.  

meanwhile, here's a little backgrounder that may be worth our while:

“Since 1946, our father has exposed the corruption of Philippine politics through every administration. Having defied the moves of Marcos to impose martial law, he was, upon the declaration of martial law in 1972, arrested and detained.  The Philippines Free Press was shut down, and its assets were sold to a Marcos crony. In 1985, however, our father resumed the publication of the Philippines Free Press to support the candidacy of Corazon Cojuangco Aquino - even in the teeth of military censorship.”  (Enrique L. Locsin on Teodoro M. Locsin Sr.)


http://www.glphils.org/kinship/ (http://www.glphils.org/kinship/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 08:54:59 AM

 by the military in Corregidor the PFP and other anti Marcos newspapers bannered the story without even bothering to investigate whether there is truth to their story. Ninoy in a privilege speech spoke of a massacre in congress and that a certain recruit named Arula who survived the massacre was picked up by fishermen in Manila Bay. This was not true and Ninoy believing his own lies went to Sulo to inquire about the person Arula after his speech in congress and he cannot find such a person.

jibin arula is real, alive and well.  if indeed as you claim ninoy didn’t find him when he went to sulu, why, of course, if i were arula, i would not trust any government man to see me.  i’d be too paranoid by then to even believe that the government man in the person of ninoy may even be followed by some military sniper out to finish me off.  

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2077/2343294650_58069f67aa.jpg)
Jibin Arula, lone survivor of the Jabidah Massacre
He's the one in the middle of the photo, in the light blue shirt.  

at the time of the jabidah massacre in 1968, jibin arula was 27 years old.  

really, way nada, sir, it only takes a few minutes and some patience to browse the internet to verify these things.  i personally would not rely on my own figment of imagination, no matter how colorful it may be, just to make myself feel right about my personal biases.    
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:00:05 AM



So you expect the dictator to conduct a clean and honest election to find out whether or not the people he is oppressing would want to throw him out? You expect him to honor the voice of the people? Or ar you saying that the people have no recourse at all and therefore will just have to accept their misfortune and stoically wait for the oppressor to die?

What some dictators do is cling to legitimacy by insisting on the letter of the law (which oftentimes was made by them)--the spirit of the law and the sentiments and welfare of their people be damned.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 09:04:32 AM

the philippine government apologized in embarrassment, knowing that the secret plan to invade sabah (it wasn't to sabotage) was secret no more because of ninoy, will not have any foreign help, even from the u.s., which despite bilateral military agreements is wont to side with the british.  we didn’t stand a chance.  to supposedly continue keeping the operation secret (face-saving at the expense of lives), the trainees were allegedly massacred. the lone survivor, the one who came out alive to tell the tale, is real and alive and well, as you can see.

Jabidah Massacre survivor to join anniversary rites

By Jocelyn Uy
Philippine Daily Inquirer
First Posted 22:49:00 03/17/2008

MANILA, Philippines -- An emblem that commemorates the scores of Moro youths killed in the Jabidah massacre 40 years ago will be unveiled on Tuesday at the Kindley Airfield on Corregidor Island, the scene of the atrocity, according to a Muslim group.

The gruesome Jabidah Massacre was believed to have sparked the Muslim rebellion.  According to the MindaNews web site, it is the reckoning date of the founding of the Moro National Liberation Front (MNLF) although its actual creation was on a much later date.

The event refers to the killings of about 60 Muslim youths trained to invade Sabah by henchmen of the late dictator President Ferdinand Marcos on March 18, 1968.

Only one survived to tell the tale, Jibin Arula, who is expected to lead anniversary rites by the Mindanao Peoples’ Caucus on Corregidor Island on Tuesday.

If Arula would be able to join the group, it would be his first time to set foot on Corregidor since the massacre.


More at
http://opinion.inquirer.net/ (http://opinion.inquirer.net/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 09:15:09 AM

 freedom”, it meant that marcos took away the democratic freedom that was known by the filipino people, that freedom for which those soldiers both dead and living fought for during world war 2,..."

Reply:

I think you are wrong. He did not contrive to suppress our freedom but the communists did. The bombing of Plaza Miranda created the situation as attested to by Cor. Victor Corpuz... after the fall of Marcos when he returned to his unit in the AFP. Ex senator Jovito Salonga a political opponent of Marcos accused him as the mastermind in the Plaza Miranda bombing; but after listening to accounts of the bombing by former communists Romulo Kintanar who returned to the fold of the law saying that; Plaza Miranda bombing was the brainchild of the communists... he [Salonga] stops his accusation.

i think i’m not wrong; i’m just looking at things without myopia.  how can people of another ideology who are not in power ever have the power to suppress a whole country’s freedom?    did the communists do away with the writ of habeas corpus?  did they suppress the press?  let us grant that the communists may have terrified the people, especially those in the countryside, but suppress our freedom?  they were too far away from the reins of power to be able to do that.  have you heard of the word ‘logic’?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 09:26:52 AM

sure, that was some series of headlines in those days, courtesy of the media.  kintanar’s execution needed all the media exposure it could get as points for the government in the same way that osama bin laden’s assassination now is earning media mileage and points for the u.s.

so kintanar was liquidated for being a traitor, but so did some non-communists who criticized the marcos government also inexplicably disappear forever.  (foremost was one-time presidential confidante and press secretary primitivo mijares, author of 'the conjugal dictatorship of ferdinand and imelda marcos'.  there were unexplained disappearances of an estimated 10 thousand others, all allegedlly against the marcos dictatorship.)
   
it doesn’t follow that just because one side is wrong the other is right.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 09:31:53 AM


and just because there was an arms shipment for the communists the whole country’s freedom needed to be suppressed?  where was our then commander-in-chief’s military?  note that it’s the media that divulged this (according to you), and suddenly, you believe the media despite your repeated claims that they’re not worth believing?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 09:51:42 AM

and that's why those trainees had to be silenced forever?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 09:59:45 AM

Quote:

you forget that during marcos's two-decade rule he controlled the media for over half of the period.  one of the first things he did after he declared martial law was the closure of all media outlets.  these slowly resurfaced when it was made sure that they would toe the government line.  add the fact that some outlets were taken over by his close associates (a kinder term for cronies), like roberto benedicto, and abs-cbn of the lopezes and rpn came under direct government management, among others.  and they cast aspersion against marcos?  come on.

your declaration that martial law's purpose was to save the country from communist despotism is those media's line.  yet you don't believe in the media?  how can you negate yourself?



Reply:

Martial Law is emergency government therefore those publishers who were antagonistic to Martial Law were detained and their newspapers closed or were taken over by the government. Their closure was not for long. It opened again with a new face lift and with a new horizon, so to speak. His purpose was not to control but to regulate the media. I believe it was also good for the people. Why?

Here is my explanation;

The media before Martial Law and in the post Martial Law media don't look any different. They are irresponsible media. In our constitution it says; "No law shall be passed abridging the freedom of speech, of expression or of the press". With this constitutional provision as their protection... they become as chaotic and as rambunctious media making themselves look like an unstoppable train on its track. Who cares? They can easily lambast and castigate politicians or other persons by the lure of the color of money. We think that our system is democratic but we are also well-known worldwide that there are more than many journalists killed if we are compared to some third world countries.   

Marcos was right... imagine they are more powerful than our elected officials and the president because we are to follow regulations.

* * *

Quote:

it is not a media invention.  neither is your claim that it's a media invention an invention of the media because it is your invention. yes, cesar virata was the prime minister then who will call for an election, when told by marcos to do so.

Reply:

Your thinking is too extremist. It's a media invention because there is nothing in the constitution that says he [Marcos] can write a memo to appoint a new president. The Marcos government is parliamentary and the media misled the people... maybe because of their hatred towards Marcos they kept away from the people the information on how a parliamentary form of government works.

When Marcos dies Cesar Virata as Prime Minister will call for a snap election. There is no such thing as a memo to be followed. By the way... snap election is parliamentary terminology.

* * *

WN


Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 10:09:46 AM

Shakespeare[/b] with you, "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones."

Tho it may be argued and discussed that Marcos was corrupt etc etc, in the end, the man authored over 90 Republic Acts, all of which are still in effect to this day.

I would like to share a rhetorical question to the rest in here: If he was so bad and if his presence in the Philippines was negative, then why didn't the presidential administrations after Marcos repudiate the some 92 Republic Acts that Marcos authored?

my dear manoy lorenz, no one's saying here that his presidency was all negative.  besides, we're tackling here his burial as a hero, not his presidency or the republic acts he "wrote" or the performance of the other presidents after him.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 10:45:43 AM

you're most welcome.  we are, at least, agreed on the mudslinging of politics, that's why you have no need to complain about the opposition denigrating marcos, right?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 11:28:04 AM

Quote:

if it wasn't, why didn't he simply go down and not run again after two terms because in the first place that was all that the 1935 constitution allowed him?  by 1972, he was already on his second and last term as president.  political analysts were already wagging that he was bound to stay longer.  everything in him, words and deeds, led those keen enough to understand human nature that it wasn't in him to give up power that easily.

Reply:

The presidential election was to be held in the month of November 1972. Marcos declared Martial Law on September 21, 1972. The election scheduled in November was cancelled and Marcos by virtue of Martial Law had a hold over power. Other political opinion at that time said that Marcos was right in his declaration of Martial Law. If Marcos stood down the communists will have taken over power.

* * *
 
Quote:

1971 constitutional convention

When news broke out that Marcos planned to amend the constitution, allowing him to run for a third term in the presidential elections of 1973, student-led protests erupted in the streets, in what has since become known as the First Quarter Storm of 1970.  Later, student movements also led the Diliman Commune of February 1971.  Despite the violent protests, the Constitutional Convention still convened in June 1971.

Reply:

Ninoy Aquino was part of this plan to overthrow Marcos. He was caught in a tape recorded conversation with the communists. The university students of Manila were used as tool to create  chaos. In January of 1973 the new constitution was ratified by the people and came into effect.

* * *

Quote:   

1986 snap elections

The snap elections were finally held on 7 February 1986, with Cory Aquino and Salvador “Doy” Laurel running against Marcos and Aurelio Tolentino for the presidency and the vice-presidency.  The heavily-anticipated elections were marred by vote-buying, oppression, and fraudulent results; with Commission on Elections (COMELEC) results were in favor of Marcos while the National Movement for Free Elections (NAMFREL) results were in favor of Aquino.  In protest, thirty computer operators walk out of the COMELEC tabulation center during the tabulation two days after the election.

Reply:

The allegation of oppression and fraudulent results in the snap election are not true. There was no oppression because Marcos was already established "name" among the people in the countryside. Marcos won because he had the political machinery and Cory Aquino with her saliva only. If I'm not telling you the truth then ask any politician worth his salt if a candidate without a political machinery can win in a national election.

Those who committed fraud in that election was Joe Concepcion and his Namfrel by manipulating the results through trending... which is why Comelec had a different result than Namfrel. The walked out of the computer operators was staged to show to the world media that the election was a farce. The real reason of all this election drama was the opposition knew they cannot defeat Marcos in a national election.

* * *

Quote: 

One of the most brutal incidents that happened in connection with the snap elections was the killing of lawyer Evelio Javier, opposition ex-governor of Antique, on 11 February 1986.  Javier was chased and shot to death in broad daylight at the provincial capitol.  The assassination was considered as one of the tipping points that led to the revolution. At his funeral mass, the official statement of the Catholic Bishops' Conference of the Philippines was read, condemning the elections. (wikipedia)

Reply:

I agree. They made Evelio Javier a rallying point to their cause to oust Marcos by any means. It is also the same thing today in the massacre of people in Mindanao by the Ampatuan.

* * *


Quote:

if these are still media inventions for you and you are therefore inclined not to believe, how does catholic church invention suit you?

Reply:

I am a catholic but I am not dogmatic. I am a traditionalist. The same with my treatment of the news in the media; I don't believe always as if they are gospel truth.

* * *

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 06, 2011, 11:43:14 AM

noted, isles. thank you. in my personal opinion, i recognize that Marcos had some flaws , made especially evident during his later years but he did contribute some good things to the country. and in some ways i do admire him (for his good traits, of course, not the bad).

my view lang.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 06, 2011, 11:44:13 AM

Way Nada, you are correct in maintaining your reservation in regards to the media. :)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 11:49:05 AM
(Enrique L. Locsin on Teodoro M. Locsin Sr.)[/i]


http://www.glphils.org/kinship/ (http://www.glphils.org/kinship/)

Reply:

Thanks... you said it!  After Marcos re-election the PFP became a Marcos critic. When his father was arrested T. L. Locsin Sr. became an oppositionist. Joaquin Roces, Max Soliven, Serge Osmena and Gene Lopez... they were arrested. They are only few. In an emergency government it is always the intellectual person or persons  that are arrested.

***
WN
 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 12:07:11 PM

so did marcos played politics as usual.  in fact, he played way, way before…

Quote
islander wrote:

"meantime, when something is questioned, there must be some weakness in that thing."

Reply:

Not necessarily. The things that is questioned by the media are the Marcos medals... and some people just swallow it hook, line and sinker. This not strange because there are lots of gullible people around. To show strenght of their claims they should show proof. According to the Philippine government through Gen. Restituto Aguilar; "Those who contest the authenticity of his [Marcos] medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”. Until now nobody shows up to contest the Marcos medals. 

it follows, actually.  why cast aspersion on something that's unimpeachable?  let's note in the meantime that there are equally gullible people around who swallow hook, line, sinker and whale marcos’s purported 27 medals of heroism. 

Quote
islander wrote:   

"your belief that marcos deserved all his 27 war medals must have some basis, such as your readings and your choice of what to believe in your readings.  that’s your right."

Reply:

Of course! It's not only a belief but it's a fact of history that Marcos was awarded these medals during WW-II.

i like your selective understanding of history.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 12:10:53 PM
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2077/2343294650_58069f67aa.jpg[/img]
Jibin Arula, lone survivor of the Jabidah Massacre
He's the one in the middle of the photo, in the light blue shirt. 

at the time of the jabidah massacre in 1968, jibin arula was 27 years old. 

really, way nada, sir, it only takes a few minutes and some patience to browse the internet to verify these things.  i personally would not rely on my own figment of imagination, no matter how colorful it may be, just to make myself feel right about my personal biases.   

Reply:

If Arula is a real person he should have been subpoenaed to appear in congress and testify about the massacre. The case about the Jabidah massacre reached the Supreme Court but there was no Arula. In your case you get your information always from the media. The last bulwark of our democracy is always in a court of law and I rely more in the result of an investigation in a court of law. The Jabidah Massacre maybe was the invention of Ninoy Aquino and the media. Believing his own lies he went to Sulo to look for Arula.

