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Lorenzo

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The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« on: September 06, 2008, 12:03:30 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS06grlPKUI

My personal views on the concept of the Big Bang; its relation to Academic Reasoning and Faith.

Join me in dialogue. Your views and input will be greatly appreciated.



Best,
Bran Lorenzo

Linkback: https://tubagbohol.mikeligalig.com/index.php?topic=14927.0

aa

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2008, 12:37:56 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS06grlPKUI[/url]

My personal views on the concept of the Big Bang; its relation to Academic Reasoning and Faith.

Join me in dialogue. Your views and input will be greatly appreciated.



Best,
Bran Lorenzo

i'm on faith, coz if i rely on reasoning it limit only to the mind of mortal while faith is recognizing that there's a huge power outside the self, that there is a God.

Lorenzo

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2008, 01:07:43 PM »
I agree with you, aa.

For me, I think that academic reasoning and scientific understanding holds significant meaning. As a scientist, I do understand the views of fellow colleagues in their questionings. In milieu with that concept; I cannot help but question and it leads back to the question of the Big Bang.

In these days there seems to be some tension with religionists and scientists in this aspect; where the religionist clings strongly to scriptural passages for answers and for guidance. And the scientist, trained in scientific reasoning, questions and examines processes.

The major fault line is the concept of creationism and the coming of life. Questions arise such as the big bang's occurrence, why it occurred, when did it occur, what was present before its occurrence. And the like.

For me, personally, I believe that there is only so much man can understand. We will never know when the big bang occurred, and what existed before, if ever.   

I've had rough arguments with colleagues in the past with this is that they ridiculed me in my 'futility' for acquiescence. And as I said in the video, I reiterate it again. There is only so much that man can understand. Perhaps I'm wrong, perhaps I'm right. Who knows.

The very notion of human thought and reasoning for existentialism, by right of phenomena, is proof of the Divine's presence.

It is the basis that separates Man from the continuum of Animals.


Best,

aa

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2008, 12:04:04 AM »
Because we are created in His image and likeness. 

We can cite simple  examples on how unfathomable "existence" is, even not thinking of the Galactic Big Bang.  Just the passing of every moment, an hour,  a day.  A lot of things are happening that our small minds cannot understand why this things happened and not the other way around, or not the way that we want it to be... are just examples of complications if we think of it.

But if we try to let God our thoughts, our feelings, the impossibles, and let Him direct us, some questions that we asked before will slowly surfaced, solutions creeps in, and we can easily find it in our heart the calmness, the peacefulness, that we longed for.  Di ba?

Sabagay, di man gud pud ko scientist hehehe

Lorenzo

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2008, 05:50:48 AM »
aa,

Well said, well said, and in great form!

I have spent some hours in our anatomy laboratory with cadavers with some of my classmates at night in identifying the specific lymph nodes, and deep lymph vessels such as the right lymphatic duct and the thoracic duct, which are special vessels that transport ECF (extracellular fluid), cellular debris, and wastes out of the body's entire body. The lymphatic system is imperative to human health because it provides the manifestation of the Sterling Hypothesis, which states that wastes within the cellular body, the ECF are entered back into the blood through osmotic pressure. And it is the lymphatic system of the body that drains these wastes providing an 'overflow' system that drains  surplus tissue flow and leaked plasma proteins to the bloodstream, as well for the removal of debris from cellular decomposition and infection. This is why the lymphatics is extremely imperative for organismal health.

If we have a non-functioning lympathic system or part of the lymphatics that is not operating due to degeneracy or due to repressors, we have the result of accullation of debris, ECF, and cellular wastes within a given system--and this in turns reverses the natural flow--thereby causing edema in the body. Its system is explained in basic physics. Hence the importance of the system.

Now, can you imagine, that as a student, here I am with some of my colleagues staying in our cadaver lab at night to have a better understanding of given lymph nodes, lymphatic plexi, lymphatic vessels, and given lymph tissues within the walls of the digestive tract, the spleen, the thymus and the nodes itself. The way we are designed as we are taught in anatomy, is so perfectly knitted.

I mean, the way we have the right lymphatic duct that specializes in only the upper right hand quadrant of the body and the thoracic duct focusing on the latter 3/4ths of the body.

There are special systems in place that produces a healthy circuit of this system and if the circuit is impeded or occluded in any way, then of course, manifestation of problems will occur. As what medical science can point out. And to me, I stand marveled at the beauty of the human body and the inner processes that makes us run and operate. System by system.

And what a glorious and wondrous creator we have to have designed us so impeccably perfect. It is perfection how we are created. Given, we have our own systemic degeneracies but that is due to environmental or personal habituations (per se smoking, drinking, over sex, disease proliferation; poor personal hygienics).



aa

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2008, 08:21:39 PM »
very very true Renzo...

Murag kita lang gyud ang nangita ug problema hehehe.  Bitaw no, may mga realizations man pud ko nga nakita sa mga bagay bagay.  Sample kining pag limit ug anak ug paggamit sa contraceptives nga dili magkatugma sa atong catholic faith. Ang na realized nako lately based ra pud sa mga panghitabo sa kalibutan.  Kung giingon sa Ginoo sa bibliya nga "Go to the world and multiply", naa jud na sya bearing kay Ginoo gud niingon.  Pero tungod kay kita tawo limited lang ang panghuna-huna nahadlok ta kay nagkadaghan naman ta, ug ang nakita nato ang problema, ang threat and etc.

Pero no, wala pud nato na anticipate ba na isa lang ka bagyo, isa lang ka linog, isa lang ka lunop daghan pud ang nawala nga mga tawo.  Siguro kung motuman ug mosalig lang jud ta sa Ginoo, sya ra gyud ang nakabalo sa tanan,  So, no wori na cguro bahala ug daghang anak hehehe...

