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Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?

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islander

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #40 on: July 08, 2011, 05:45:36 PM »
Just driving my point on your erroneous assumption that the Chinese have no moral compass because of their lack of a nationalized religion.

Here's a point to you isles. Stick to the topic. You have a tendency of evading the point.

Petty tactic, IMHO.
sukad nadato-dato gamay ning china, ninggara na ug paugat.  pagkalisod gyod diay tuod kun wa tay tuhoan nga relihiyon because it denies us the moral compass of reining in our baser instincts, we lose the human dimension and we may be tempted to operate as if money were our god.

unsa god diay ni, abi kay gamay ug pobre kunohay, sayon-sayonon ra?  >:(

i believe this second quoted post is your basis for getting shrill about china’s moral compass, thereby making me an excuse for your treatise on china.

look closer at this quote, so you can see that nowhere is there any claim that “the chinese have no moral compass because of their lack of a nationalized religion".  note too that the term “nationalized religion” is your invention, at least in this thread.

my first sentence is specific.  the second is general.  the word “tay” (underscored in the quote) in the second sentence means “we”.  “we” is not china.  sabe?

please do not jump like a frog into the bog of baseless conclusions because you end up putting words into my nostrils.

advice is hereby repeated; get away from sophism by taking care of your syllogism.

thanks for your advice on sticking to the topic.  you may not know it, but you really sound unstuck with your treatise on china and your mockery of our country's government policy, you've dulled all the points.

some brains are the size of peas, imho.

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islander

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #41 on: July 08, 2011, 05:59:11 PM »
Wrong ka kaayo!

ug sakto ka kaayo?  hahaha!  you do not only know china better, you even know my country better.  roflmao!

OT:  imho, this is one more example why you're such a turn-off.  you believe it is within you to mete out judgments on who is right or wrong in tb, you end up straining yourself silly to show that you're always right.  ad nauseam.   

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islander

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #42 on: July 08, 2011, 06:08:32 PM »
dudes, akong panan-aw kining mga tawhana nga tua nas amerika nagdako. murag nag libog na sila sa ilang kaugalingon! dili na kasusud sa tinuod nga angajan bation para sa atong nasud!!! mao nga pagbantay kay usahay wa naka ma angay......

okay lang, dude sangs.  ato na lang tubay-tubayan ug jab-jab ginagmay-gagmay ning patoo-too nga ubay-ubay ang kinaadman, dala na lang ug lingaw-lingaw ug tutho-tutho, labi nag katulgon ko.  di man god tingali kalikayan nga naa natoy bag-ong nakakat-on ug basa nga nagtoo na nga sila ang imbentor sa abakada. ;D

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islander

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islander

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #44 on: July 08, 2011, 07:04:59 PM »
PHL seeks ASEAN 'solidarity' on dispute over Spratlys

GMA News Online

The Department of Foreign Affairs (DFA) has launched a diplomatic offensive in its ongoing spat with China over the West Philippine Sea. DFA Secretary Albert del Rosario has met envoys of the member-states of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) and urged them to form a united stand on the territorial dispute.

In a statement issued Friday, del Rosario said the regional bloc should be able to “share issues with one another and share political solutions" on the Spratly Islands conflict.

Del Rosario also said he is urging solidarity on what will become “a recurring and an exacerbating problem."

Four ASEAN members — Brunei, Malaysia, Vietnam and the Philippines — are claiming some parts of the disputed islands. Two ASEAN neighbors, China and Taiwan, also claim the islands.

Del Rosario, in a meeting with some envoys of ASEAN member-states, pointed out that Philippine sovereignty over the Recto (Reed) Bank is backed by international law.

“Recto Bank is within the Philippine continental shelf and some 80 nautical miles from Palawan. Under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, a feature within 200 nautical miles of a country is part of that given country’s exclusive economic zone. This means that Recto Bank is ours," he said.

Quoting President Benigno Aquino III, Del Rosario emphasized that “what is ours is ours, and with what is disputed, we can work together towards joint cooperation."