WN

* * *
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 12:16:18 PM
Jabidah Massacre survivor to join anniversary rites [/size]

By Jocelyn Uy
Philippine Daily Inquirer
First Posted 22:49:00 03/17/2008

MANILA, Philippines -- An emblem that commemorates the scores of Moro youths killed in the Jabidah massacre 40 years ago will be unveiled on Tuesday at the Kindley Airfield on Corregidor Island, the scene of the atrocity, according to a Muslim group.

The gruesome Jabidah Massacre was believed to have sparked the Muslim rebellion.  According to the MindaNews web site, it is the reckoning date of the founding of the Moro National Liberation Front (MNLF) although its actual creation was on a much later date.

The event refers to the killings of about 60 Muslim youths trained to invade Sabah by henchmen of the late dictator President Ferdinand Marcos on March 18, 1968.

Only one survived to tell the tale, Jibin Arula, who is expected to lead anniversary rites by the Mindanao Peoples’ Caucus on Corregidor Island on Tuesday.

If Arula would be able to join the group, it would be his first time to set foot on Corregidor since the massacre.


More at
http://opinion.inquirer.net/ (http://opinion.inquirer.net/)

Reply:

If there was a massacre please provide a court case. Did Arula testify in congress or in the court of law?

WN

***
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 12:27:59 PM

Reply:

Yes you are wrong. If you are not myopic then maybe you overlooked it. The communists in cahoots with Ninoy Aquino, the students and some of the clergy created the situation to suppress our freedom. Marcos made the preemptive action against the communists. The word "contrive" means to create a situation. Logic???

WN

***
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 12:36:17 PM

horse aside, and talking of an iota (which the dictionary says is "a very small quantity or degree; a jot; a particle"), i hereby offer the following iotas:


Posing as the most decorated Filipino soldier of World War II, Ferdinand Marcos foisted 33 medals and awards.  Bonifacio Gillego, in opposing Marcos’s dictatorship, exposed in 1982:

• Eleven of the 33 were given in 1963, nearly 20 years after the War, when Marcos was Senate President girding to run for President.  Ten of the 11 were given on the same day, December 20. Three of the ten unusually were given under only one General Order.

• One award was given on Marcos’s 55th birthday, September 17, 1972, when he was President, four days before he imposed martial law.

• Eight of the 33 “American and Philippine medals,” as listed by Marcos’s Office of Media Affairs, were actually campaign ribbons given to all participants in the defense of Bataan and in the resistance.

• Awards are duplicated for the same action on the same day and place.

• One is a special award from the Veterans Federation of the Philippines.


From Marcos medals: Only 2 of 33 given in battle, By Jarius Bondoc,
The Philippine Star, Thursday, April 28th, 2011 / 08:40 PM


http://www.philstar.com/ (http://www.philstar.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 12:51:22 PM

Yes of course! That was the provision in the constitution that; "the president can declare Martial Law if in his own judgement the Philippines is in iminent danger of rebellion". The shipment of arms from China for the communists was a sign that there was a rebellion. It was not only in Luzon but in Mindanao the MNLF of Nur Misuari openly revolted against the government. This was also one of the factors for the closure of the media that; in time of crisis the media should be pro government.

WN

*** 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 01:04:55 PM

hehe, as the usual terminology of marcos worshippers is ‘hero’.

Quote
And one thing I can say about Enrile is that; when his life was already in danger during his defiance against Marcos and to attract sympathy from the people he invented a story that his "ambush" was staged by Marcos. His story is unbelievable because it was done at the time when he rebelled against his boss Marcos. If it is for the sake of the people... he should have divulged it long time ago.

so?  just because he didn’t divulge it at once his statement is rendered false?  a late confession does not make a confession false.  oh, it wasn’t marcos who staged the ambush.  like any lackey obeying his boss, enrile himself arranged it upon marcos’s orders.

Quote
islander wrote: 

"was the communists’ npa ever a threat to national security in the real sense of the word? on hindsight, but for the usual government yarn then, the more threatening at the time was our own military that had more political power and better weapons than the ragtag npa, which didn’t have the support of the greater part of the population.  but the communists provided the marcos government with the best excuse to wield power sans check and balance."

Reply:

Yes. The CPP-NPA currently poses the greatest armed threat to the Philippine government and has the widest grass-roots support among the various Philippine leftist insurgent groups. The conflict between the CPP-NPA and the Philippine government has taken thousands of lives since the NPA’s inception. The peace talks between the NDF and the government is going nowhere.

WN

wow!  this party and ideology, marcos’s bogeymen, had been sidelined since the fall of the berlin wall, and you still believe they’re a threat?  come on, do you really believe until now, more than two decades later, the propaganda of the marcos years, with the controlled media as the conveyors?  what decade are you living in?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 06, 2011, 01:16:03 PM
 I was in DAVAO CITY during the SNAP ELECTION, & what i saw & experienced during those times is the TOTAL OPPOSITE sa gi ingon ni WAY NADA....what a JOKE! :D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 01:21:06 PM

 with war medals. These war medals were awarded to Marcos at the time when the war in the Philippines was raging in 1942. The US and Philippine governments never reported that those medals awarded to Marcos were fake medals. 

I for one agree with the 2 generals.

WN

i, too, believe in the two generals.  but remember marcos's awards didn't all come from these two generals.  he purportedly displayed 27 (some say it's 33).  that's why it's worth my time to ponder on this:

OTHER OBSERVATIONS:

• Marcos earned the Medal of Valor “for extraordinary gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of life above and beyond the call of duty in a suicidal action against overwhelming enemy forces at the junction of Salian River and Abo-Abo River, Bataan, on or about 22 January 1942.”  This highest Philippine military award came only in October 1958, when he was senior congressman, 16 years after.

• Only two of the medals were given during the War.  The Gold Cross came on July 22, 1945, “for gallantry in action at Kiangan, Mt. Province, in April 1945.”  Supposedly “Colonel Marcos, of the 14th Infantry, United States Armed Forces in the Philippines-North Luzon (USAFIP-NL), with one enlisted man volunteered to reconnoiter area adjacent to the regimental command post at Panupdupan.”  Marcos spotted well-camouflaged enemy trucks about a mile away and sent the enlisted man back to RCP to report. By himself Marcos ambushed the Japanese, forcing them to flee after 30 minutes of intense fighting.

• The Distinguished Service Star came on April 24, 1945.  The citation read: “For outstanding achievement as a guerrilla leader.   After escaping from the Fort Santiago Kempei Tai, Marcos supported ex-Mayor Vicente Umali, organizer and commanding general of the PQOG…  Despite his illness, he stayed at the headquarters in Banahaw to guide both the staff and combat echelons.  He refused the rank of ‘general’ offered him by General Umali and organized his own guerrilla group known as the Maharlika.”

Interviewed by Gillego in 1982, Marcos’s two superiors in the 14th Infantry debunked both citations.  Col. Romulo A. Manriquez, regimental commander, swore that Marcos was never assigned to patrol or combat, only as S-5 or civil affairs.  Not a colonel but a captain, Marcos joined the 14th Infantry from December 4, 1944 to April 28, 1945.  No Maharlika guerrilla group was formed in Kiangan on April 24, 1945.

Capt. Vicente L. Rivera, 14th Infantry adjutant, added that he had never recommended Marcos for any decoration.  The sighting of Japanese trucks a mile from RCP was geographically impossible because the nearest road was too far, half a day’s hike away.



From GOTCHA, Jarius Bondoc, The Philippine Star
Thursday, April 28th, 2011 / 08:40 PM



 
http://www.philstar.com/ (http://www.philstar.com/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 01:43:35 PM

maayo ka kay morag kalma-kalma ang davao ikomparar sa cebu atong panahona.  i was in the midst of the election as a young government worker.  purya, nasuko nako akong officemates kay wa ko mo-attend sa campaign ni marcos ug imelda sa cebu coliseum (pakaw-on mi ug magdala ug pompoms; nagpasumangil kog hilanat.  i felt then that i was too old to be a pompom-carrying cheerleader; professional na god kintahay ko. ;D )

worse, the whole office became a "secret tabulation center", with paid mediamen who came and went and were ready to report marcos with leading results.  (one of them was a boholano nga kanunay nako ikasingkahay kay luod kaayo ang iyang pagka-trying hard.  he became the office's laughingstock kay we knew he was there for the money.  supplier ra baya to siya ug mga girls sa mga visiting dignitaries.  naahat ug ka mediaman ang tonto.) 

the trick of the "secret tabulation center":  do not report the results of the opposition; set the mind of the people for marcos's victory.  my boss knew i would refuse; wa na ko pasudla sa office.  bata pa lagi ta, kamao pa mosukol, hehe.  pasumangil na lang akong boss ug assign nako sa voting centers.  nagnganga intawon ko sa may southern islands hospital gym, one of the voting centers.  hinoon, sige lang kog kaon ug potato chips didto.

when edsa happened, gitaktak ko sa akong trabaho.

note:  martial law had my brother detained at the stockade for nine months.  my sister was listed as "questionable".  a close relative was a concon delegate who got a mercedes benz from marcos.  need i say more?       
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 01:48:33 PM

So if you are agreeable... therefore the issue against the Marcos medals is politically motivated. It is true that denigrating and mudslinging are often used by vested interest group to take issue to further a political end. By asserting an idea under the protection of freedom of the press can you smear, defame or sully the reputation of a person? This is often predicated on lies and falsehood and I think this is wrong especially if the person concerned is a dead man.

Marcos since he first ran for election in 1948 he capitalized on his medals to attract voters to vote for him. He campaigned in the 1965 presidential election comparing him a war hero to the Liberal Party candidate Sergio Osmena Jr. who was selling scrap iron to the Japanese army during the war.

There was never an issue that his medals are fake until in 1982 a certain Bonifacio Gillego came out with his allegation that the Marcos medals are not genuine who relies his information from people supposedly Marcos comrades in arms during WW-II. Therefore it's a sort of info coming from gossip and political innuendoes... which is why they are really false. And more... not a single information from him that says; he sourced it from the archives of the US and Philippine military.

WN
***   
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 02:15:35 PM
Quote
so did marcos played politics as usual.  in fact, he played way, way before…
Reply:

"Naturally politics is playing as usual." That is your quote not mine. But Marcos is not playing politics... he is a dead man. His enemies are playing politics with a dead body. A sort of desecration of the dead.
***

Quote
it follows, actually.  why cast aspersion on something that's unimpeachable?  let's note in the meantime that there are equally gullible people around who swallow hook, line, sinker and whale marcos’s purported 27 medals of heroism.
Reply:

If you have unimpeachable evidence then you must go to the proper venue and complain that Marcos medals are fake. Anyway Gen. Restituto Aguilar I believe will entertain your evidence thus saying; "Those who contest the authenticity of his [Marcos] medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”. So that once and for all the Marcos medals' issue will come to a stop.

WN

***

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 02:26:41 PM

just because we are agreed on political motivations does not mean that we are agreed about the medals.  besides, his claims to these medals can also be branded as politically motivated, okay?  he capitalized on these to election victory, as you imply.

gillego sourced his information from marcos's superiors at the 14th infantry (please see reply #136).  his report was lent credence by the findings of historian alfred w. mccoy.  here i post again what i've previously posted:   

Marcos’s war hero image collapsed when The New York Times ran an exclusive on January 23, 1986.  He was then wrapping up the election campaign against Cory, widow of Ninoy Aquino. As usual he regaled the crowds with accounts of his hot exploits.  The Times doused cold water on his stories, quoting the US Army description of them as mostly “absurd” and “fraudulent”.  Main source was Alfred W. McCoy, a history professor who was researching records just turned over to the National Archives in Washington. McCoy unearthed two requests by Marcos in 1945 and 1948 for official recognition of Mga Maharlika.  Both were rejected as Army investigators found the claims to be exaggerated.  Ray Hunt Jr., an ex-Army captain who directed guerrilla activities in 1942-44 in Pangasinan, North Luzon, was quoted in the Times article as saying the Maharlika was fictitious.  He said if any unit had operated near his base then, he would have known about it.  The investigators said Marcos even associated with men engaged in “nefarious activity,” like supplying contraband to the Japanese.

The opposition press picked up the Times story.  It confirmed what retired Philippine Army Col. Bonifacio Gillego had stated only months before in The Fake Medals of Marcos.  The underground book branded the 27 decorations as outright phonies or awarded through bogus accounts.  Also exposed then was Marcos’s rejected application for war reparation of $595,000. Supposedly it was for the US Army’s commandeering of 2,000 heads of cattle from his (inexistent) family ranch in Mindanao.

Marcos ordered political lieutenants to refute the reports. They came up with a more incredible claim that the medals were for acts in 1941 and 1945, at war’s beginning and end. This only lent more credence to Gillego’s statement that, for Marcos to have fought the 27 battles, he would have been at different places at the same time.


From GOTCHA By Jarius Bondoc (The Philippine Star) Updated April 08, 2011 12:00 AM


http://www.philstar.com (http://www.philstar.com)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 02:42:24 PM

Quote
horse aside, and talking of an iota (which the dictionary says is "a very small quantity or degree; a jot; a particle"), i hereby offer the following iotas:

Reply:

Let me see your small evidence.


Quote
Posing as the most decorated Filipino soldier of World War II, Ferdinand Marcos foisted 33 medals and awards.  Bonifacio Gillego, in opposing Marcos’s dictatorship, exposed in 1982:

Reply:

So... who is Bonifacio Gillego? Is he a government agent authorize to authenticate the medals of Marcos?
***
Quote
• Eleven of the 33 were given in 1963, nearly 20 years after the War, when Marcos was Senate President girding to run for President.  Ten of the 11 were given on the same day, December 20. Three of the ten unusually were given under only one General Order.


• One award was given on Marcos’s 55th birthday, September 17, 1972, when he was President, four days before he imposed martial law.

• Eight of the 33 “American and Philippine medals,” as listed by Marcos’s Office of Media Affairs, were actually campaign ribbons given to all participants in the defense of Bataan and in the resistance.

• Awards are duplicated for the same action on the same day and place.

• One is a special award from the Veterans Federation of the Philippines.

Reply:

Where is the declaration of Jarius Bondoc that Marcos medals are fake? Nada!
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 06, 2011, 02:42:52 PM
 medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”. So that once and for all the Marcos medals' issue will come to a stop.