Lorenzo

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2008, 09:24:04 PM »
I agree bitaw, aa,

Kaning mga tawo that worry about too much children etc; recent phenomenon ra man ni. Diri sa US ug sa mga industrialized world, population is actually decreasing. We are going through a negative growth rate; especially in western european nations.

I view this as over-secularization of society and the loss of familial importance.

In Europe, which is the ancestral root of Christianity (aside from Judea, of course, but we view that Christianity spread throughout the world due to the Roman Empire; the birth place of The Universal Church: Roman Catholicism), many people in Europe no longer focus their lives in church. Or have adopted an agnostic view of life. The high rates of divorces, had been correlated to high amounts of children suicides, depression and drop outs. Here in the United States, divorce rates is magnanimous; and we have a current problem in youth-related depression, or youth suicides. And there have been studies that did point a positive relation to youth suicides to the familial problems; per se divorces, lack of religious activity.


And I tell you, it is due to the apostasy that is going on in this country. The secularization of this country and its people; the flock that is leaving its churches and failing to hear the word of God. And I do believe that if one alienates himself from God and His calling, it allows one to be targeted by unclean spirits. It manifests in picking up of bad, self-destructive habits: smoking, drugs, drinking excessively, fornication, prostitution, etc.

And it has happened. And is happening.

For me, there is nothing wrong with alot of children; it just depends on personal responsibility and the parents needing to provide for their children. My paternal grandfather was one of 7 children; my paternal grandmother was one of 13 children. My maternal grandfather was one of 12 children. And all were, for the most part, able to graduate high school and provide for themselves. My paternal grandfather had 7 children; and all of his kids finished high school and college. 2 became engineers, 1 became a provincial director, 1 became a nurse, 1 is an electrician, 1 is a businessman and 1 is a physician. And my grandfather wasn't so to say a wealthy man. Hard work. Hard work, patience, and faith in God.


It's all about responsibility, accountability, familial piety and MOST of all: Love and Faith in God.


For there is no such thing as 'impossibility' with Him.

 

aa

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2008, 09:29:13 PM »
Amen. :)

Lorenzo

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2008, 01:30:28 AM »
Here's another tidbit from The Age of Faith: "To appease the Inquisition, some Averroists advanced the doctrine of twofold truth: a proposition, they argued, might seem true in philosophy or according to natural reason, and yet be false according to Scripture and the Christian faith; they professed at the same time to believe according to faith what they doubted according to reason."

Check this out, I stumbled on it while googling: http://www.rtforum.org/study/lesson18.html
It seems that the Catholic Church was still debating the literal truth of the scriptures as late as the 20th century. This kind of stuff is fascinating to me. Here's an excerpt:

129. Conclusion. What Father Jean Levie refers to as the “biblical movement,” is the emergence of a particular method of biblical interpretation, known as “historical criticism,” that stems from a larger movement outside of the Catholic Church and that entered Catholic biblical studies in the 1890s. It is not to be identified with historical science itself. The founders and the principal exponents of this method have been non-Catholic liberal scholars of a rationalist bent. “Form-criticism” and “redaction-criticism” are phases of this method which employ a novel theory of “literary genres” presuming the fictional character of the biblical accounts. Catholic biblical scholars who use this method try to avoid drawing conclusions that undermine the dogmas of the Catholic Church, but their hesitations are not always consistent with the method itself, whose basic principles they do not question. In order to attempt some safeguard of the dogmas of the Catholic Church, Catholic historical-critics (in contrast with their liberal non-Catholic counterparts) maintain the theory of the “twofold truth” of many Scriptural accounts (often of supernatural char­acter), according to which the accounts are mistakenly presented as history and do not relate historical facts but do have an underlying religious message from God. The message coincides with the teaching of the Church, which is thus superimposed upon the inspired text. This theory was condemned by Pope Leo XIII in Providentissimus Deus, by Pope Pius X in Pascendi Dominici gregis, by Pope Benedict XV in Spiritus Paraclitus, by Pope Pius XII in Divino afflante Spiritu, and by the Second Vatican Council in Dei Verbum 11 (somewhat ambiguously in the text of the conciliar pronouncement but clearly in its footnote references). These official documents of the Magisterium of the Church do indeed point out that, for a proper interpretation of the text of Sacred Scripture, careful distinctions need to be made in analyzing the biblical texts and the forms used by these ancient writers need to be recognized and understood. But these documents do not say or imply that the forms of expression used in the Sacred Scriptures in any way are the same as the novel forms used by form-and-redaction critics in the unfolding of what they call “historical criticism.”

I really do give credit to the Catholic Church.

Lorenzo

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Re: The Galactic Big Bang: My Views--An Internalization
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2008, 07:24:23 AM »
I've received emails on this and I would like to address it here, alright?

Quote
but when you take up a faith position you automatically abandon reason. you may take it up again in order to gain a better understanding of their faith, but faith in itself is an irrational position.

Response:

Perhaps it starts from an irrational premise based more on intuition and feeling than logic, but after that premise is accepted it can continue with rational explanation of the belief. Most things in life are based on irrational premises though, and generally people accept them without questioning. Examples being the absoluteness of physics, the need for love and companionship, the desire to succeed financially when a moderate non-starvation would be much easier, etc.


Quote
In that way reason and logic should be 100% effective in convincing us of everything when used on conjuncture with the information provided by our senses.

Response:

Should be, but its not. Different people reason in different ways and on some level we understand this. Reasoning is one tool we have, but our minds are not rational things. If so, there would be no war, little true heartbreak, and little evil in the world. Reasonable arguments would refute all of them. However its impossible for most people to believe something on reasoning alone.




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