Author Topic: The Philippines: 51st State of the United States of America? (Read 83179 times)

glacier_71 · « **Reply #240 on:** March 24, 2009, 08:33:40 PM »

I thought that was true, during the time that geater Filipinos (poor filipinos) did an underground movement against them 'the americans and the Pro-Am) in the Philippines.

But, in this generation very different it's a reverse situation happened in the Philippines, why? because the role of America now in the Philippine it seems an undercover, they are moving here in the Philippine through underground movement.

that's what i said. they like each other, they want each other but the odds of having a total union are next to impossible. it's like Martin Nievera marrying Oprah. so? he takes her as his "mistress" instead..He doesn't need to walk the Lady to the aisle of marriage coz he could still have her anyway, whatever way. she is too beautiful to be left behind, and he is too powerful to ignore.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #241 on:** April 09, 2009, 11:33:25 AM »

Imagine, who is supplying modern Guns and Ammunitions to the anti-Philippine Govâ€™t and other lawless elements in the country?

Everybody believe that America did these matters but they donâ€™t have evidence tungod kay gihimo nila pasikreto.

Who is supplying guns and ammunition to insurgents? These insurgents are interesting because they operate like a corporation; they fight military units, but only in isolated cases, never too daunting or wide-scale for fear of massive losses.

And if the opportunity provides, will capture civilians (usually foreign) to be ransomed.

Please read strategic forums and online journals.

The greatest supporter for the MNLF and Abu Sayaff groups are private contributors from Malaysia and Indonesia. The islamofascism that is sent to the Philippines is that of a Malaysian-Indonesian origin.

Please read more into Islamiyaah Jeremiah.

Regards,

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #242 on:** April 13, 2009, 09:16:38 AM »

islamiyah, al queda or abus or bayuts its still m16's american guns manufactired by the americans. thats american bizness! the buck stops there!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #243 on:** April 13, 2009, 11:27:45 AM »

islamiyah, al queda or abus or bayuts its still m16's american guns manufactired by the americans. thats american bizness! the buck stops there!

Buwad, do you even research ?

I mean, for you to say that without any research is quite absurd. The Abu Sayyaf is listed as a terrorist group by the United States government and NATO allies. Terrorist funding is restricted.

Additionally, the weapons these insurgents have are all purchased FROM sympathetic Malaysian and Indonesia members of Islamiyah Jeremiah. Many of whom donate weapons. Additionally, most of the weapons are also stolen from Philippine Army munitions and or taken from dead Filipino soldiers.

I really do hope you're not sympathetic towards these Muslim separatists.

May the Iron Hammer of the Armed Forces of the Philippines crush them.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #244 on:** April 13, 2009, 11:38:44 AM »

islamiyah, al queda or abus or bayuts its still m16's american guns manufactired by the americans. thats american bizness! the buck stops there!

Actually the buck stops no where.

We are living in a capitalistic society, one can even argue hedonism, but that is a topic for another day.

The point is, Buwad, that the United States cannot be blamed for selling weapons to allied nations and friendly nations. Thats the beauty and absolution of capitalism. What the buyer nation does with the weapons it has purchased from the United States (either it be using for its military or selling it to paramilitary units and or subversive groups under the detection of foreign watch groups, is all at the discretion of the buyer nation).

In this case it relates to Malaysia and Indonesia.

Please research more about Pan-Malay Islamofascism. It is a product of Javanese militantism. IT calls for the destruction of the governments in Kuala Lumpur and Manila, and reclamation of all Malay Peoples under one Islamic Republic.

Its a terroristic subversice political concept that has flooded southern Philippines from Indonesia and Malaysia for decades now. Do you think Indonesia and Malaysia want a strong Philippines? Of course not. That would be detrimental to their own national security to have a strong (economic-military-political) Philippines.

Its simple strategy, my friend.

One that has been in effect for quite some time now.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #245 on:** April 13, 2009, 11:46:59 AM »

Let me give you a case point scenario, Buwad.