WN

***


way nada, if your logic turns this way, then i am just wasting my time on this discussion.  but let me try to follow your logic anyway, no matter how different it is from mine and no matter how i insult myself in the process.  

if you must tell me to go to the proper venue to complain that marcos's medals are fake, then i must also tell you to go and bury marcos yourself and give him the proper hero's burial.  better still, jump into the grave and have yourself be buried with him.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 02:54:22 PM

Quote
so?  just because he didn’t divulge it at once his statement is rendered false?  a late confession does not make a confession false.  oh, it wasn’t marcos who staged the ambush.  like any lackey obeying his boss, enrile himself arranged it upon marcos’s orders.

Reply:

His statement is doubtful because it is a long drawn second opinion. It can be false! It was spoken at a time when his life was already in danger.

Quote
wow!  this party and ideology, marcos’s bogeymen, had been sidelined since the fall of the berlin wall, and you still believe they’re a threat?  come on, do you really believe until now, more than two decades later, the propaganda of the marcos years, with the controlled media as the conveyors?  what decade are you living in?


Reply:

Yes they are a threat. You know why? Because they still retain an armed group in the hills. And unknown to some they are already in government posing as progressives.

WN
***
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 02:54:33 PM

That subject corpse is the remains of one of the most corrupt leaders in the history of mankind is a well-settled fact. Enough said.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 04:28:34 PM
Quote
just because we are agreed on political motivations does not mean that we are agreed about the medals.  besides, his claims to these medals can also be branded as politically motivated, okay?  he capitalized on these to election victory, as you imply.

Reply:

The bone of contention here is; "if the Marcos medals are fake or not". If the issue is politically motivated as agreed by you then it is clear as the noon day sun that the Marcos medals are truly genuine. In his case he did not claim to the medals but they were awarded to him. ****

Quote
gillego sourced his information from marcos's superiors at the 14th infantry (please see reply #136).  his report was lent credence by the findings of historian alfred w. mccoy.  here i post again what i've previously posted:
 


Reply:

"Sourced his information from marcos's superiors?" You see... they are not the right people to be believed. Gillego's information must come first hand from the archivists of the US and the Philippine military with a certification saying that; they have no information on record awarding war medals to Marcos. Thus debunking the 27 medals of Marcos as fake. And then... tapos na ang boksing if you have this certification. ***


Quote
Marcos’s war hero image collapsed when The New York Times ran an exclusive on January 23, 1986.  He was then wrapping up the election
Quote
campaign against Cory, widow of Ninoy Aquino. As usual he regaled the crowds with accounts of his hot exploits.  The Times doused cold water on his stories, quoting the US Army description of them as mostly “absurd” and “fraudulent”.  Main source was Alfred W. McCoy, a history professor who was researching records just turned over to the National Archives in Washington. McCoy unearthed two requests by Marcos in 1945 and 1948 for official recognition of Mga Maharlika.  Both were rejected as Army investigators found the claims to be exaggerated.  Ray Hunt Jr., an ex-Army captain who directed guerrilla activities in 1942-44 in Pangasinan, North Luzon, was quoted in the Times article as saying the Maharlika was fictitious.  He said if any unit had operated near his base then, he would have known about it.  The investigators said Marcos even [/quo associated with men engaged in “nefarious activity,” like supplying contraband to the Japanese.

Reply:

If Alfred W. McCoy "unearthed two requests by Marcos in 1945 and 1948 for official recognition of Mga Maharlika" why he not able to look into Marcos war medals when he had accessed the National Archives in Washington? Why did the National Archives curator allowed McCoy access to Marcos war records and denied Bonifacio Gillego when the later a Filipino has more interest in Marcos war records than McCoy?

Who is Alfred W. McCoy?

Alfred W. McCoy as the report said is a professor of history. His biodata states that he authored many books and researcher of history in Southeast Asia and elsewhere in the world. His biodata says more that he is a researcher on Philipine history and government but I failed to find if he wrote about the war records of Marcos... except a news opinion printed in NYT. ***
Marcos ordered political lieutenants to refute the reports. They came up with a more incredible claim that the medals were for acts in 1941 and 1945, at war’s beginning and end. This only lent more credence to Gillego’s statement that, for Marcos to have fought the 27 battles, he would have been at different places at the same time.


Reply:

Some medals were awarded during the war and some after the war. What is wrong with that?

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 04:41:00 PM

I'm not insisting on my logic. It's you who is persistent. I am siding with Enrile, Maceda, Gen. Douglas MacArthur, Gen, Jonathan Wainwright, the US and the Philippine governments that the Marcos medals are genuine. That is simple logic.***

WN

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 04:48:03 PM

You see... you were in Davao city, it means Cory is popular in cities but when it comes to probinsiya or countryside the people there are for Marcos.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 05:05:32 PM
Quote
Tho it may be argued and discussed that Marcos was corrupt etc etc, in the end, the man authored over 90 Republic Acts, all of which are still in effect to this day.



Reply:

There is no government that is free from corruption but media in other countries don't use the issue of corruption to put down their government officials if they have no evidence. If Marcos authored over 90 Republic Acts... there are more. Marcos had crafted more than 7,800 Presidential Decrees and other legal issuances – from the crib to the grave, so to speak. They are still in effect until today except those that pertain to Martial Law. If Marcos is an evil person our new leaders in government should have repealed all the laws of Marcos.

He is a great lawgiver second only to Moses.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 06, 2011, 05:23:01 PM

Quote
So you expect the dictator to conduct a clean and honest election to find out whether or not the people he is oppressing would want to throw him out? You expect him to honor the voice of the people? Or ar you saying that the people have no recourse at all and therefore will just have to accept their misfortune and stoically wait for the oppressor to die?


Reply:

Let me say this... there's no need for Marcos to cheat in an election. Nobody can defeat him because he had a complete political machinery. You must also distinguish who the people felt being oppressed by Martial Law. There are only a few. They are businessmen who are antagonistic to Marcos laws on business, the media, the academe, [professors and students] and intellectuals like lawyers... but the vast majority of the people loved Marcos because the Marcos system was pro poor.


Quote

What some dictators do is cling to legitimacy by insisting on the letter of the law (which oftentimes was made by them)--the spirit of the law and the sentiments and welfare of their people be damned.

Reply:

Marcos did not cling to legitimacy unlike GMA whose presidency is questioned until now. Marcos was a brilliant lawyer and his Martial Law presidency is legal because it is provided in the constitution.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 07:26:22 PM

"If you can't convince them, confuse them." --Harry S. Truman
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 07:27:22 PM

"When a finger points to the moon, the imbecile looks at the finger." --Chinese Proverb
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 06, 2011, 08:20:04 PM


usa ka dektador,,maayo iapil tong mga heneral niya og lobong,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 08:27:37 PM


Daghan ra ba pud kuno to siyag gipapatay...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 06, 2011, 08:29:35 PM

nakadungog bitaw pod ko ana.....so unsa man gyu'y atong buhaton ani ron....
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 08:38:53 PM


Hmm, magpatambag kaha ta ni Prof. Islander?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 06, 2011, 08:51:51 PM

di ko mosampit ato kay basin madukol ug luwag ato.....

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 06, 2011, 08:53:58 PM

maka ulit kon madukol og luwag bai,,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 06, 2011, 08:54:41 PM

makahakog?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 08:55:20 PM


Hmm, kon maohon kadto na lang diayng usa pa nimong katagilungsod... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 06, 2011, 08:56:44 PM

busy.....


basin nabunalan to'g luwag si Makoy...kay perting daw-a na man ato?...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 06, 2011, 09:02:56 PM

oo sige daw kaon,,di mabusog,,he,he,,mao na gitawag,,sa tiyan mo gunit sa lobot mosirit,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 06, 2011, 09:26:35 PM
probinsiya[/i] or countryside the people there are for Marcos.

WN


 hahaha, probinsya & countryside? ??? pareha ra ang ilang gibati ni MALCOS adtong panahuna. SUBRA NA, TAMA NA! You know a LOT of things about MALCOS, but some of them is FULL of GAS :-[
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 06, 2011, 09:30:06 PM
popular lagi sa ka dektador,,he,he,he,,nya ilobong diay tipo sa mga bayani?,,he,he,he,,kaayo ra tulion,,he,he,,ngano man pod god nang pamilyaha mamogos man og lobong didto?og ilobong diay na sa ubang menteryo,,paita,,or maghimo nalang sila og kaugalingong menteryo,,,he,he,,kini pong magbabalaod,,murag di jod angay nang unahon og tuki oi,,unahon unta tong maka ayo sa mga tawo sa atong nasod,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:41:00 PM


Hmm, siging hungit bisag init, siging tilaw bisag hilaw?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:42:32 PM


Minarcos diay? Binuangon tawhana...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:43:46 PM

Dawo pas tanang nangatepok...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:45:32 PM


Hmm, way katagbawan bay? Hangtod moburot na lang ang nawong?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:47:19 PM


Nag-otot-otot diay bay. Nasobrahan tingali sa pagarpar...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 06, 2011, 09:51:26 PM


Sky burial ang angay bay... ipakaon sa vultures (oops, cannibalism na man ni...)





Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 06, 2011, 09:51:34 PM

mao jod,,,sige lang hakot katakottakot promo,,he,he,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 06, 2011, 10:14:58 PM

mahinumdom bitaw ko sa una...after sa Edsa 1, ang mga bata nga magduwa ug lastiko ba o jolen kon tikasan gani moingon dayon nga "Way Marcosay".....
 >:(
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 06, 2011, 10:48:06 PM

Ang term sa bugoy adtong panahuna Bai, dili pagarpar. Kong dih, NAG BUWA -BUWA! >:(
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 07, 2011, 12:19:15 AM

simbako intawon ug sunod sa hero's burial sa libingan ng mga bayani ang rome na pod ang target, para beatification and canonization, kay buotan ug maayohon ra ba gyod kaayo kuno tong presidenteha, wa gyod mangawat ug manikas sa eleksyon kay siya man gyod intawon ang gusto sa mga pilipino.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 07, 2011, 01:00:19 AM

i'm persistent and you are not? 

discussions such as what we have in this forum encourage us to learn more, through shared opinions and proper research and cross-references, with a certain detachment from one's emotional leanings and personal loyalties, so we can make informed conclusions.  had you not mentioned that i or anyone who has an opposing view to yours should go to that afp museum consultant with the evidence that the medals are fake (what a non-sequitur!) or had you not insisted that there was no election cheating, i might have held on to some hope that there's some shred of intellect left in you. 

there you are insisting on your simple logic.  too simple, in fact, that you've just convinced me that your horizon extends only up to the tip of your nose.  any discussion with you wasn't worth a minute of my time after all.  henceforth, i'd rather discuss heroism with a cadaver, whether it's waiting for a hero's burial or not.  honest. 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 07, 2011, 01:04:22 AM
may karapatan si former Pres. Marcos nga gahinan ug lugar sa libingan ng mga bayani isip usa ka opisyal sa sundalo sa WW-II, ug gani matud pa nya sa dihang ng kampanya sya sa Bohol kaniadto nga sa Bohol sya nadistino sa panahon sa giyera sa WW-II, gilakaw ni nya gikan Calape padulong sa Carmen. Ang tag-iya sa Balay nga iyang gisak-an sa Calape ug tanan nga anak iyang gihatagan ug trabaho sa public works & highway.   
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 07, 2011, 03:23:31 AM

tinood?,,pero nabulingan man god ni gumikan sa martial law..
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 07, 2011, 03:46:50 AM
 Pastilan! kong ilubong si MALCOS didto, mag PEOPLE POWER napod ang mga gipanglubong didto! :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:12:29 AM


Niburot ang nawong nga baga nang daan...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:13:50 AM


He he, kahinumdom ka ani kay ikaw maoy giingnan? ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:15:18 AM


Sakto bay, sa Iningles pa, foaming in the mouth like a wild boar!
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:26:32 AM


...ug tungod sa naghingaping gugma sa katawhan ngaha kaniya, gihinginlan siya ug sama sa usa la matuod nga bayani nagkabilatbilat siyag layas inubanan sa makalilisang nga pangurog sa itlog...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:28:30 AM

gilakaw ni nya gikan Calape padulong sa Carmen[/b]. Ang tag-iya sa Balay nga iyang gisak-an sa Calape ug tanan nga anak iyang gihatagan ug trabaho sa public works & highway.   

Bwahaha! Hero jud tuod, tiaw moy gabaktas...  :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:31:18 AM


Bwahaha! Paet kay di na jud siya makaipsot anang higayona!
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 06:32:59 AM


Di lang gani kay nabulingan. Naglunang sa lang-og nga tunaan sa pag-abuso sa gahom...  >:(
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 07, 2011, 10:09:07 AM

usahay......pero mas daghan to'ng wa sila kahibawo..
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 02:43:13 PM


He he, maayo diay nimong pagkaliwat sa bayani nga imong idolo...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 07, 2011, 05:46:13 PM
ambot kong wala pa siguro si Pres Marcos mangutang basin Lamparahan nga de kerosene pa suga sa kadaghanang Bol-anon.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 07, 2011, 09:53:11 PM

deli siguro pod oi,,magka moderno man ang panahon,,konwala pa si Marcos,,siguro ang mapoli makahuna2x pod siguro,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 07, 2011, 10:53:39 PM

Kon wa pa si Marcos basin tua ra ta sa atoa ron, di na ta kinahanglan mo-abroad...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 09, 2011, 01:17:11 AM

mao kajod,maajo kay nanagbroad na diay mo,,paaria si marcos deri para maka abroad me,,he,he,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 09, 2011, 06:45:21 AM


He he, si Bay Bugsay maoy akong buot ipasabot nga tuas abroad...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 10, 2011, 01:36:27 AM
ikaw diay?kon gawas ka sa REPUBLIC OF BOHOL abroad pod ngan nimo,,he,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 10, 2011, 06:29:27 AM

[/quote
Di jud siguro, kay si Sen Ople dating Dept. Labor secretary ug si Pres Marcos  silang duha ang naningkamot nga makadaug sa Manpower Bidding sa Middle East sa Arabian American Company (ARAMCO) late of 1960's Ug didto nagsugod ang OFW sa karon.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 10, 2011, 07:20:10 AM

Dili pareho. Ngano man? Tungod kay ang mga tawo nga napungot kaayo ni Marcos kadto ra mang magasigi ug basa ug opposition newspaper. Hibaw ba ka kung pila ra ka libo ang circulasyon sa newspaper sa panahon ni Marcos? 2,000 mil lang. Kay uban dili na layhan kay puro pabor man ni Marcos ang balita. Nan karon ug moingon ta nga mag-eleksyon modaug jud si Marcos kay iya man ang gamhanan nga "political machinery" sa tibook Pilipinas ug siya ra ang nailhan.