The DFA chief also said that transforming the area into a Zone of Peace, Freedom, Friendship, and Cooperation is the key to addressing the claims of the country-claimants and advancing a peaceful settlement of territorial disputes. — Jesse Edep/ELR/VS, GMA News


http://ph.news.yahoo.com/phl-seeks-asean-solidarity-dispute-over-spratlys-114806034.html

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hubag bohol

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #45 on: July 08, 2011, 07:53:00 PM »
a gorilla in their midst.

A relevant quote:

"He's as big as a gorilla and as strong as a gorilla. If he was as smart as a gorilla he'd be fine.' -- Sam Bailey

 :-X

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islander

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #46 on: July 08, 2011, 08:10:13 PM »
Peter A. Dutton, Associate Professor, China Maritime Studies Institute, U.S. Naval War College, was one of those who ruled out and all-out-war between the claimants of the Spratlys and thus the South China Sea (SCS) zone.

But he warned of "unintended flare-ups; small incidents that get out of control".

Dutton said there is no "shortage of good aspirations" to find solutions to make SCS a zone of peace, freedom and cooperation.

However, he said, "There appears to be a shortage of political will to find compromise and all sides are using naval power to send signals of resolve."

He added:  "If parties are to stave off conflict, the answer lies not in the win-lose propositions of sovereignty and jurisdiction, but in finding answers in some of the examples of win-win frameworks that would regionalize the territory and waters of the South China Sea, allow common development of the living and non-living resources, and provide for shared enforcement of laws."

The alternative, Dutton said, "is as it ever has been — that the strong will do what they can and the weak will do what they must."

(underscoring mine)

excerpted from Reality check in the Spratlys by Yvonne Chua, VERA Files
http://ph.news.yahoo.com/blogs/the-inbox/reality-check-spratlys-071115113.html

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benelynne

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #47 on: July 08, 2011, 11:53:39 PM »
Thanks for putting the discussion back on track with more factual input. Mura man gud nauna ang buthanay dinhi kaysa Spratlys.

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Lorenzo

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #48 on: July 10, 2011, 03:19:51 AM »

Confused Shus says:

When voice is raised against you

Drink water to cool your head

Hot temper flames

Even icy relationships . . .

;D

Thank you for your words of wisdom, GEC. :)

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Lorenzo

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #49 on: July 10, 2011, 03:26:29 AM »
If China did not recoil from its territorial tussle with Japan, an economic superpower within its own league, over the Senkaku islands in an East China Sea incident last year, how can we expect it to go soft on us over the Spratly Islands? Japan's arrest of the Chinese fishing boat crew  set off a chain of saber rattling, retributive arrest of Japanese nationals, Chinese government-orchestrated sabotage of economic reciprocity which eventually resulted in Japan releasing the crew and then the captain after a few months.

We do not have the latitude to engage in such brinksmanship. But respond firmly we must. Japan was almost bullied, but when it symbollically held its ground through the arrest, China got the message.

As to the Spratlys, it would be more effective to bring this issue to the regional forum ASEAN, where our concerns resonate closer to home. The issue should be addressed through the law of the sea convention, and not through historical claims.

You are right, Tito Ben. The Philippines must hold its territorial claim , however, we should exhaust all diplomatic options -- per se bringing this issue into the ASEAN forum and to the United Nations.

A military response by the Philippines would be devastating for us, Filipinos, in that it would be used as pretext for an overwhelming Chinese military response. A war with China, in my honest opinion, is a foregone conclusion. But perhaps with the diplomatic support from key ASEAN players and from the United States and other influential nation states might provide enough clout to stave off further Chinese territorial incursion.

One can only remain hopeful.