In the recent clashes between the AFP and MNLF forces, the peace process has always been under ushered by a 3rd party. Notice that it has always been Malaysia being that particular group.

I am not fond of the duplicity of the Malaysian government, as its tactics have manifested that for quite some time.

Prior to the peace process between MNLF and AFP forces, do you know where most of the MNLF recieved aid from? Take a big guess.

Yes, from private contributors in Malaysia.

And do you happen to know what the MNLF uses the funds for? For building schools and planting flowers? Oh no, definitely not. Arms purchases, my friend. Where do you think they recieve their RPGs, their AK47s, the stolen M16s, AR-33s and grenades? From funds given by 3rd parties.

Let us also remember the last clash the AFP had with the MNLF, where Filipino troops and officers were killed and beheaded. Do you think the MNLF merely left the rifles of the dead Filipino soldiers on the ground? As they lay? Of course not. They took their rifles, ammunition, munitions etc.

Its a cyclic process, Buwad.

The Philippines is at the mercy of duplicitous 3rd parties.

Cheers,

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #246 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:38:21 PM »

every bullet made every american gun manufactured and sold contributed to the american economy. thats the american military industrial complex!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #247 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:42:32 PM »

Buwad, thats the capitalistic concept.

The Russians do the same, and more.

Who provides the uranium for nuclear technology to North Korea and Iran?
Russia, my friend.

Who provided the Vietnamese with arms? Russia.

Who provided the Arab nations with Mig-21s and missiles to be used against the Israelis in the 1967 War? And again in the 7 Day War?
Answer: Russia

What about the British? Do you know that they sell arms munitions? So do the Germans, The Spanish, The Japanese, The Koreans, and the Chinese.

Its a global continuum, Buwad. You cannot wipe all the blame in on one country when there is a multitude of nations that participates in the same capitalistic process.

And in this economic scenario, you cannot blame, because they follow the law of Mercantilism. Supply and Demand.

If there is a demand, there will, definitely, be a supply.

Cheers,

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #248 on:** April 14, 2009, 08:44:43 AM »

in mindanao or south east asia where m16 is like a hot cake that can be sold everywhere. i can, yes we can blame the americans!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #249 on:** April 14, 2009, 08:47:23 AM »

But the M16 i produced by military plants all over the world, Buwad. License rights to produce them are acquired.

That's like us blaming the Wrights Brothers for all the airplane crashes because they invented the aero-plane in the early 20th century.

Your tactic is rather moot.

The violence should be placed on those who use the weapons for ill-intent. Claro que si?

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #250 on:** April 14, 2009, 09:07:42 AM »

your example on erplain is way out of sense(sorry to tell you this). you better likened an M16 to a coke and that every bottle you open this unhealthy american made drink a portion of the money when pipol buy it will be sent to america as a royalty fee.

claro m recto - a pilipino nationalist!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #251 on:** April 14, 2009, 09:38:32 AM »

Buwad, your blaming of the United States for such matters makes no sense.
Read your argument again, bud.

The United States does not produce all the M16s. It grants licenses to other nations to produce said weapons (and other units). The Philippine Army produces its own arms by acquiring military contracts and license from foreign arms providers.

What it does with it is at the discretion of the Philippines, and any other nation for that matter.

Its a business. It follows the rules of capitalism and mercantilism.

China, Russia, etc do the same.

Lets not be hypocritical, shall we?

And being a nationalist has nothing to do with this, its simple logic.

Cheers,

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #252 on:** April 14, 2009, 09:49:37 AM »

I'm just speaking from my own Filipino American point of view, just think of how the current dialogue of "illlegal immigrants" (don't we call it 'TNT'?) will be heightened?

Just think, it was even hard to get a Hawaiian in office and people still demand a copy of Obama's birth certificate.

I can only speak from the American side because our people who've experienced the Philippine system, at the end of the day, truly have the expertise to decide what is best for themselves.

In terms of US policy----I could see more debates rising in terms of social services, the issue of wealth disparity & universal healthcare will sky rocket.