WN

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 10, 2011, 07:26:55 AM

 SAY WHAT? ::) LAYO RA KAAYO'S TINO-OD NING IMONG REASONING!!! :D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 10, 2011, 08:26:34 AM
islander quoted:
Quote
i'm persistent and you are not?


Reply:

Yes you are persistent... The truth is; "Marcos was awarded medals during WW-II". The 2 generals of the US Army MacArthur and Wainwright awarded Marcos those medals and they were representing the US government. Marcos medals are in the custody of the AFP museum and his war records are in the US military archives.

The statements above is where I based my reasoning. If you are still persistent that my reasoning is without bases... then you must go to the US and the Philippine governments to verify since they are in the best position to know the truth about the medals of Marcos and not Bonifacio Gillego or the opinion of Jarius Bondoc.  

According to the curator/custodian of the Marcos medals Gen. Restituto Aguilar; "Those who contest the authenticity of his [Marcos] medals should substantiate their allegations. It shall undergo investigations and should follow a process”.

islander quoted:
Quote
discussions such as what we have in this forum encourage us to learn more, through shared opinions and proper research and cross-references, with a certain detachment from one's emotional leanings and personal loyalties, so we can make informed conclusions.  had you not mentioned that i or anyone who has an opposing view to yours should go to that afp museum consultant with the evidence that the medals are fake (what a non-sequitur!) or had you not insisted that there was no election cheating, i might have held on to some hope that there's some shred of intellect left in you.
 


Reply:

I agree but let us not go somewhere to the height of obstinacy just to insist a baseless and unfounded opinion. Why? Because Gillego's opinion is based on the opinion of other people like Lt. Manriquez. He [Gillego] tried to access the US achives but he was not permitted. How can we believe him? From Gillego's opinion it was copied by Jarius Bondoc and other opinion writers in the newspapers. All together your opinion is based on the newspapers. Marcos medals are in the court of public opinion so many times. This is trial by publicity against a dead man.  

I have no emotional leanings and I have no brothers or sisters who were detained during Martial Law. My opposition to Marcos at the advent of Martial Law is simply political. I was there at the MIA when Ninoy Aquino arrived from the US.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 10, 2011, 08:28:58 AM

Nganong layo ra man sa tinood ang akong rason. Unsa may imong rason nga matawag nga tinood?

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 10, 2011, 09:19:38 AM
Way Nada,

You're calm and steady nature under pressure is marvelous. You, good sir, are brilliant. Excellent debate to all members in here. Excellent.

I tip my hat to you, Sir WN.


Lorenz.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 10, 2011, 09:24:43 AM
Despite all the feelings antagonistic to Pres. Ferdinand Marcos, I admit that I am a big fan of his. He was a brilliant politician , an intelligent one who stayed in power for over 2 decades. His mastery of the due process of the law and the machinations of the Philippine Government is almost like clockwork.

Marcos' Martial Law Speech. This man had guts.

Ferdinand Marcos Martial Law Decree Speech + Reggae Beats (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HETtwd04rkc#ws)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 10, 2011, 04:23:45 PM

tip your beard too, as you sit in judgment over mere mortals. ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 10, 2011, 04:42:37 PM

due process of the law and the machinations of the Philippine Government is almost like clockwork. [/b]

 ???  you seem so sure you sound as if you've lived through it...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 10, 2011, 05:23:17 PM
10 reasons why Marcos should not be declared a hero

Absurdia
Carla Montemayor
April 15, 2011
 
Must we really go through the reasons why this would be a travesty?  Fine.  Here are the top 10 reasons why, some of them dredged up from the depths of my frustration.

#1. An estimated 10,000 Filipinos killed, tortured and brutalized during Martial Law.  That’s already 10,000 reasons, but let me continue.

#2. His widow will be entitled to a pension.  And we all know she’s already got enough cash—our cash.
I have a theory: we will stand an ever lesser chance of getting our money back from them.  How can any court seize property/funds that belong to a “hero”?  That’s like attempting to impound Rizal’s ancestral home in Laguna (assuming JR stole anything, which he didn’t).

#3. Fake war medals.  FAKE.  Which bit of “fake war medals” is ambiguous?  Okay, he might have served in a clerical position with the US Army but the rest of his alleged heroic exploits have been exposed as lies.  The US Army has never acknowledged the existence of the guerrilla unit he claimed to have led (Ang Mga Maharlika), nor rewarded him for his alleged bravery at the Battle of Bessang Pass.  Why should he be buried with real heroes?

#4. Which brings us to Ka Boni Gillego. Not only did he expose Marcos’s fake medals, he also served as a truly honourable member of the House of Representatives.  Now there’s a great man.  Want to spit on Ka Boni’s grave?  Make Marcos a hero.

#5. DECS will have to revise all history textbooks to glorify Marcos and depict the Martial Law era as a peaceful and prosperous epoch in Philippine history.  Sayang ang papel.  Save the trees, save the planet!

#6. About 25 years from now, a young, brilliant and ambitious politician will run for Congress, then for the senate, then for President.  Then he’ll proclaim that he will save the nation from communism/terrorism/climate change, round up all his critics and throw them in jail, proclaim himself President for life and loot the national coffers dry.  Guess which history books he had been reading as a child?

#7. Speaking of revisionism, we will have to declare Pinochet, Suharto, Duvalier, Somoza and the entire barkada of tyrants and crooks from that era heroes, as well.  Oh, and let’s not forget Muammar Gadaffi, though he’s still alive and being overthrown by enraged Libyans.  When he, um, exits from this world, he’ll have to be declared a hero, too.  It’s all for the sake of consistency.  Can’t make one tyrant a hero while the others stay tyrants—it’s not fair.

Hey, why not go further? Why not also re-classify Hitler as a hero and the Holocaust as a hoax?  (Warning: Making these assertions in public will land you in jail in many European countries.)

#8. Amay Bisaya will be vindicated.  All this time he has professed that the Apo was a patriot and now he’ll be proven right.  Amay Bisaya gloating and doing the dance of joy.  Sit there and contemplate that image.

#9. It will validate the decision of 216 members of the House of Representatives.  Do you really want to give any satisfaction to those scumbags?

It is our moral obligation as responsible Filipino citizens to deny these sleazy lowlifes any form of happiness. They have no qualms about doing it to us.  There they sit in that hall, claiming to represent us, addressing each other as “Honorable,” enjoying the perks of our democracy while savaging it, along with our history.

Here’s news for the 216: no one will remember you in 20 years’ time.  But next elections, we will.

#10. Marcos built his own monument to himself—that automatically disqualifies him from being a hero.  There is one inviolable rule for would-be heroes.  All great men and women know it, though it’s not written anywhere: You cannot honor yourself in any way while you’re still alive. I t’s just not done.  It marks you out as an egomaniac—not hero material.

A portrait is fine; all presidents have their portraits painted for posterity.  An autobiography is acceptable.  But a bust the size of an asteroid is never cool.  Sobrang laki ng ulo.  Literally and figuratively.

I guess tyrants cannot be modest by definition.  I doubt whether they understand that greatness is like a nickname: you cannot give it to yourself; others must confer it upon you. (Newsbreak)


http://www.newsbreak.ph/ (http://www.newsbreak.ph/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 10, 2011, 06:18:54 PM

(Newsbreak)[/i]


(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRT8KDF7m1A_BY7-wH9DbrPm3Rg74BNhHcY7ijBKJkdNkrfzfT_RuB21Q)


Hmm, ayohon galing ni kon tua na sa LNMB ang hingtungdan? :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 10, 2011, 09:05:53 PM
http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRT8KDF7m1A_BY7-wH9DbrPm3Rg74BNhHcY7ijBKJkdNkrfzfT_RuB21Q[/img]


Hmm, ayohon galing ni kon tua na sa LNMB ang hingtungdan? :P

 Aw! ILA GYUD NAH IPA BELLO! :D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 10, 2011, 09:21:20 PM


Kadtong plastic surgeon? Hmm, maayo diay na siya? Abi nakog way nada...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 10, 2011, 11:59:51 PM

i was only 1 years old when he was overthrown by People's Power, i have no memory of him, but only through political papers that i read some time ago. i must say tho, he was one daring SOB for canceling habeus corpus. This SOB had guts.

this reminds me of a comment US Sec. of State George Schultz one said about Marcos, "The Philippines is a nation of 40 million cowards and one son of a bitch."

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 11, 2011, 12:06:36 AM

You performed greatly as well, Isles. The discourse between Way Nada and yourself was filled with in depth research. Way Nada's responses were sterile and almost unblemished with emotionality. I suspect he is some sort of educator or an intelligent banker. lol. Your responses were heated, filled with gut and grim, emotionally driven. As always, you are driven and wily like the pacific waves crashing into the isles. Your performance was passionately given. I commend you both.

:)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 11, 2011, 09:45:46 AM

thanks for the commendation; i need it like a need a hole in the head.
 
oh, by the way, in case you have forgotten, the most intelligent bankers as bankers can be are those wall street bankers who brought the u.s. economy down.

meantime, the discussion is on whether or not marcos deserves a hero’s burial and you end up rating us?  really, lorenz, since when did you learn that you can be an arbitrator and an analyst of people's thoughts to boot ?  even your use of words leaves much room to be desired.  “Gut and grim, emotionally driven”?  whoa.  ???  ‘driven and wily”?  heaven help me.  careful with the word “sterile”; it could also mean “barren, unfruitful, unproductive”. 

one thing is clear; you express appreciation for opinions that dovetail with your own as surely as you continue to piss people off with your airs and sanctimony.  i believe we’re quite familiar with the terms narcissism and messiah complex.  you even have the gall to delete posts that run counter to your self-regard.     

but could you do tblanders a favor by letting discussions be sans ratings of the discussants and their stands?  these remind me of an orangutan with delusions.

DON’T YOU DELETE THIS as you did some of my posts in the past, when they ran counter to your sense of great self!  this is a forum unfortunate enough to have you as one of the administrators, but I can live with that for as long as you don’t make this a forum for your conceit.     

those pacific waves crashing into the isles may come back to you as a tsunami.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 11, 2011, 09:55:04 AM



Hilas bitaw paminawon ning naay mo-assess kunohay sa quality of discussion diri sa TB, unya unsa ra ra ba jud tawoy qualification... :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 11, 2011, 03:45:35 PM

You are out of topic. Hehehe...

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 11, 2011, 03:48:39 PM

as his "praise" for you is within the topic?  hehe.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 11, 2011, 03:58:55 PM

we don’t need another hero…


Transparency International ranking (of kleptocrats)

In early 2004, the anti-corruption Germany-based NGO Transparency International released a list of what it believes to be the ten most self-enriching leaders in recent years.

In order of amount allegedly stolen (in USD), they are:

1.   Former Indonesian President Suharto ($15 billion – $35 billion)
2.   Former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos ($5 billion – $10 billion) 
3.   Former Zairian President Mobutu Sese Seko ($5 billion)
4.   Former Nigerian President Sani Abacha ($2 billion – $5 billion)
5.   Former PLO Chairman Yasser Arafat ($1 billion to $10 billion) (These numbers do not come from Transparency International)
6.   Former Yugoslav and Serbian President Slobodan MiloÅ¡ević ($1 billion)
7.   Former Haitian President Jean-Claude Duvalier ($300 million – $800 million)
8.   Former Peruvian President Alberto Fujimori ($600 million)
9.   Former Ukrainian Prime Minister Pavlo Lazarenko ($114 million – $200 million)
10.   Former Nicaraguan President Arnoldo Alemán ($100 million)
11.   Former Philippine President Joseph Estrada ($78 million – $80 million)


(wikipedia)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 11, 2011, 04:39:38 PM

Lorenzo,

The suspension of the writ of habeas corpus was a situation created by the communists. The bombing of the Liberal Party  rally at Plaza Miranda was done by the communists/NPA of which Ninoy Aquino's name was riped in the grapevine as one of the suspected plotters. In 1972 another incident happened in the landing of arms from China intended for the communist rebels in the Philippines. This was another evidence of an open rebellion by the communists in our country that gave his government the move to declare Martial Law. The declaration of Martial Law was one brilliant move by Marcos.

The phrase; "The Philippines is composed of 40 million cowards and one son of a bitch" is purportedly spoken by an American official. It started at "Taza de Oro" and saw print in the papers after Marcos loosened the grip on freedom of the press.

The phrase was never spoken!

It just the same during the French revolution as claimed that when Marie Antoinette was told that; "the peasants have no more bread"... she answered; "let them eat cake." This is not true and was never uttered by Marie Antoinette.

WN





Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 11, 2011, 05:40:14 PM
Way Nada,

Quite an interesting parallel you make between the French Revolution and the Toppling of Marcos. :)

Excellent performance, sir. As always, its always interesting to hear the point of view of the other side.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 11, 2011, 05:46:59 PM
Way Nada,

Considering the state of the nation at the time: Communist NPA activities in the north and Muslim Terrorism in the south, the national directive of suspending of habeus corpus can be seen as a necessity at the time. Considering the fact that the country recently just crushed the HUK Rebellion in the late 50s to the 60s, the memory of communist revolution and fear thereof somewhat was accepting to the notion of suspension of habeus corpus so long as the communist threat was minimized/ mitigated.

It is easy for us to argue and debate now. Hindsight is always perfect.


Lorenz.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 11, 2011, 10:32:11 PM

You need to learn more about Philippine history, little boy, to make any sense at all.

P.S. Please improve on your spelling, syntax and grammar--not to mention logic, which you seem to be completely devoid of. Reading you makes one think you speak from your ass--where apparently your brain is, if such a body part exists.

P.P.S. Can't you just concentrate on your boring medical studies, for God's sake?  :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 07:20:22 AM

Ahirms naka ubo ko duh :-)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 12, 2011, 07:21:43 AM

I just dipped in today and the coffee tastes "aherms" already  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 12, 2011, 07:28:26 AM

Way Nada,

Let's dive into a hypothetical situation. Let's say that Marcos didn't impose Martial Law. Do you think that the Philippine Government could have suppressed the MNLF as well as the Communist NPA rebellion ? Tho I can see why he imposed it, I cannot help but ponder on the possibilities had he deviated from the imposition of Martial Law. Do you think he went overboard by imposing it?

It is rather interesting because during that time, Thailand was experiencing the same political instability and experiencing the same Communist insurgency as the Philippines. I liken Marcos' imposition of Martial Law as an extreme action as that of Thai Prime Minister Thanom Kittikachorn, who imposed a government coup in 1971 and suspended the Thai Parliament. In the process he elected himself as Chairman of the National Executive Council on basis of national security. He served another 4th term as Prime Minister until protesters denounced him; when Thai King Bhumibol Adulyadej intervened, Thanom was forced to resign, which ultimately led to the democratisation of Thailand.