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islander

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #50 on: July 10, 2011, 01:34:59 PM »
Thanks for putting the discussion back on track with more factual input. Mura man gud nauna ang buthanay dinhi kaysa Spratlys.

most welcome, bene.  breaks of 'all sound and fury...' or 'acoustic warfare' i hope add spice to everything nice here.  :)  

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hubag bohol

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #51 on: July 10, 2011, 03:13:17 PM »
He he, don't forget the amphibious assaults…   :-X

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bisayantek

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #52 on: July 10, 2011, 10:22:58 PM »
Kon wala lang gyoy minahonon diha sa Spratlys ilabi na ang duol sa Palawan, dili na man gyod mangugat og pangangkon ang China. Abi man tingali nilag di na gyod ta mopalag apil na ang Amerika nga gipautang pod og binilyong dolyares makaandar lang ang ekonomiya sa nasod. Apan nasajop jud sila.

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hubag bohol

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #53 on: July 19, 2011, 11:25:02 PM »
Bisag wa pa tingalig way minahonon, mangangkon gihapon ang mga Insik just to flex their muscles and be who they are according to their despicable fantasy of some kind of manifest destiny. That nature abhors a vacuum is as much a truism in international politics as it is in the physical sciences.

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Lorenzo

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #54 on: July 20, 2011, 01:05:41 AM »
If one studies the international politics concerning China and her territorial claims, one notices a trend: strategic, tactical and operational management.

1. Sino-India War of 1962 established Chinese dominance over India ; and reiterated the western fears that China , even then during the infancy of the Communist Government, had spherical interest in hegemony in South -South East Asia. India, after the war, conceded to Chinese territorial demands.

2. 1979 Sino-Vietnamese War. China invaded North Vietnam after Vietnam's involvement in Cambodia. China send a 20,000 man action force to bombard northern provinces of Vietnam.

3. 1988 Sino-Vietnamese Naval Confrontation in the Spratlys. China's Naval Battle Group engaged Vietnamese navy ships; wiping out the Vietnamese contingent.

4. 2011. China and Pakistan are holding military talks and military operations. Chinese troops, Chinese engineers are now in the Pakistan-Occupied Kashmir, in an effort to boost Pakistan-Chinese relations. The aim is to outflank and contain India.

5. 2011. China and Thailand hold joint military exercises together. This is seen by ASEAN members and western countries as China's move to flex its muscle. The Chinese Marine Corps were, for the first time in its history, operated outside the shores of China in a foreign country to hold joint military exercises. This move indicates to us that the Chinese Military is ready to send its forces , acclimate its forces to the south east asian environment.

6. 2011. China sends a powerful naval battle group near the Philippine-Occupied Spratlys Islands.


Chinese nuclear submarines , flanked by Destroyers of the PLAN




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hubag bohol

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #55 on: July 20, 2011, 01:30:58 AM »
If one studies the international politics concerning China and her territorial claims, one notices a trend: strategic, tactical and operational management.

So what is your point? Any idiot country has its idiot objectives and methods. :P

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Lorenzo

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Re: Even Chinese diplomats are bullies?
« Reply #56 on: July 20, 2011, 02:53:54 AM »
My point, hubag bohol, is that the Chinese Government have a history of bullying neighbors as per their geopolitical stance from 1962 to present.

China's recent military activity in the South China Sea coincides with her military and strategic movements in South Asia. As we speak, the Chinese are also cooperating with the Pakistanis in containing India. The Chinese are building a naval port in Gwadar , Pakistan-- the Pakistanis are also requesting the Chinese maintain a naval presence -- of course as a deterrant to possible Indian military movements.

The Chinese' habitual tendency in arming neighbours of India -- namely: Nepal, Sri Lanka and Myanmar (Burma) is also visibly seen by the Indians as China's growing influence in the region. Unfortunately, to the detriment of Indian national interest.

---

If we look to the north, The Chinese are also warming relations with Russia and Euroasian nations, namely Kazakhstan via the Shanghai Cooperation Agenda.

The Chinese know what they are doing. The United States is loosing its polarity, and loosing its influence abroad. China is trying to fill that vacuum.

This is, indeed, a concern for us Filipinos and for the integrity of our Philippine Fatherland.  

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