For example------How will the US dollar equalize the Philippine peso system?

There will be strong advocacy against accepting the Muslim autonomous region. And there will be more incentive for more American corporations to carve out and gentrify places like Bohol's Chocolate Hills as our Appalachian Mountains faces. My main point is power relationships will always exist. That's my reality seeing different the development of different parts of the United States. The South rural disinvestment to the industrial north, rising cost of living in US cities, will be magnified in a place that will model the statehood of Hawaii's "paradise".

On the other hand, I feel the US can learn so much from the Cooperative and participatory democracy models of the Philippines. I was sharing in my blog how even after Hurricane Katrina, we were arguing for similar region-wide legislation like the 1991 LGU code for the recovery of our cities like New Orleans and Mississippi Coast. Local entities had no control of the Federal money for those intended.

Leo, about your question on the equalizing of the Dollar with the Peso:

The Netherlands also has oversees possesisons, particularly in the Caribbean. The islands of Curacao and Bonaire as well as Aruba are Dutch dependencies, and in these islands, they use the Antillen Guilder, which has an exchange rate of 1 US dollar = 1.75 Antillean Guilder.

Though the Netherlands is part of the EU, the Euro isn't used in these islands as monetary unit. And the island of Bonaire, was ratified and declared a municipality of the Netherlands. They still use the Guilder, and the language spoken is Dutch, Papamientu (local dialect) as well as English and Spanish.

Interesting tho, eh?

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #253 on:** April 14, 2009, 09:54:41 AM »

the logic and simple as it is is:

every american gun made either in cebu or masachusettes. the inventor got a share of it called a royalty fee.

it only happen that here in mindanao they use m16s to terrorized the pipol and use them for kidnapping. it's the americans m16s not AKs. thats the point.

why talking about the russians and the Chinese! Jesus!!!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #254 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:18:14 AM »

Buwad, the Chinese and Russians sell AK 47s to afghans, to Arab fundamentalists, to Indonesia as well as Malaysia. They sell weapons that kill in Africa as well, where civil wars are plenty.

Thats the point, Buwad. An entire continuum of the world practices arms sales. You can't blame one nation without expecting to blame the others that are responsible for the same policies.

In the end, the blame should be placed on those who utilize the weapons for means of terrorizing. America is not to blame when the Abu Sayyaf and the MNLF kidnap Filipinos and foreigners and have them ransomed. America should not be blamed for the murderings of such terrorist groups.

The one to be blamed, Buwad, is the Abu Sayyaf and the MNLF and other terrorist groups that precipitate such wanton violence and inhumane acts.

Again, your argument is moot.

You're simply playing the blame game. To which I do not agree.

Cheers,

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #255 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:20:05 AM »

the logic and simple as it is is:

every american gun made either in cebu or masachusettes. the inventor got a share of it called a royalty fee.

it only happen that here in mindanao they use m16s to terrorized the pipol and use them for kidnapping. it's the americans m16s not AKs. thats the point.

why talking about the russians and the Chinese! Jesus!!!

Buwad, please do not use the Lord's name in vain.

If you want to debate, debate simply. Don't involve the LORD in any of your usage.

Thank You.

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #256 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:24:10 AM »

its not a blame game my frend its a fact! and those american guns and bullets that killed innocent civilians here in our country are made from america.

this issue is undebatable.

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #257 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:25:23 AM »

i'm not in vain nor feel it. i ask Gods blessing that a brother may wake up in his hard headedness!

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #258 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:26:02 AM »

a pure american!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #259 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:33:30 AM »

its not a blame game my frend its a fact! and those american guns and bullets that killed innocent civilians here in our country are made from america.

this issue is undebatable.

Arms sales is an ongoing phenomenon, my friend. The NATO allies engage in it, so does the United States, so too does the Chinese and the Russians. In the world of global geopolitics and strategic interests, military sales are provided for by nations that can afford sales. Its a business, i am not in defense of such sales, but am merely implying that it is a system in place.