One could even claim that Marcos' actions were similar to that of Thanom's. Thanom's loss of power forshadowed Marcos' ultimate loss of political mandate.

Salamat!

Lorenzo
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 12, 2011, 07:58:32 AM
Way Nada,

I think that the imposition of Martial Law was an effect of the alarming panic the nation had and fear of Communist Insurgency. As per the concept of the Domino Theory (coined by US Pres. Dwight Eisenhower). One has to take into consideration that during the time, The American Forces were already beginning to abandon South Vietnam in 1972/1973 until the abandonment of Saigon in 1975 when South Vietnam collapsed to Communist North Vietnam. With Communism then rapidly spreading to Laos and infiltrating into Cambodia as well as Thailand, ...

The political and cultural climate of South East Asia clearly depicted panic and thus, some actions that are now being deemed 'excessive/ unecessary' was not seen as such back then, instead was seen as necessary to prevent the Vietnamese situation from repeating in the Philippines.

Again. It is easy for us now to debate and talk about this. Hindsight is always perfect.  :)



Lorenz.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 08:08:57 AM
1 years old [/color]when he was overthrown by People's Power, i have no memory of him, but only through political papers that i read some time ago. i must say tho, he was one daring SOB for canceling habeus corpus. This SOB had guts.

this reminds me of a comment US Sec. of State George Schultz one said about Marcos, "The Philippines is a nation of 40 million cowards and one son of a bitch."



Wayuk lagi ka mo debate bisan gakamang pa kaw adto panahona aw eh nagkabat kabat na diay sa libro nou? ^_^
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 12, 2011, 08:40:05 AM

haha. ning kamang kamang ko sa sawog sa unang panahon. ning duwa duwa pa ko sa lego blocks sigoro. bwahahaha.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 08:47:16 AM

Wla diay ka manguhag agoyangyang and magpaaway ug gamba? ^_^
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 12, 2011, 08:51:43 AM

tekret! ~
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 08:55:52 AM
secret sa toko? :-)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 12, 2011, 09:53:08 AM
Sakit na akong tiil ug nilingkod ug binasa sa kaguliyang sa inyong mga salabutan mahitungod ni Ka Ferdi (dili si BQN ha). So far so good, I'm on page 30 na (sukad pagsugod sa kabanata). For the meantime let me put in my .5 cent sa lang...


Oh I bow down in worship (panata only) to the godliness of this wrath  ;D

To WN:
You really make me think and put sense (really!) to a lot of misunderstanding I have about the most hated man I've ever known that catapulted me to reckless abandon as a young 20 year old painting a whole town red in Laguna with KMs, sitting-ins with beautiful "kolehiyalas" of St. Scholastica listening to political maneuvers of the 80s, living with farmers who double-job as NPAs in Samal, Bataan, learning the trick and trade of herbal medicine and acapuncture with leftist guerillas in the Cavite Resettlement Areas, organizing a whole sector of church-people throughout the Southern Tagalog region as a seminarian and later on the whole of Central Luzon and part of the North as a young priest. Wew! Did I do all that? And in the midst of all that, I was given "full protection" by the now-defunct Philippine Constabulary of Imus, Cavite by order of its superior who is a paisano from Corella, Bohol (Col. Zosimo Angan... kaila pa siguro si Sir FD ani) who happened to be my dad's classmate at Bohol High in the 50's. All he said to me then was, "Doy, unya na pag sukol-sukol sa gobierno kung mahuman nakag eskwela... kay mao ra ba nay rason nganong nia ka dire sa Tagaytay, dili ang pag rebelde." Believe me when I say, at that age, I did almost everything without thinking and/or reflecting the consequence of what I was doing... I was a "tira-pasagad" kind of guy who thought was full-of-conviction, but one who still found time to sing in some folk-houses of Manila kung makalugsong intawon sa syudad.  ;D

And this is my story kabahin sa Martial Law.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 12, 2011, 11:52:19 AM

The phrase; "The Philippines is composed of 40 million cowards and one son of a bitch"... was never spoken by an American official. It started as a political intrigue at "Taza de Oro" and printed in the anti Marcos newspapers to manipulate public opinion.

This is what happened in the Philippine media today; "when they say it's the voice of the people"... always expect that it is only the opinion of the writer using the "people" to commit a lie.

The phrase; "let them eat cake"... allegedly spoken by Marie Antoinette is also bogus. It is printed in the Parisienne Gazette during the French revolution to manipulate public opinion. Marie Antoinette was executed by the mob not because of a political crime but she was accused of incest; a common crime.

There are some kind of parallels between the French revolution and the mob that toppled Marcos. The French revolution stormed the Bastille only to find out that there were only eight prisoners convicted of common crimes. They did not find any political prisoner in the Bastille. Malacanang also was stormed by the mob to look for the fabled $20 billion dollars but there was none.

WN

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 12, 2011, 12:55:10 PM

Are you Fr. Lungay who composed songs for the SPOT? If so... you are the nephew of my late Tia Sophia of Balilihan. How are you related to Arn Lungay?

WN
 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 04:44:10 PM

Is Marcos really dead? Where’s the death certificate?

By Benjamin Pimentel
INQUIRER.net
Posted date: April 29, 2011
 

In his mind, he was the dashing guerrilla leader, the fearless soldier who engaged the Japanese in fierce encounters during World War 2.

Ferdinand Marcos certainly had a wild imagination. Which actually makes me think: If he had the gall to fake his heroism, could he have also faked (cue ominous music) his own death?

Think about it: Is Marcos really dead? Where’s the proof? Sure, they have him on display in a freezer up north—but is that really him? Has anyone seen the death certificate? The real one?

Remember, the dictator died in (cue ominous music again) Hawaii.

Yep, that Hawaii. The Hawaii of American conspiracy theorists who this week succeeded in making the president of the United States release the original version of his birth certificate to prove he was born there and therefore legally qualified to be the chief.

Shouldn’t a despised ex-Philippine president also be compelled to show proof of his own death in that same conspiracy-theory-challenged state? If America can have a Birthers movement, heck, Pinoys should launch a Deathers Crusade.

After all, what can be scarier than a dead dictator who turned out to be still alive! And this one has unrepentant allies pushing to have him be given a hero’s funeral.

In fact, that’s an important point: Amid all this talk of burying Marcos at the Libingan ng mga Bayani, shouldn’t we, first of all, verify that he is dead?

Well, all right, I’m kidding.

But this business of honoring the late dictator as a hero has turned into such an ugly joke, why not have some fun with it.

Maybe P-Noy and Binay would see the silliness of the proposal and realize it is they who will be remembered as political jokes if they let the Marcoses pull yet another cruel trick on the Filipino nation.

Are they really serious about making a decision based on text messages from the public? What is this, American Idol?

Well, if that's the case, at least, let the late tyrant perform first before the vote. American Idol is paying tribute to Carole King this week, so why not have the dictator appear on stage with Imelda, and have her sing “You Make Me Feel Like a Natural Woman” while retouching Ferdie’s makeup?

That would even underscore one of Marcos’s biggest contributions to the country: He made us laugh.

Admit it, Marcos and Imelda made us laugh. If it weren’t for all the people who died and suffered during the regime, we actually could look back at that time as funny years.

Who would deny that the Dovie Beams affair was one of the most jaw-dropping and hilarious political sex scandals in world history?

How can you top Imelda and her theory of a hole in the sky above the Philippines through which cosmic rays pass to protect the country from disaster?

Marcos and Imelda jokes kept us entertained even as we endured tyranny. And we didn’t even have cell phones back then for speedy mass distribution.

I remember one during one of the rallies after Ninoy’s assassination when Marcos’s face often looked swollen. The protest poster read: “Mamaga sana ang mukha ng nagpapatay kay Ninoy. (I hope whoever had Ninoy killed gets a swollen face).” Well, it’s funnier in Tagalog.

And we should thank Marcos for helping jumpstart the career of undoubtedly one of the nation’s greatest comic talents—and the king of Marcos impersonators—Willie Nepomuceno.

He was so good as the Fake Marcos that during the critical hours of the 1986 People Power Revolt, when the dictator appeared on TV to prove he was still in charge, there were those who believed it was a ploy—that it was Willie Nepomuceno who was trying to rally people to the Marcos camp.

Of course, Nepomuceno the Fake Marcos faced a crisis when the Real Marcos—or should that be the Real Fake Hero Marcos?—was kicked out of the country, and later died.

But Nepomuceno bounced back. His career did not die with the dictator. He star shined even brighter as he impersonated other politicos, including former Presidents Fidel Ramos (complete with fake ears) and Joseph Estrada (with the fake sideburns).

Willie Nepomuceno lived on, fulfilling the vow of the dictator who inspired his career, and who also proved to have a quirky sense of humor by once famously declaring: “I do not intend to die.”


Copyright 2011 by Benjamin Pimentel. On Twitter @KuwentoPimentel.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 04:50:00 PM

The true empowerment of democracy was exhibited in EDSA by its successful efforts to oust a tyrant by a demonstration without tolerance for violence and bloodshed. Prayers and rosaries strengthened by faith were the only weapons that the Filipinos used to recover their freedom from President Ferdinand Marcos’s iron hands. The Epifanio de los Santos Avenue (EDSA) stretches 54 kilometers, where the peaceful demonstration was held on that fateful day. It was a day that gathered all Filipinos in unity with courage and faith to prevail democracy in the country. It was the power of the people, who assembled in EDSA, that restored the democratic Philippines, ending the oppressive Marcos regime. Hence, it came to be known as the EDSA People Power’s Revolution.

The revolution was a result of the long oppressed freedom and the life threatening abuses executed by the Marcos government to cite several events like human rights violation since the tyrannical Martial Law Proclamation in 1972. In the years that followed Martial Law started the suppressive and abusive years–incidents of assassination were rampant, particularly those who opposed the government, individuals and companies alike were subdued. The Filipinos reached the height of their patience when former Senator Benigno "Ninoy" Aquino, Sr. was shot and killed at the airport in August 21, 1983, upon his return to the Philippines from exile in the United States. Aquino’s death marked the day that Filipinos learned to fight. His grieving wife, Corazon Cojuangco-Aquino showed the Filipinos and the world the strength and courage to claim back the democracy that Ferdinand Marcos arrested for his personal caprice. Considering the depressing economy of the country, Ninoy’s death further intensified the contained resentment of the Filipinos. In the efforts to win back his popularity among the people, Marcos held a snap presidential election in February 7, 1986, where he was confronted with a strong and potent opposition, Corazon Aquino. It was the most corrupt and deceitful election held in the Philippine history. There was an evident trace of electoral fraud as the tally of votes were declared with discrepancy between the official count by the COMELEC (Commission on Elections) and the count of NAMFREL (National Movement for Free Elections). Such blatant corruption in that election was the final straw of tolerance by the Filipinos of the Marcos regime.

More at:
http://www.philippine-history.org/edsa-people-power-revolution.htm (http://www.philippine-history.org/edsa-people-power-revolution.htm)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 05:00:53 PM

Ferdinand Marcos
Philippine President and Thief

by Rit Nosotro First Published:: 2003
(Last updated: 09/03/2010 09:06:14)
http://www.hyperhistory.net/apwh/bios/b3marcos-ferdinand.htm (http://www.hyperhistory.net/apwh/bios/b3marcos-ferdinand.htm)


Millions stashed in a frozen Swiss bank account. Dozens of crates of prized possessions shipped across oceans. A man dying in exile in Hawaii. These statements might bring to mind thoughts of James Bond or the latest action film, but in reality they pertain to the life of a real man: Ferdinand Marcos.

Born in 1917 to a Mariano Marcos, a politician, and Josefa Edralin, a teacher, Marcos entered the world in the south Asian islands of the Philippines. At the time, the islands had been controlled by the American government for only two decades since the Spanish-American War, and the political structure was still being established. Following after his father, Marcos enrolled at the University of the Philippines to study law after completing his foundational schooling, but his final year at the university was interrupted. The court called him to be tried for a murder which he had committed three years earlier. The victim was the political rival of his father, who had championed his father in a political race. A strong case stated that Marcos had shot the man the day after the race as the man celebrated in his home. Marcos was found guilty, yet he appealed the case to a higher court, the Philippine Supreme Court. He decided to put his knowledge of the law to a test by representing himself in court, and while being held for six months wrote his own 830 page appeal. After arguing his defense, the case was overturned, freeing him to return to court the next day in order to be certified as he had passed the bar exam. He became a trial lawyer in Manila, until beginning his service as an officer in the Philippine armed forces during World War II.

Marcos emerged from the war claiming to have led a guerrilla unit against the Japanese and to have been highly decorated by the American forces for his service, all of which proved to be falsehoods. In fact, he had spent much of the time during the war suffering in hospitals and causing disturbance which almost led to his execution at the conclusion of the war. The close of the war also acted as the end of America’s rule over the Philippines, establishing the country as independent. At this point Marcos redirected his career to politics, becoming the assistant to the first president of the new republic, Manuel Roxas. Several years later, in 1949, Marcos won a seat in the House of Representatives, becoming the youngest member. He quickly began establishing himself as a member of the Philippine elite, using his personal influence for great and practically instantaneous self gain. Marcos succeed in retaining his seat for two reelections, and withheld from entering the 1961 presidential candidacy under the understanding that the following election he would be given the spot. Backstabbed, Marcos was denied his guaranteed presidential nomination and instantaneously switched parties in the following election, surprisingly wining by a landslide. Promising improved living conditions and land reform under his leadership, Marcos’ true personal priority of self gain eventually became evident. As President, he fostered good relations with America, by encouraging the development of American military bases on the islands. These seemingly selfless acts actually allowed for billions of dollars to make their way into the Philippine economy, and for his wife, Imelda, to head up prestige projects which constructed elegant hotels and museums. The economy blossomed, and Marcos was reelected in 1969. His second term proved to be less smooth than his first, as the communist party began causing upset and citizens began to disapprove of American presence in the county and Marcos’ support of American’s stance towards Vietnam. According to law, Marcos reign was limited to two terms, yet at the end of his second term he declared marshal law to continue his rule, claiming that Communist rebel groups were causing upset on the islands. This act dissolved Congress and the constitution, establishing Marcos as the sole ultimate power.

Marcos became a dictator, preventing free speech and quelling any political opposition instantaneously. During the following years, Marcos and his wife amassed huge amounts of money, sucking them from the Philippine economy through controlled industry monopolies and banking. Marcos orders for military forces to be increased, tripling it in size between 1971 and 1983. Oppression increased as living standards collapsed and unrest among the people grew. In 1981, Marcos attempts to regain his people’s support by ending marshal law and conducting a rigged election in which he won by a landslide, but this only results in increased dissension. Attempting to gain favor again in 1986, Marcos holds another election, but this time the fraud sparks rebellion. The Marcoses are forced to run in exile to Hawaii, bringing with them countless precious personal belongings, jewels and gold, all stolen from his people. The Philippine government recovered millions from Marcos’ Swiss bank accounts, but only after significant investigation and aid from the Swiss government. Marcos remained in exile in Hawaii, despite rumors of planned attempts to regain control of the Philippines through invasion. In 1987 he was indicted by a American federal jury for fraud and obstruction of justice, but he died in Honolulu the following year before his trial was held.

Although Ferdinand Marcos’ life may seem like an exotic tale of adventure, his actions warranted hideous results. The country he claimed to rule was left in economic shambles, full of people who were denied their freedoms and adequate living standards. His life is a tale of destruction and selfish desires which wounded the history of a nation.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 05:18:46 PM

The Philippines 1972-1986


1972 - Using the excuse of an alleged assassination attempt against Defence Minister Juan Ponce Enrile, Marcos declares martial law on 21 September, promising to eliminate poverty and injustice and create a "new society." It is later revealed that the assassination attempt had been staged by the military.

Opposition figures (including Benigno 'Ninoy' Aquino), journalists, student and labour activists and criminals are arrested and detained at military compounds run by the army and the police. Newspapers are closed and the mass media tightly controlled. Demonstrations, strikes and boycotts are outlawed. Marcos assumes absolute legislative power. The constitution, which permits presidents only two terms in office, is suspended.

1973 - A new constitution allowing Marcos to stay in office indefinitely and to rule by decree is introduced. The result is confirmed by a fraudulent referendum enabling him to continue as president until the end of martial law and to arbitrarily appoint all government officials, including members of the judiciary. Imelda Marcos is made governor of Manila and minister of human settlements and ecology.

Martial law initially brings stability and an economic turnaround but with the costs of reduced social freedoms and increasing corruption. Limited land reforms are introduced but prove ineffective. Manufacturing and business enterprises are nationalised or handed to Marcos's cronies or relatives. Profits are siphoned off for personal enrichment and mismanagement is rife.

The armed forces are politicised. Officers from Marcos's home province are promoted to high rank. A childhood friend of Marcos becomes chief-of-staff of the armed forces and head of the internal security network. Officers are appointed to manage several corporations and the military is ordered to take control of all public utilities and the media. The size of the army is also increased, with numbers swelling from about 58,000 in 1971 to 142,000 in 1983.

The military has virtually unlimited powers to search, arrest and detain civilians without reason and without recourse to legal representation. Military tribunals are set up throughout the country to try and sentence detainees. The civilian courts are striped of their power and autonomy, and the Philippine police force is placed under military control. It is estimated that more than 60,000 people are arrested between 1972 and 1977.

Politically prisoners are routinely tortured by the military. "Disappearances" and murders of suspected political activists are common, with over 500 cases being recorded for the period 1975-80. Meanwhile, inflation and unemployment rise while already low living standards drop.

The brutality of the regime and the stagnating economy causes may Filipinos to turn to the communists for protection and support.

1976 - The constitution is amended further to allow Marcos to continue to rule by degree even after the lifting of martial law.

1977 - Benigno Aquino, leader of the Philippines democratic opposition, is tried by a military court, found guilty of subversion and sentenced to death. The sentence, however, is never applied.

1980 - Aquino, who is ill, is released in May to receive medical treatment in the US. He will remain in the US, becoming a leader of the opposition in exile.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 05:20:37 PM

1981 - Marcos proclaims the end of martial law on 17 January. He wins an overwhelming majority in a presidential election held in June, but the vote is rigged and is boycotted by the main opposition groups.

1983 - After three years in exile, Aquino decides to return to the Philippines and help end the Marcos regime. However, minutes after his arrival at Manilla airport on 21 August he is shot in the head and killed. The lone assassin is shot on the spot.

Marcos claims the assassin is a communist, but a subsequent government commission of inquiry finds that the military had conspired in Aquino's death. However, the finding is rejected and those accused of the conspiracy are allowed to go free.

Aquino's funeral procession draws hundreds of thousands of mourners. It is the largest demonstration in the history of the Philippines and marks the beginning of the 'People's Power' movement led by Aquino's widow, Corazon Cojuangco Aquino.

Meanwhile, the domestic economy grinds to a halt and then begins to contract. But while the salaries of Filipinos are, in real terms, half as much as they were in 1956, the share of the national income held by the wealthiest 10th of the country has increased from 27% to 37%.

As living standards decline further the business community begins to speak out against the Marcos regime. The NPA gains further ground in rural areas. In the cities and towns Communist Party influence continues to spread.

1985 - In November Marcos announces that an election for president will be held on 7 February of the following year. Corazon Aquino announces that she will stand as a candidate.

1986 - The election is held on schedule but the results are contested, with the opposition and Roman Catholic Church claiming widespread fraud and intimidation. Marcos is proclaimed the official winner on 15 February, sparking a rebellion by Defence Minister Enrile, armed forces vice chief-of-staff Fidel Ramos, and the commander of the Philippine police, who also believe that the vote has been rigged.

Calling on Marcos to resign, the rebels receive the backing of the church and the support of the people. The armed forces either join the rebellion or, faced-off by massive crowds gathered around the rebel's camp, decline to intervene.

On 25 February the Marcoses run, abandoning the presidential palace and flying to Hawaii in the US. Their 20-year regime is at its end. As the Marcoses flee, Corazon Aquino is sworn in as president, riding in on the massive wave of 'People's Power'.

When Marcos arrives in Hawaii he is said to be carrying suitcases containing jewels, 24 gold bricks and certificates for billions of dollars of gold bullion. His Swiss bank accounts are estimated to contain between US$3 billion and US$35 billion stolen from his country. The Philippine's foreign debt is about US$28 billion.

The new government acts quickly to recover deposits in the Marcoses' Swiss accounts. A formal request for assistance is sent to the Swiss Federal Police on 7 April. However, it takes 18 years for the US$624 million that is discovered to be returned to the Philippines Treasury.

To this day, the existence and whereabouts of the rest of the Marcos billions remains unconfirmed despite detailed investigations by the US Senate.


More at:
http://www.moreorless.au.com/killers/marcos.html (http://www.moreorless.au.com/killers/marcos.html)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 05:38:12 PM
Nanumbalik , na refresh ang akong history subject..cgi raman panglamaw ug tambay sa grandstand haha
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 06:05:51 PM

He he, maayo ning naay refresher course kay naa nay nangabarod...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 06:10:33 PM

As in..flying saucer na ang rambol dani ba..? way to go...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 06:15:13 PM
I was a "tira-pasagad" kind of guy [/color]who thought was full-of-conviction, but one who still found time to sing in some folk-houses of Manila kung makalugsong intawon sa syudad.  ;D

And this is my story kabahin sa Martial Law.

Makarelate ko ana..gamay ra pod hinoon kay bata pa c Sabel adto nga time..t'was then..


d'rest? i sealed my lips uhm..
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 07:37:13 PM

The Martial Law Years: Looking Back
By Definitely Filipino Community | September 12, 2010


Any history student worth his salt can quote George Santayana in his first day in class: “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.” What then is the value of remembering the darkest era we have faced as a nation – the Martial Law era?

My parents – who were married on September 21, 1972, of all dates – often joked that everything was fine before and during their wedding, but as they went out of the church as newlyweds, everything went haywire. Of course, Martial Law wasn’t to be implemented until the next day, September 22, exactly 28 years after President Jose P. Laurel placed the country in a similar situation because of the Japanese occupation of the country. President Ferdinand Marcos declared a state of Martial Law as a response to mounting civilian unrest and to the Communist threat posed by the New People’s Army (NPA), especially the Plaza Miranda bombing and the assassination attempt on Defense Secretary Juan Ponce Enrile. Many believe that the Communist Party of the Philippines, headed by Jose Maria Sison, is the culprit behind the Plaza Miranda bombing, an accusation that Sison denies to this day. As a result of the bombing, and in a move of pure cunning, President Marcos suspended the writ of habeas corpus – an act that served as an overture to Martial Law itself.

Martial Law was initially welcomed by some sectors of society, but the honeymoon was soon over as human rights violations – most often involving torture, rape, and murder (and sometimes all of the above) – as well as press censorship, became the order of the day for the military. My college professor, who asked that his name be withheld, was one of the thousands of activists who were abducted by the police and tortured for information. He recounts the torture techniques that were used against the victims. “Rape was commonplace. We were stripped and made to sit on blocks of ice. The women were blindfolded and the torturers threatened to cut off their nipples if they didn’t give them information; the torturers inserted strands of walis tingting up their urethra if the victims didn’t cooperate.”

The number of human rights violations and murders escalated and tension was mounting everywhere; Martial Law didn’t solve the country’s problem with unrest, but actually aggravated it.


More at:
http://definitelyfilipino.com/blog/2010/09/12/the-martial-law-years-looking-backk/ (http://definitelyfilipino.com/blog/2010/09/12/the-martial-law-years-looking-backk/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 07:44:35 PM
Hala mora mora man niy sa akong blog..? Whops paghilum Kerst..aw dili diay..mora ra gali..?


Aktib man ko sa una..,





duwa ba ug leron leron sinta...(wa pa gani ko katiwas) hehehe
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 08:05:46 PM

Abtik nga aktib sa tingbitay sa baki? Oops...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 08:11:06 PM
Hilom ta kay mabolyaso unja..toinks..


Better rely to the  Suhits yahaha huh
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 08:29:26 PM

Suhits nga wanyir pa? ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 12, 2011, 08:36:40 PM

Nag-om-um nag Kyoto pagkatawo asa ka ana? Ala pa na mauzo pagkahimogso nmo/nato?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 12, 2011, 09:06:17 PM


Aw, nag-om-om man kaha gud pud og silver spoon nga kinuykoyan sa hacienda... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 12:41:18 AM

Pwede na close-open kay it has been 30 years naman pod... pwede na cguro pod mosingit, "estoryaheeee!"  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 12:43:26 AM

Apil diay ka atong mag kamang-kamang sa ilawom sa grandstand? Mohigda pod panagsa kung sapoton? Mora ni BQN? Kasuway ko pero kas-a ra bahahaha  ;D
 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 12:51:40 AM

I read somewhere that you're a Matig-a... and yes, I know Tiya Pia (one of my favorite lolas as a kid). Mohapit jud mi sa ilaha kung makalugsong sa syudad gikan sa lungsod and I used to enjoy the street where they lived kay ambugon kaayo (now Matig-a Street). Are we related WN? Basin pod diay like BNC (another Alay-Ano)  ;D

P.S. Lolo Ayong was a staunch Marcos-supporter as well as the rest of the family. I acted as the devil's advocate who truly was the devil's advocate (then and now I guess), bwahahaha  ;D
 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 12:58:13 AM


Nakahuman ra jod kog basa sa tanan dani... dili nako ma INC ani. Refreshed na ako "curse" ni Ka Ferdi. Lingaw jud nuon kog binasa sa binatbatay nila WN ug Ms Isle. Angay ni sila tagbuon sa sunod halalan  8)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 13, 2011, 01:20:49 AM

 Unja si Dong Bran'z ang ilang HOST! 8)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 01:41:31 AM

Kinis Dong Bran ug si Nong Hubs maoy angay tgaboon sa halalan sa Balingsya, bwahahaha   :P

Si Bay Bugs poy HOST ani  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 13, 2011, 02:50:24 AM
Makahilo..estoryahee..! erid lang..
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 03:15:23 AM

Hehehe there are pockets in my family too, in my father's side (taga Tagbilaran) , that are strong Marcos supporters. So, Fr. Roel, is it safe for me to assume that your father, Engr. Lungay, was also a Marcos supporter?

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 03:22:21 AM
My father used to tell me of the projects that Marcos implemented in Bohol. For the first time kono, Bohol had electricity , prior to Marcos it was not so, after Marcos it was. The infrastructural projects during Marcos' time spearheaded the development of Bohol Province. A good friend of our family-- the former Gov. Chatto and Torralba used to talk to my paternal grandfather about the situations in Bohol. At the time these said men were supporters of Marcos.

There were some positives he gave to the province as well as negatives.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 13, 2011, 05:24:58 AM
Para nako isip Kristyano tagasunod sa binuhatan ni Kristo, kalimtan na ang nangagi aron mawala na ang pagdumot "ilubong na si Pres Marcos sa Libingan ng mga Bayani"

sa panahon ni Marcos maong walay asinso kaayo dili man gud sip-sip si sir David T. , dili man gud gusto ni matandang Victoriano nga madungisan ang ilang Apelyido.