We live in a capitalistic society, Buwad. A society that embraces mercantilism. We don't live in a pacificistic society, though I wish we did so that violence wouldn't be observed.

But the world we live in follows in a capitalistic model. Even the Chinese, which is a politically communist, has already embraced capitalism (which is actually on contrary to pure communist manifest).

There are individuals in this world that do things for a profit, and sadly, there are even American companies, British companies, Japanese companies, Chinese companies, Germany companies even Filipino military companies that sell arms to make a profit.

In the end, what the buyer does with the weapons is the limiting factor. The United States sells arms (officially) to friendly nations, but what the buyer does with arms is at the discretion of the buyer nation.

When a buyer nation purchases American arms, that buyer nation takes and assumes responsibility what it does with it. Either it uses it its own military or if it chooses to snuggle it to provide arms to insurrectionists is at the discretion of the buyer nation.

Please don't take this to heart. Its just simple dialogue.

God Bless you, Buwad.

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #260 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:39:51 AM »

i know it, the world know it regarding these arms sales. but were only discussing about the mindanao/philippine situation and those m16s that the murderers, kidnappers and terrorist are using.

isn't it shameful being a proud and a good american?

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #261 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:42:08 AM »

come to philippines and if youre kidnap here. im sure theyl be using colt45s and m16s.

thats for sure!

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #262 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:43:36 AM »

i know it, the world know it regarding these arms sales. but were only discussing about the mindanao/philippine situation and those m16s that the murderers, kidnappers and terrorist are using.

isn't it shameful being a proud and a good american?

We're discussing the entire issue, because it relegates to the issue. The Philippine case scenario is but one example of the global phenomenon, Buwad.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #263 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:45:04 AM »

come to philippines and if youre kidnap here. im sure theyl be using colt45s and m16s.

thats for sure!

Buwad, lets get back to the topic. And of course I will come back to the Philippines. Its my Fatherland.

I'm just a simple, average, Filipino-American.

Of Valenciano roots.

Sige, lets get back to topic.

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #264 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:53:11 AM »

the topic? since this had been posted, my postings are a BIG NO! NO WAY! AM NOT EVEN THINKING ABOUT IT!

LETS FORGET THIS ISSUE LOR.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #265 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:55:51 AM »

Buwad, and I respect your view. As you have the right to share your view. From reading your posts, we all learn from different perspectives. It adds balance to our views.

Let others share their views on this topic, kai interesting kaayo.

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fdaray · « **Reply #266 on:** April 14, 2009, 10:58:16 AM »

Lorenzo, you're a Filipino- American. At this time, are you having dual citizenship.?

What is the point of view of this topic? Does it mean that we will adopt for statehood to the USA.?

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #267 on:** April 14, 2009, 11:03:17 AM »

Lorenzo, you're a Filipino- American. At this time, are you having dual citizenship.?

What is the point of view of this topic? Does it mean that we will adopt for statehood to the USA.?

The reason I posted this topic was because I had a dialogue with a friend of mine some months ago regarding the benefits of American protectorateship and/or statehood. My friend is Puerto Rican, and Puerto Rico is an American protectorate, meaning all Puerto Ricans are American citizens. Thought hey have local autonomy, self governance is ensured. Spanish is spoken culture maintained.

I merely wanted to ask the Boholano community, and the Filipino community at large how they felt on the issue. That issue being, Philippine's entry into the United States.

I wanted to hear their views, the pros and the cons.

To answer your question, Mr. Daray, yes I am an American Citizen. I maintain my dual citizenship. I had the choice of relinquishing my Philippine Citizenship when I acquired American citizenship over a decade ago, but I chose to keep it.

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TOPAC · « **Reply #268 on:** April 14, 2009, 12:30:10 PM »

buwad, lor, ngani ra ni ka-simple:

kung walay america, walay terrorista!

amen.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #269 on:** April 14, 2009, 01:19:31 PM »

Interesting point, Tito.
Sure, I see your point.

Even if America fell tomorrow, there would be another super power to replace her.
And surely, that power would have to hurdle the same problem.