Dili ko makalimot sa mensahi ni matandang Victoriano, nga matud nya kong gusto nyong malinawon nga pagpuyo ug dili pordoy likaye ang Politika.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 13, 2011, 09:03:02 AM

does it mean that bohol had no electricity prior to 1965, when marcos first ran for president?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:06:18 AM

Tagbilaran and places like Cortes and Loboc were already electricuted aw electrolux aw electrified diay prior to martial Law  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:09:02 AM

Si Kristo bitaw Bay Vist Ginoo man to pero wala man ilubong sa LNMB; ila man gani gisilutan ug palakaw padung gawas sa gate sa ila syudad ngadto nas Kalbaryo (to the brow of a hill matud pa)... wa gani toy sala hehehehe  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 13, 2011, 09:13:08 AM

morag wa koy kontra kun molansar kog presidente sa dajong ani da... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 13, 2011, 09:15:06 AM

mabunalan gyod ning duha ug bugsay, hahaha!  pansakan pa gyod ug laming ginamos ang mga baba, payts na. ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:18:45 AM

Bisan pa piyungan sine goryo   ;)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:20:17 AM

Samot na kung sili-an aron mag lukso2x og ma bibo  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 09:25:00 AM


Di lang tingali nato angin-anginon si Kristo aning isyuha... :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:25:19 AM

Sige ko maka pesos sa akong lola who always reminded her 54 grandchildren nga pro-Marcos jud kuno siya and that we, too, should follow suit. Only a few of my tiyo listened to what I had to say. Mga taga simbahan kuno puros mga rebelde, they used to say.  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 09:30:51 AM


Kansi ko ani kay di man ko tumitindok sa maong dapit. Gawas pa, malagmit mopabor si Bay Bugs sa iyang kababs... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 09:32:17 AM


Patay ko kon maohon, seguradong daghanon ang ihungit nako... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 13, 2011, 09:36:03 AM


my understanding then, as now, is that it is because often as not when it comes to social inequities, church people are more exposed and more aware and understandably more empathetic.  

apilon lang gihapon nako si kristo, puslan man nga gihisgotan ni 00segbin (sorry, hubs).  in his time, according to some, he was the number one rebel, albeit a peaceful one.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 13, 2011, 09:39:19 AM

ay lab my own diay na si bugsay?  sagdi, anang panahona na gyod siya maantimano sa akong flying luwag nga inubanan ni flying segbin, hihihi.  aning kalibotana, di ta angay magsalig sa atong naandang weapon of mass destruction.  dako tuod ang bugsay kay sa luwag, pero nagtangag man akong luwag ug segbin, hikhikhik. ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 09:42:16 AM


Hmm, di ba kaha double agent ning gasulti, mestisa Balingsyanhon ra ba...  ::)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:51:53 AM

Ang usa pod nila ka kababs kay kahoy-tokog ray dala nga gihiktan ug bato sa tomoy


(http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/StoneAgeWeaponry002.jpg)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 09:55:15 AM
(http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/StoneAgeWeaponry.jpg)

Balingsyano a.k.a. Ciano Baleleng nag-andam nas iyang WMD
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bugsay on May 13, 2011, 10:22:38 AM

aw...kon kinsa'y mobarag mauy tiwasan.... :P ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 10:51:07 AM


Oi, kansi ko kay duha ray akong tiil... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 10:52:32 AM

http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/StoneAgeWeaponry.jpg[/img]

Balingsyano a.k.a. Ciano Baleleng nag-andam nas iyang WMD

He he, magliwatliwat jud lagi ning abilidad... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 10:54:15 AM

http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/StoneAgeWeaponry002.jpg[/img]

He he, bisag wa pay armas surrender na ko sa kadako sa lawas... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 10:55:34 AM


Pwede di ang pagbarag maoy basehan--ang pagtabisay sa laway lang... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 13, 2011, 11:10:57 AM

Wa tay relasyon pero dool ko sa mga Lungay tungod ni Tia Sophia. Panahon sa pista sa Balilihan mamista ko sa una uban nila ni Monet ug Iko. Katapusang anha nako sa Balilihan gida ko ni Emay ug Conchita [puro na intawon hinglalin] didto ila ka Nimia.

Sakto ka, ambugon tong ilaha ug Matig-a St. na karon na. Manghud ka kaayo nako. Talirungan nako si Grace. Si Dodong ug si Boy dugay na nako tong wa ikita. Sakto pud ka nga imong lolo Ayong pro Marcos kaayo ug gi zero si Macapagal ni Marcos sa Balilihan niadtong election sa 1965. Si imong lolo Ayong ang gidudahan nga nag maniobra.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 13, 2011, 11:17:30 AM
 didto ila ka Nimia.



WN


 Sir Way Nada, silingan mi ni Monet sa Tagbilaran ug akong teacher ang iyang asawa. How about Erol? su-od ba pod mo? Peace! :)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 13, 2011, 11:25:02 AM

Si Monet patay na pud intawon ni sija. Ang iyang asawa si Bebe tua ni sa amerika karon. Ang bay ni Monet naa sa Cogon ug atbang sa bay ni Gov. Aumentado. Si Errol ako pud nang ig-agaw.

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 11:30:43 AM
 didto ila ka Nimia.

Sakto ka, ambugon tong ilaha ug Matig-a St. na karon na. Manghud ka kaayo nako. Talirungan nako si Grace. Si Dodong ug si Boy dugay na nako tong wa ikita. Sakto pud ka nga imong lolo Ayong pro Marcos kaayo ug gi zero si Macapagal ni Marcos sa Balilihan niadtong election sa 1965. Si imong lolo Ayong ang gidudahan nga nag maniobra.

WN


Produkto jud siguro diay kas 1950's nga mga brayt sama nila Nene Borja, Nick Lungay, Bradd Pitt Lungay ug uban pa sa Bohol High (or Bolhi ba?)... maski sa ilang panahon puros mga himasa ug anad mo-maningles.

Thanks for reminding me of Monet kay nakalimot najod kos kadugay sa panahon ug kining nag edaran na. Siya man tong pulis no? Kadtos Iko nuon di jud ko makalimot; he was my basketball idol in the late 60s and early 70s.  When I went to play senior varsity basketball referee na lang tawon tos IKo kay nag edaran naman.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 13, 2011, 11:56:23 AM

Apil diay nis Calcetas Boyz si Monet ug si Gov, BQN? LoL  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 13, 2011, 12:18:46 PM


Kadto si Monet bombero to sija. Si Iko gibantug sa basketball. Sa tinood lang kadtong style niya moduwa iya ra jud to. Maski sa PBA wa'y pareho niya ug style.

WN

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 13, 2011, 12:46:09 PM

Waa jud ko kahibaw nga mibiya na diay si Monet. (RIP) O, si Ma'am Bebe ang iyang asawa nga among maestra sa Cogon Annex. Ang balay nila ni Nong Gawden nga Papa ni Bebe naa dinha du-ol ila Lamdagan ug nagbalay sila didto du-ol sa amoa ug ila Gov. Si Errol, permi ko kita niya diri kai moangay pod ug POKER sa casino ;) Kadto si Iko, permi ko kita adto moduwa ug basketball adto didto sa capitolyo, didto sa may DPWH. Si Errol du-ol du-ol rami ug gipoy-an diri. Kaila ko niya, pero siya waa kaila nako.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 13, 2011, 12:49:17 PM

Pad'z, si Monet adtong bata pako, naa nato sa Fire dep't nag trabaho. Unya nagbalay sila didto dapit sa amoa ug kang Gov...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 12:57:41 PM

Not the country side. The city lang , pero perting mo brown out kono. My maternal grandfather told me that before Marcos time, Valencia would be 'shut' in the dark because that was before electricity circulated throughout the probinsya. After Marcos implemented a greater electric grid in the province (through his projects), for the first time in Bohol's history, power and electricity was available to most of the towns outside the reaches of Tagbilaran.

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 01:02:47 PM

Of course, kai provincial seat gud ang Tagbilaran. Pero dili proficient daw, ug kalingaw mo brown out. My dad used to tell me how my paternal grandfather (papa titing) used to order the maids and house help to buy extra candles and gas lanterns in case of brown out. lol.

Palamuut kono kai sa una, during a fiesta, nag brown out kono (morag 1973 man toh), ang Provincial Governor at the time, as well as the Provincial Treasurer where in attendance at my family residence (both of whom were the godfathers) of my uncles: Dr. Renee Lucino and Engr. Rogelio Lucino. Ning brown out kono for a bit, pero power was re-established. My papa titing joked with the Provincial Governor, "Pare, unsa gud ni oy!" hahaha. They were very good friends..... :)

When Marcos' projects--one of whom were the power dams and the establishment of a greater power grid for the province,--it was so appreciated by many Bol-anons that he (Marcos) became a household name.

My father tells me that during Marcos' early years, he was a good president. However, corruption increased during his later years.

My father's side of the family were strong Marcos supporters.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Way Nada on May 13, 2011, 01:16:06 PM


Lorenzo,

Your father was right... because Marcos was a dictator he commanded; let there be light! And NEA was formed and there was light all over the Philippines. Hehehe....

Kidding aside... Bohol during the time of Pres. Garcia built the Tontonan Hydro Electric Plant but the power is too low that it was supported by a generator installed in Dampas. The power of Tontonan can not generate power all over Bohol.

Really the truth is; the development of our country culminated at the start of Martial Law. And the main thrust of Marcos was to industrialize our country. To achieve this is to develop sustainable power for industrialization. So NEA was formed. Infrastructure in our country was in a faster pace of development through Marcos rule by decree... whereas before Martial Law enabling laws were marred in endless debate in congress.

When Marcos visited Bohol after he declared Martial Law he asked all the town mayors that were gathered at the Garcia Stadium listening to  his speech. Marcos asked; "what road in Bohol is not passable?" One mayor from the eastern part of the province raised his hands and said that a part of the road going to his town is not passable. Marcos again asked; "who is the district engineer?" The mayor answered; Engr. Modesto Butalid Mr. President. On that very moment Engr. Modesto Butalid was fetched in his house to answer Marcos why that road is not passable.

That was Marcos!

But today when Garci or Lacson is summoned to face the court they cannot be found because they're hiding. Angelo Reyes went to the extreme of taking his own life just to evade to answer questions from congress. Hehehe....

WN
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 01:16:59 PM

What a small world.

It explains why Sir Way Nada is so accurate with historical dates, names, and political processes in tandem. Bright man diay iyahang batch. hehe. Kuyawan lagi ko kai sa una (i think 3 years ago) he engaged in a discussion with me regarding Marcos and his responses were not only very intellectual but accurate in terms of chronological dates (as i would re-check his info through google search).

Way Nada also battled with me before in the discussion regarding Climate Change / Global Warming. His answers were very well worded and well researched.

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 01:28:24 PM

I think my father, Engr. Rico Lucino, would like you and enjoy a conversation with you as you both seem to have very similar opinions on the subject. He is also a staunch Marcos supporter.

The Philippines, as he tells me, is so diverse and so different in its own dynamic that it cannot function without a strong handed government. Marcos' strong iron hand was necessary at that particular time.

During the time when Martial Law was implemented , South Vietnam was being abandoned by the United States as North Vietnam continued to pound and win over the country until South Vietnam collapsed with the fall of Saigon in 1975. As communism spread through Laos, Cambodia and infiltrated to Thailand, Malaysia. The situation was so dire that even in Thailand , too, experienced an iron handed government. Thai Prime Minister Thanom Kittikachorn , himself, suspended the Thai Parliament because of the national inability to control the Communist threat in the north (near Chiang Mai and the border of Laos). Thanom even went so much as to elect himself as the Chairman of the Thai National Security so as to make sure to assess the threat the country experienced. Marcos' imposition of Martial Law in 1973 was (at the time) necessary since the country was itself battling the Communist NPA rebellion as well as the Muslim Separatist War with Nur Misuari's MNLF. The country, as we know it, was indeed in an imminent national crisis.

And considering South Vietnam's ultimate collapse in 1975, can we really blame why Marcos implmented Martial Law? Communism was indeed a real threat. Martial Law was necessary, at the time. In regards to Eisenhower's Domino Theory, if policies were not enacted to prevent the spread of communism, then the Philippines (a major non-Nato ally of the United States and a major member of the Free World in Asia) would fall to Communism as did South Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos.

It is so easy for us to debate otherwise now. Hindsight is always perfect.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 13, 2011, 01:38:05 PM

Hehehe. Tinuod diay ni. This is what my father told me many years back when I asked him what kinds of things did Marcos do for Bohol Island Province.

And I believe the mayor from eastern Bohol was the mayor from Guindulman. ;)

After that, Guindulman's roads were passable.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 03:04:41 PM

http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/StoneAgeWeaponry.jpg[/img]

Balingsyano a.k.a. Ciano Baleleng nag-andam nas iyang WMD

Sophisticated na ang subsequent generations...


(http://mediaenvironment.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/neanderthal.jpg)


 ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 03:09:54 PM

Ferdinand Emmanuel Edralin Marcos (September 11, 1917 – September 28, 1989) was 10th President of the Philippines from 1965 to 1986. He was a lawyer, member of the Philippine House of Representatives (1949–1959) and a member of the Philippine Senate (1959–1965). He was Senate President in 1963. He claimed to have led a guerrilla force called Ang Maharlika in northern Luzon during the Second World War, something much doubted however to be true. As Philippine president and strongman, his greatest achievement was in the fields of infrastructure development and international diplomacy. However, his administration was marred by massive authoritarian corruption, despotism, nepotism, political repression, and human rights violations. He benefited from a large personality cult in the Philippines during his regime. In 1983, his government was implicated in the assassination of his primary political opponent, Benigno Aquino, Jr.. The implication caused a chain of events, including a tainted presidential election that served as the catalyst for the People Power Revolution in February 1986 that led to his removal from power and eventual exile in Hawaii. It was later alleged that he and his wife Imelda Marcos had moved billions of dollars of embezzled public funds to the United States, Switzerland, and other countries, as well as into alleged corporations during his 20 years in power. --
http://ferdinand-marcos.co.tv/ (http://ferdinand-marcos.co.tv/)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 13, 2011, 03:17:21 PM


Hangtod karon daghan gihapon ang nagmatag morning... :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 13, 2011, 09:08:14 PM

Bai HB, ako nagmata nako kai morning naman. BUT, im not one of them :D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 13, 2011, 10:54:24 PM

Agree.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 14, 2011, 06:28:14 AM

He he, bitaw Bay BQN, mahitungod aning puntoha mahimong atong usbon ang pasumbingay ug ingnon nga adunay tulo ka klase sa tawo: naay 1) dugay rang nagmata ug mibangon na, 2) nagligadligad ug nagpiyopngpiyong bisag nagmata na kay gustong tagamtamon pa ang tam-is nga damgo, ug 3) kusog pa kaayo ang hagok.

:)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: bol-anon quo nyur! on May 14, 2011, 06:48:00 AM

 Ang lisod ani Bai, ug mibangon nah! pero naghagok pa :D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 14, 2011, 07:02:31 AM


Ang mas lisod pa jud, Bay BQN, kon mibangon na bisag naghagok pa, unya nagpamembro sa Tubag Bohol! Bwahaha! ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 14, 2011, 06:40:44 PM
Unsay ma wala kong ilubong si President Marcos sa libingan ng bayani. Naa bay makuhang kaayuhan ang Pilipinas kong dili ilubong sa L ng mga Bayani.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: islander on May 14, 2011, 07:17:24 PM

unsa man poy makuha nga kaayohan sa pilipinas kun ilubong si marcos sa libingan ng mga bayani. 
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 14, 2011, 07:21:25 PM

Nagdream pod kag colored? Sowe ^_^
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 14, 2011, 09:03:11 PM


Obviously, you do not understand the importance of symbolism--or the idea of symbolism outright...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 14, 2011, 09:05:52 PM


Bwahaha! Bitaw, Kerst, kadaghan baya sa oplok diri, oi. One of these days, when my patience with idiocy is depleted, I'm going to leave this website...
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 14, 2011, 09:14:13 PM

Basin nabahinan sa 10billion nga trabongko sinikwat sa kaban niy makaloloy nga nasod..

Sowe ive promised myself nga di unta mag apil apil ani nga lambo,
lisod ukiton ang kaspa ug kogan nga nauga na  ;D
those were the days sa bata pa c Sabel ahays.. :-X


One thing: Peps Power wasnt a merely march and groundless  :-X
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 14, 2011, 09:26:03 PM

Hagoo na?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 14, 2011, 10:19:00 PM

Wala god. Apil-apilon lang jud... gusto pod mosud sa playground (lubnganan baya ni  ;D )

But to Marcos' defense di baya pod siyay namugos nga ilubong siya sa LNMB, he's already at peace wherever he is (if we believe in afterlife after all). Ija rang mga insurektos ga buot-buot ani for their own selfish political intention  ::)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 14, 2011, 10:23:16 PM

Basin iya buot ipaibot nga bata pa si Sabel post-Martial Law pa siya gehukad...  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 14, 2011, 10:24:11 PM

Kapoyon bay Tarzan!!!  8)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 14, 2011, 10:33:21 PM
Bata pa si Sabel rhyme sad sa Bata Pas Vistabel   :P
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 14, 2011, 10:50:20 PM
 Ija rang mga insurektos ga buot-buot ani for their own selfish political intention[/color]  ::)


Mora ba tabogok Pads? ang iya mga gaway iyahay ug kamang nagbuho pod ilaha mao ang resulta kaguliyang  ;)

Apan asa paingon ang hagtob sa ulo jud? ::)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 14, 2011, 11:41:00 PM
The buck ends at the top so it says

From the phrase, "The buck stops here"
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 02:29:41 AM
Here's a repost of Mike Ligalig Ortega's post dadtos pikas...


“Whatever course you decide upon, there is always someone to tell you that you are wrong. There are always difficulties arising which tempt you to believe that your critics are right. To map out a course of action and follow it to an end requires courage.” - Ralph Waldo Emerson
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 15, 2011, 02:36:28 AM
laina pud ng puro oo bitaw lang, kaya nga naingon ta niini tungod kay kasagaran way kaugalingon nga baruganan, ambot tungod siguro way kaisog nga mobarog sa kaugalingon nga tiil ngita ug kasanga.  hahhahahahha

hahahhaha pag gusto diay nako nga ilubong si Marcos sa libingan ng mga bayani magboot diay mo, way bot-anay. hehheehe
 


  
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 02:46:01 AM

Bitaw. Kung parehas ta tanan ug huna2x - samot nag parehas tag nawong - mosamot kagubot ning kalibutana, bwahahaha  ;D

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 02:49:19 AM
WISDOM IN DISAGREEMENT

http://tausogdownunder.blogspot.com/2011/04/when-it-was-said-there-is-wisdom-in.html (http://tausogdownunder.blogspot.com/2011/04/when-it-was-said-there-is-wisdom-in.html)

when it was said there is wisdom in disagreement, it was among the learned, not among the fools nor among the learned with personal angsts to grind.

on disagreement, paul graham came up with a hierarchy to define our quality of disagreement. the bottom "name calling" is the lowest, vicious, most subjective and common type. refuting the central point requires patience or strong will to keep the disagreement objective, logical, at a more civil and professional level.

the irony is, if you look at my first statement, there is hints (fools, personal angst, elitist) of how low my argument has stoop. perhaps i should re-word it this way: when it was said there is wisdom in disagreement, it was among learned, well-informed and considerate of other views; not among those whose appreciation of the issue is too personal, limited and tend to exclude other people's views.

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 15, 2011, 02:54:41 AM

ang nakagubot sa kalibutan kadtong mga tao nga mogbo ug pang-unawa, kadtong nagtoo nga sila na supreme. pagkawalang juwas ning mga tawhana oi.

abe man nako ug si Marcos ray dictador.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 06:46:42 AM
Hmmmm lamian baya nang supreme pizza  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 15, 2011, 06:53:28 AM

Nindot pud mokanta ang Supremes... ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 15, 2011, 07:10:26 AM
dia ra imong supreme manoy ^_^

(http://www.freshnessmag.com/v4/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/supreme-kermit-medicom-kubrick.jpg)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 15, 2011, 07:13:08 AM
kang father Chic niy ka nahan magkawo :-)

(http://www.hatjunkies.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/supreme-box-logo-fleece-new-era-cap-2.jpg)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Kerstin on May 15, 2011, 07:16:02 AM
supreme[/color]. pagkawalang juwas ning mga tawhana oi.

abe man nako ug si Marcos ray dictador.


pero kani nahan ka nga supreme nop?  ;D

(http://cdn.nahright.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/rosa-acosta-terry-richardson-supreme-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 07:43:18 AM
http://cdn.nahright.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/rosa-acosta-terry-richardson-supreme-1.jpg[/img]

Bwahahaha!!! Makalibat nga supreme  ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on May 15, 2011, 09:25:02 AM

http://www.freshnessmag.com/v4/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/supreme-kermit-medicom-kubrick.jpg[/img]

Bwahaha! Kakyut!

Pero mas kyut ri nga posing...


(http://file3.monkeygallery.com/user/72/photo_large/SupremeBookKermit-1.jpg)


 ;D
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 10:36:22 AM
Vistabel, labi na ug mo hatag ta sa atohang opinion, ma suko Ning tawhana ug kalit ra ni siya mo ingon --idiot kono. Ug kalit ra mo pag symbolismo kono. Hahaha.

Continue to share your view despite criticism. So long as your post does not put anyone down and degrade other people, okay lang. Ayaw Lang ta mo hatag og libel.

Salamat!
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 10:39:43 AM

It is impossible to please everybody and some people can never be pleased. lol.

:)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 10:46:31 AM
Here's a repost of Mike Ligalig Ortega's post dadtos pikas...[/i]


“Whatever course you decide upon, there is always someone to tell you that you are wrong. There are always difficulties arising which tempt you to believe that your critics are right. To map out a course of action and follow it to an end requires courage.” - Ralph Waldo Emerson

Very beautiful saying. In other words, don't let the diminutive outbusts of others slow or alter your course. Had John the Baptist listened to the Pharisees , he would have stopped preaching. Had Rizal listened to the racist friars in Manila, he would have never left for Spain to study medicine and write Noli Mi Tangere and El Filibusterismo.

;-)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 11:00:44 AM
Angelo Reyes,a corrupt former military chief, is buried in the same place. Why so much opposition for Marcos? The man is dead,and can no longer harm or threaten anyone.

The Philippines is , from my understanding, a forgiving country. Thanks to our Christian upbringing. So if we can easily forgive Reyes for his corruption and apparent suicide and evasion of justice, why are we contrary in the case of the late President Marcos?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 11:01:19 AM
Here's proof that my family was all pro-Marcos. Here's my Lolo Ayong (Hilario A. Lungay) when he was mayor of Catigbian.
Saonz wa man sila moliwat nako nga anti-Marcos nga dako  ;D


(http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/LoloAyongImelda.jpg)

(Repost from Facebook) Arnold Lungay This picture was taken sometime in mid 60s. When Marcos was a
newly elected President. Papa at that time was also a newly installed mayor after winning his election protest
against Lucas Asotigue. Behind papa is the late Congressman Zafra of Clarin his lawyer during the election protest
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 11:05:24 AM
Former Mayor of Catigbian, Arnold Lungay, with former strongman, FM

(http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/TiyoArnNMarcos.jpg)

Comment sa Facebook by my cousin Brydon Borja Lungay: "Ingon si Marcos ani nga
"Dong Arnold mobisita unya ko nimo sa Catigbian ha magsightseeing ta sa Candumayao,
Bagtik pod. Ila-ila ko ni Purencia dong, ayaw saba ni Elbong kay magselos to.....wahahaha  ;D

Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 11:34:26 AM
Kuyawa ang Lungay Clan!
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 11:41:52 AM
OT: Fr. Roel, are you related to the same Borja Family that owns the Borja Hospital right across BQ?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 12:47:37 PM

Nope. That's Brydon's aunt (mag-agawan). I used to go to her when I was a kid  ;)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 01:15:03 PM
Thanks for the answer. I was really impressed with their private hospital. Good location to set up shop.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 15, 2011, 02:57:12 PM
Kaning Familya Asotique, taga silingan ko ning barrio namalhin sila ug puyo sa Catigbian. Unya kadto si Mayor Lucas Asotique di ba gipusil to ug namatay.


Unya ang anak niya nga si Lucas Asotique jr. nga usa ka Police gipatay raba diri sa among Lungsod last December  2010 ug wala mailhi kinsay nagpatay.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 15, 2011, 03:09:03 PM
naa man pod nahimo si marcos noon,,pero kon totalon,,nindot og deli,,,or nalipay og wala,,murag negative jod resulta...ako lang ganahan niya kay himo siyag nuclear plant,,nindot unta to para na kurenti,,awa bohol ron perting mahala kurenti,,mangurenti pod,,,
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Vistabel on May 15, 2011, 03:35:00 PM
http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/TiyoArnNMarcos.jpg[/img]

Comment sa Facebook by my cousin Brydon Borja Lungay: "Ingon si Marcos ani nga
"Dong Arnold mobisita unya ko nimo sa Catigbian ha magsightseeing ta sa Candumayao,
Bagtik pod. Ila-ila ko ni Purencia dong, ayaw saba ni Elbong kay magselos to.....wahahaha  ;D



Possebling tinuod ni nga may Purencia si Army Major Ferdinand Marcos diha sa Catigbian kay sa 2nd WW diha madistinong mga lugara sa Carmen, Bilar, catigbian, etc. Sa katapusan niyang campanya niadtong '86 diha sa CPG Grandstand matud pa ni Pres. Marcos, dinhing probensyaha diyot daw sya madisgrasya sa mga Hapon ug dili makalimot nga gikan Calape ngadto sa Carmen tag-iya sa kabayo ug siya (Maj Marcos)  ila daw ning giadto nga kabayo ra ang gisakyan ug nakahinagbo pa nila ang grupo sa sundalong hapon.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 05:49:35 PM
http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/LoloAyongImelda.jpg[/img]

(Repost from Facebook) Arnold Lungay This picture was taken sometime in mid 60s. When Marcos was a
newly elected President. Papa at that time was also a newly installed mayor after winning his election protest
against Lucas Asotigue. Behind papa is the late Congressman Zafra of Clarin his lawyer during the election protest

An excellent photo. It not only captures the facial expression (happiness!) of your Lolo Ayong, but it also captures the style of the time period. Thanks for sharing this historical picture with all of us, Fr. Roel. :)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chriswise on May 15, 2011, 06:19:32 PM

mao ba ni nga LUNGAY kadtong nahimong board member?
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: chicogon on May 15, 2011, 08:35:33 PM

Oo mao na siya
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: Lorenzo on May 15, 2011, 11:45:06 PM
http://i977.photobucket.com/albums/ae252/roromusic2009/Misc/TiyoArnNMarcos.jpg[/img]

Comment sa Facebook by my cousin Brydon Borja Lungay: "Ingon si Marcos ani nga
"Dong Arnold mobisita unya ko nimo sa Catigbian ha magsightseeing ta sa Candumayao,
Bagtik pod. Ila-ila ko ni Purencia dong, ayaw saba ni Elbong kay magselos to.....wahahaha  ;D



I want to bring up this photo again. Kai kuyaw kaayo.
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 10, 2016, 04:25:59 PM
(http://cebudailynews.inquirer.net/files/2016/08/08-15-marcos.jpg)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 10, 2016, 04:31:12 PM
(http://twt-thumbs.washtimes.com/media/image/2016/08/22/Protest_c0-408-4206-2860_s885x516.jpg?532201f782127cb7c8666411e3193923737e69b7)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 12, 2016, 10:11:05 AM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/6b/03/7e/6b037e4dbea099682d69f44a21b9a167.jpg)
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/600x315/6b/03/7e/6b037e4dbea099682d69f44a21b9a167.jpg)



(http://www.freesmileyfaces.com/files/emotions/angry-smiley-faces/18.gif)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 12, 2016, 10:16:18 AM


(http://www.candycruzdatu.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/bongbong_manilaspeakdotcom.jpg)



(http://www.animateit.net/data/media/june2010/418d260a2bc3.gif)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 12, 2016, 10:01:20 PM
(http://globalnation.inquirer.net/files/2015/10/12068911_10153122022480848_8565757049021536222_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 14, 2016, 12:09:29 AM
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-jwmxlGoTQRc/TWfAGsNOEWI/AAAAAAAACXI/15UMZvUuyaI/s1600/cartoon1.png)
Title: Re: Late President Marcos To Be Buried in Libingan Ng Mga Bayani?
Post by: hubag bohol on September 14, 2016, 09:02:22 AM
UNFIT FOR HERO'S BURIAL
Marcos undeserving of Libingan ng mga Bayani — Carpio
Published August 31, 2016 1:37pm
By VIRGIL LOPEZ, GMA News


(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-DVP-Fp0ZBpQ/TWfAG7ZBnbI/AAAAAAAACXQ/1c9xutXMdVk/s1600/coffin.gif)


The late strongman Ferdinand Marcos does not deserve a hero's burial because he was "dishonorably discharged" by the people in 1986, Supreme Court Senior Associate Justice Antonio Carpio said Wednesday.

"Marcos cannot be buried [at the Libingan ng mga Bayani]," Carpio said while interpellating former Bayan Muna Rep. Neri Colmenares during the oral arguments on whether the late dictator deserves a place at the Libingan ng mga Bayani (LNMB).

Carpio based his statement on the Armed Forces of the Philippines Regulation 161-375, which disqualifies those dishonorably discharged from service or convicted by final judgment of a crime involving moral turpitude.

He also warned President Rodrigo Duterte of the repercussion of changing the cited AFP rules.

"But if the incumbent President says that '[Marcos] can still be buried there upon my instruction,' Carpio insisted, that cannot be done because it is against the Constitution because you are using public funds and property for a private purpose."

Colmenares agreed with Carpio, saying the President's directive favoring the burial could not change the objective of Republic Act 289, which provides that only people worthy of public emulation should be given a space at the LNMB.

Marcos was not convicted of any offense involving moral turpitude until his death in 1989, but the petitioners said that [non-conviction] does not mean he was qualified for a hero's burial.

In responding to a question of Associate Justice Estela Perlas-Bernabe raised, lawyer Barry Gutierrez said there was no opportunity to make Marcos accountable for his crimes during his 20-year rule because he had immunity as president.

When Marcos was removed through a People Power uprising, Gutierrez said the former leader fled to Hawaii where he died while in exile.

"But the Supreme Court had said in several occasions that Marcos is guilty of plunder and human rights violations," Gutierrez added.

At the SC on Wednesday, the petitioners on Marcos' burial at the LNMB were first to present their arguments. After interpellations, government lawyers, headed by the Solicitor General, will present their side of the argument, followed by interpellations. — LBG, GMA News
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