There will always be an antagonist to a protagonist.

As there is a ying for every yang. (Ying-Yang confucian concept)

Since time immemorial, every power will always have those that opposed it.

The Romans had the barbarians
The Greeks had the Persians
The Hebrews had the Babylonians/Egyptians
The British had the French
The French had the Germans
etc,

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #270 on:** April 15, 2009, 10:18:28 AM »

you got it bulls eye calls! AMEEEEN!!!

I cant wait China to lead the world than these lazy drunkard americans. Sorry my language but its true in one way or the other.

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fdaray · « **Reply #271 on:** April 15, 2009, 11:43:52 AM »

The Philippines the next 51st state of USA in an impossible dream.

Ang mga bayani nagpatulo sa ilang dugo ug gibuhis nila ang ilang kinabuhi
aron maangkon ang kagawasan .

Magpaulipon pa ba ta ug balik sa nga langyaw.?

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buwadsanga · « **Reply #272 on:** April 15, 2009, 12:02:03 PM »

DAKONG MAO fDARAY!

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windgate · « **Reply #273 on:** April 15, 2009, 12:56:03 PM »

Magpaulipon pa ba ta ug balik sa nga langyaw.?

kay unsa man diay nang mga intsik nga gihinayninayan na man ta ug ulipon...

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TOPAC · « **Reply #274 on:** April 15, 2009, 01:10:24 PM »

Interesting point, Tito.
Sure, I see your point.

Even if America fell tomorrow, there would be another super power to replace her.
And surely, that power would have to hurdle the same problem.

There will always be an antagonist to a protagonist.

As there is a ying for every yang. (Ying-Yang confucian concept)

Since time immemorial, every power will always have those that opposed it.

The Romans had the barbarians
The Greeks had the Persians
The Hebrews had the Babylonians/Egyptians
The British had the French
The French had the Germans
etc,

I don't see terrorists as antagonists of america.

in one way or another, they rose and fought because they were victims of america's dominion and oppression.

terrorists never challenge america's being a superpower. they challenge america's superpower attitude.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #275 on:** April 18, 2009, 10:40:03 AM »

This topic is an interesting one, albeit it has garnished varying opinions, for pro to con, to even personal views that are outside the subject matter.

One reason for the conduction of this thread was for a paper that a colleague of mine was doing, and he has tallied the votes, which will be used as a data source for a continuum of data regarding his paper.

I will provide a synopsis of the paper when it is finished.

The varied points of view from members of the forum, be they Filipinos in the Philippines, Fil-Ams, Fil-Canadians, Fil-Aussies and Fil-Euros have been superfluous.

And it reflects the varied points of view.

Thank you all for sharing, and for all future readers, confer your point of view on the original question.

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Lorenzo · « **Reply #276 on:** April 18, 2009, 10:43:49 AM »

The majority of voters voted for American inclusion, with some who opposed inclusion. While a substantial few voted "not sure"

This data poll is excellent.

Again, thanks!

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glacier_71 · « **Reply #277 on:** April 19, 2009, 07:22:16 AM »

kining 9 nga mibotar og NO, basi'g mobali pa ni og ma US Green Card Holder na. hehehe

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jamo2x · « **Reply #278 on:** May 16, 2009, 04:14:55 AM »

aw, abi ko bag himoon na ang Bohol og 51st state sa states. hehe. apply na tag kog green card. atot ba

ang problema, nahimo man daw tang US territory sama sa puerto rico, ngano wa ma ni ma padayon?

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Macky Ferniz · « **Reply #279 on:** May 16, 2009, 07:17:20 AM »

Maayo unta ug magpasakop na lang ta sa US kay sa usbon atong constitution.

Kung magpasakop ta sa US, puede ta mo migrate sa USA ug mopalit ug property didto.

Apan kung usbon atong constitution, mahurot atong yuta ug baligya sa mga foreigner, unya mo abot ang panahon nga wala nay yuta ang atong future generation, so magpa ulipon na lang sa mga dagko nga land lords nga mga foreigners.

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